200bpm
...and who (rightly) feel that by bringing visibility to problems it may provide faster solutions (bug fixes, etc).

 
This has happened often, many fixes have been implemented specifically due to user feedback that was presented in a way where something could be done with the information. I've started threads about problems I've encountered and asked other people to confirm; many times, the info I presented wasn't enough for Cakewalk to reproduce the problem, but the info that others added DID provide enough data and fixes could be made. That is one of the main values of a forum.
 
I think a lot of what may be seen as "intolerance" is probably closer to "impatience." There are so many threads that have started out with "SONAR broken!! Filled with BUGS!!' where the problem has been pilot error or something like wi-fi or power-saving features enabled on a laptop, but people came here and ranted instead of just spending a minute with Google and finding the solution. That's understandable; we all want answers NOW. But for those who are professionals or veteran users and need answers to problems that actually ARE related to SONAR, the "rant" posts just increase the noise-to-signal ratio and serve no useful purpose. They don't contribute to others' knowledge, or present enough info to allow for assistance. In that respect, they do a disservice to those who have also spent their hard-earned money on this software.
 
Ultimately I think the solution is a checklist of "Before you start a thread about a problem, check the following" and it would include all the basic non-SONAR-related sources of problems - disable unneeded drivers, don't expect miracles with ASIO4ALL, disable wi-fi, check for updated interface drivers, why graphics card drivers matter, plug your interface into the same USB port each time, how to check whether your devices exceed MIDI port limits in Windows, etc. 
 
We all understand that computer-based systems, software, and SONAR can be frustrating sometimes. So can people in forums, including users and moderators. And it's possible to jump to wrong conclusions based on inadequate data, which is why I apologized. But the important issue of this thread is a finding a solution to JohnBonesDoe's problem, because I don't think he's having the same kind of experience as most SONAR users and we can probably figure out why.
 

robert_e_bone
To the forum members - after the initial response to his initial post, and the OP not returning, I did some digging and located a Face Book page for him, and he and I exchanged several good messages, where I explained why several folks had judged his post to be likely trolling (though several also had expressed not being sure), and my intent was to communicate that if he was willing to engage the Sonar forum again with separate threads for each of whatever issues he was having, that there REALLY are a whole bunch of folks in the forum community that will help him, and I see here that he has indeed come back to get some assistance.
 
Also, Andrew Rossa was the one that had removed all of those other posts from his original post, because of all the folks hammering him because of the initial rant.  He indicated that to me in a PM yesterday, which I also passed on to the OP, so he knew the real reasons behind those posts having been removed.
 
I think all should be in good shape now, moving in a MUCH better direction so let's get him squared away.
 
Oh, and lastly - I DID go back in and review each and every post that was made by folks in response to the original thread - with the initial rant, and I just wanted to comment that despite the comments in this thread about the forum hosts and thought police and all of that, not a single post by any of the forum hosts blasted the original poster - each post had been along the lines that while someone coming in and ranting without detail or seemingly not seeking any assistance was 'silly' (quoting there on the silly), they all went on to also indicate that it was entirely possible that the OP WAS a legitimate poster with real issues - and had just not actually gotten into any of the details in that initial rant.
 
As it turned out, that WAS the case, and after some discussion with the original poster through my private FB messages, explaining the whole reaction by a bunch of forum members to his initial rant, and asking him to give it another shot - indeed we are here, and moving on to try to assist him with fixing his issues.
 
Thanks to ALL for being willing to work through the issues for this forum member, and thanks to the OP for returning to give us the opportunity to try to DO the problem resolution with you.
 
Bob Bone
 

well done Bob

The outcome of a post will be due to how that post is perceived. A lot depends on the approach an OP makes. No one is so wise that they are able to sit back and read what is in the heart of another. We can only judge by what is laid before us. One may ask why should we judge another?  We do so all the the time. Its part of being human. We always come to a conclusion even if its based on faulty information. This forum is no different from the wider world except here people give of their time in order to help other users.  Often they put a high premium on what they do because it is important to them. A poster has to view this forum as they would any gathering. You don't attack on first appearance. That in any culture is rude. A response that becomes an attack is unfortunate but understandable.
 
I have through out the years seen enormous goodness on displayed here. A welcome to a new member is often the first words given out. To think that a forum can always be so dispassionate that a poster ranting as an introduction will get a welcoming response is unreasonable.
 
Can we do better? I think we can. We should also alert new posters that there are easy ways to begin a dialog that will engender good will and a pleasant time.  This forum thrives on dialog, a giving and taking. When a poster leaves no room for dialog bad things happen.  

"A response that becomes an attack is unfortunate but understandable."
 
Answering "rudeness" with more rudeness (attacking the poster as a troll), does not serve the forum or it's members.
It just makes the responder feel like he is better than the troll.
Sorry John, I don't understand it. I do understand the frustration, and I do understand the desire to tell someone he is a jerk. But, giving in to those desires does not enhance the community. It only boosts ones ego.
 
Thanks Bob, for reaching out to the OP, I don't think he would have ever come back if you didn't.

Alright... I was in that thread but now we have details. That's the way to do things.
 
You say you use an HP. So is this one of those prebuilt/preloaded dealies?
 
If so those are crammed with intrusive bloatware and Windows is usually set up in it's usual ridiculous way.
 
First thing to do is remove any and all bloatware from the system that you do not intend to use. Use a program called CCleaner to do this because much of that sutff can be extremely stubborn.
 
