Anderton
The workflow, interface, and unique features that other DAWs don't have.
Ahh, i see.
You are aware that I can wipe my ass with any brand of toilet paper, aren't you? LOL; so what exactly are you referring to? Are you suggesting that Sonar has reinvented the wheel? Considering that 99% of songs on the charts have not been made with Sonar, what unique feature (as you say) in Sonar would have made world-class songs in the charts better? I'm really dying to find-out just exactly what these so-called unique features are.
What do you think would happen if you said to Pro Tools users or Fruityloop users or Cubase users or Ableton Live users "features that other DAWs don't have". They would rightly laugh at you, correct? Unique features you say? Oh, are they so unique that world-class music hasn't been or can't be released without Sonar, or that any song likely to be released or cannot be accomplished without some enigmatic unique feature in Sonar as you call it? You're simply making no sense whatsoever to me!
Anderton
You really can't generalize that much. Some people buy software for the provided plug-ins, some already have Waves plugs and Komplete and couldn't care less what a DAW includes.
If then, as you have just inferred, Sonar has superior workflow, how come the most popular and widely-used DAWs in the world are NOT SONAR????????????????? And if included plugins are inconsequential to the buyers as you suggest, then why do so many Sonar users inquire so intently about future forthcoming Sonar updates and ask about what new plugins will be added, and why do you and Cakewalk bother to provide any at all if these are not important? Shall i answer for you? Because "value added" perceptions are 'indeed' very much part of it, regardless of whether users or potential customers already own several preferred plugins, that's why!
Anderton
Just as you say you don't use loops, I don't use presets; I can see where others would find them useful points of departure if they don't know how to create their own sounds. But I think programmers are going to drift toward creating new sounds for something like z3ta 2 because it's more relevant. I'm pretty sure PSYN is DirectX so there's little point in doing new development for it.
You seem to be suggesting that Z3TA+ has got all bases covered, as if PSYN II and Pentagon are not relevant, strange perception i reckon, but you may need to think again, how on earth is "drifting toward" creating new sounds for Z3TA+ "more relevant"? I asked for an overhaul of the PSYN and Pentagon synth engines, thus we would have three total synths to work with in Sonar right off the bat, correct; in whose mind is it more relevant to make sounds only for Z3TA+ and ignore the others, and why doesn't every EDM producer in the world just use Z3TA+ and get rid of everything else? I don't understand your reasoning, especially when all your comments seem geared toward promoting Sonar under any circumstance, admitting nothing from others criticisms of Sonar, and denying everything else. Yep, it seems i've got "stupid" written on my forehead LOL
Anderton
I think you're missing a very important point. Groove Agent sells for $180. Presumably, that's because it takes time and effort to develop. Similarly, creating new plug-ins requires time and effort. You're not going to get these for free, so if the price of SONAR went up by $200 to pay for creating these new plug-ins for a very specific audience, then anyone who doesn't do EDM is going to say "Screw paying $700 for SONAR, I don't need effing Groove Agent, I'm getting something else."
And yet we have many plugins inside DAWs that apparently are 'free' by your reckoning, so apparently you are wrong. The large majority of plugins inside Sonar have long been paid for and no longer incur cost
and therefore Sonar in it's current state is akin to a money-making tree in one sense. If these things cost money, then how all the latest additions? Didn't they cost money???????? So why aren't we being required to pay more money for those? You reckon it needs money to provide these, seeing as how you wanna wax lyrical about the finer-points of cost LOL
And how come Cubase users didn't complain about the overbloated price of Cubase, did they say "Screw paying $700 for Cubase" (which is what it costs in Australia), and they knew that they were getting Groove Agent LE. How come Logic Pro X comes standard with some necessary plugins that Sonar doesn't have? How come Frutyloops users get free updates for life??? How come Mixcraft Pro 7 is riddled with sounds and a multitude of plugins and only costs $89? Because clearly you're overstating the cost factor, that's why! There's more than one way to skin a cat, and the price of a DAW is not directly related to development costs of plugins! Let's tell the people some truth around here shall we! Why would a drum-machine or three plugins cause a price-rise of $200 to all buyers of Sonar? The price of a DAW is related more to how much money the DAW company think they can save while still garnering sales, and that's the primary driver behind the price, what little can they spend why still competing with the other DAWs, it's all 'perception based' selling, like everything else in the world. An iPhone 6 costs a grand total of exactly $245 to manufacture (that's a fact) and yet it sells for $800 outright, NOTHING TO DO WITH PRODUCTION COSTS!!!. Companies command their own profit margins based on what they think they can get away with and what they think market value of the DAW is, in other words it's based on the universal supply-and-demand principle of all trade. For a closer analysis, lets say 5,000 Sonar users by $200 extra (as you say); that equates to one million dollars, right? Well i can tell everyone reading this that it does not take $1,000,000 to produce three plugins, or just a sampled-based drum-machine plugin, that's for certain, so you're actually quite misleading in your assertions, unless you can prove that making three fairly basic plugins will require $1,000, 000, and i know it doesn't. I could design and produce a software drum-machine with a big palette of 24bit samples for $5000, so what indeed are you on about???
Anderton
6: A dedicated ARP on-par with the one in Logic Pro X, 'integrated' into each channel.
What do the Logic ARPs have SONAR's dedicated arps (that are integrated in each channel) don't have?
Much, actually!
Anderton
Again, consider how much it costs to develop a new instrument, create a new core library, hire sound designers and programmers to create presets...that's going to add a lot to the cost of SONAR. It's better for Cakewalk and uses alike to develop a separate instrument and make it available for sale to those who want it
But many here have already made it known that they would like Dimension Pro to be updated, it is obvious that the stock sounds are not world-class, so why does Cakewalk keeping shipping this 7 year old Dimension Pro thingy mijig? And as i've already expressed, creating a new core library in a rompler is not as expensive as you would have us believe. Economies of scale would recoup the cost while still boding well for Sonar sales overall. Truth be known, this is really all about Cakewalk essentially saying that this is a DAW for Guitar fiddlers and Trumpet blowers and EP players, and not for EDM producers. So why do you keep resorting to this faulty line of reasoning? Many users of Sonar would be happy to have my suggested plugins onboard, they are relevant and prime fundamentals for EDM, so are you saying that Sonar does not really cater to EDM, and thus my OP? Users of any DAW have the right to say what they desire to see in their DAW, this is well-known, so does Cakewalk have a problem with users mentioning such things? I notice you like to appear as though you always know better, Mr Anderton, and you like to have the last say on any matter as if we have it all wrong, and i'm getting sick and tired of it quite frankly, so shall we leave this here for all to see, and see if you or i get validated by public opinion, and in the meantime maybe you can leave your incessant retorts out of it for a while??