Second go into your Control Panel and get to the Power Mangament options (sorry... I have never used Win8 nor do I intend to. I am on 7 so you'll have to find this stuff on your own or ask the other members here).
 
You absolutely must set your power settings to Performance. You are likely on Balanced or Energy saver or whatever. This turns things on and off to save power but the this is NO good for any streaming data stuff like audio or video. More specifically you should go into your advanced settings and make sure your...
 
1) Hard and/or Solid State drives are Always On or set to max or whatever
 
2) Your USB ports are set to NEVER fall asleep
 
3) Your CPU and pretty much everything else is set to NEVER fall asleep
 
4) Windows is set to NEVER fall asleep or dim the screen or do ANYTHING without you telling it to do so.
 
You want everything going full blast at all times. If you use the system for other stuff and do not like that behavior then I think you can create a seperate user account for a more conservative power management setup but any time you are doing audio you want EVERYTHING awake and ready at ALL times.
 
Now let's take a look at your interface. PreSonus makes decent stuff. Not sure about your interface but hopefully it uses ASIO drivers. If not (read your manual to find out) then you shoudl think about investing in one that does. I recommend Focusrite products and personally use a Scarlett 18i6 which is rock solid.
 
Anyway... if your PreSonus has the option for ASIO be sure it is actually using the ASIO driver. You do this in Sonar's Edit > Preferences > Audio-Devices section.
 
Sonar works best in ASIO mode.
 
What antivirus are you using? Those prebuilt systems usually come with Mcaffee or Norton trials. They suck for audio and they kind of suck for AV too. You have to make a decision whether you want to use this system for general internet stuff AND audio or if you can use the system exclusively for audio. If it is the latter I recommend removing the pre installed AV and installing Microsoft Security Essentials. MSE is much less resource intensive and offers good protection. I have heard Win 8 uses Defender as an AV but I would really trust that.
 
Either way and no matter what AV you are using taking the system offline and disabling the antivirus' "Real Time Protection" will make things run a LOT smoother. However you can also simply add any and all Cakewalk and audio related files and programs to your AV's whitelist. People say this doesn't matter anymore but I notice a massive performance boost when I disable real time protection. I also do not use my DAW for any online stuff aside from snagging software updates so whatever... balance your performance and security needs accordingly.
 
You should also figure out what kind of hard drives you have. SSD (Solid State Drive) for you program drive is great. If the system has Hard Disk Drives though and they came preloaded you have to see how fast they are and hopefully they are not the dreaded "Green" drives.
 
Ideally you want at least 7200rpm drives. Green drives, even if they are fast, are designed to fall asleep to save energy and are not ideal for audio. If you find out your drives are low speed or green drives you should consider replacing them. As I said SSD drives are gonna work but are more expensive. For HDD replacements you'll wanna snag stuff like Barracudas or Caviar Black drives (do a google search to learn more about those).
 
Finally be sure to check your interface and disk drive buffer setting. You can check your interface buffers via the interface software (or sometimes via the ASIO panel button in Sonar Preferences but that isn't as reliable... better to ust figure out how to open your interface software). For recording you want low latency so you set the buffers low (if you expereince dropouts or crashes there are tricks within the project you can do such as freezing tracks but that bridge can be crossed later) and for EVERYTHING else such as editing, mixing, exporting or whatever you crank those buffers.
 
For you your hardrive buffers, in Sonar go to Edit > Preferences > Audio - Sync and Caching then increase your Record and Playback buffers (default is 256 IIRC... turn them up to 512 or more as needed).
 
You can keep an eye on your CPU, RAM and HDD usage by inserting the Performance Module into the Control Bar in Sonar. Look it up in the manual to see how it works (this post is already wicked long so... whatevs). That will show you what is being maxed out and give you an idea what you may need to tweak, freeze or simply not do.
 
There... tons of info for you. Get busy.
 
Also if you want more info on system optimization I personally used the Sweetwater System Optimization Guide (google it). There are a couple things in that that do not play nice with Sonar (file caching I think) but the tips about making hardware not fall asleep and disabling startup programs is gold.
 
Cheers and good liuck.

Lookit... it's the internet. If you freakout and act like a jerk you're gonna get called on it especially if no one knows who the heck you are. This is an extremely tolerant place compared to most forums. The guy apologized and has given some details. Let's move on and hopefully get the guy up and running.
 
Peace.
 

John
Can we do better? I think we can.

Me too. In any communications snafu, it takes two to tango.
 
We all learn because if we don't, then we don't improve.
 
Obviously the OP has learned that it's probably not a good idea to come into a forum and rant without asking for assistance, and from now on I'm going to assume rant posts are from frustrated newbies and not agenda posters from competitors.

Another consideration is it would be helpful if people could give some idea of their level of expertise. Some people have been insulted because I've suggested extremely basic solutions, and that made me less likely to offer those...which prevented me from helping someone earlier in the process when it did turn out to be a fairly basic problem.
 
For example if someone was an X2 user who upgraded to X3 and is having problems with Platinum, it's likely the problem will be different compared to "Hi, I just bought my first PC..."
 

jatoth
"A response that becomes an attack is unfortunate but understandable."
 
Answering "rudeness" with more rudeness (attacking the poster as a troll), does not serve the forum or it's members.
It just makes the responder feel like he is better than the troll.
Sorry John, I don't understand it. I do understand the frustration, and I do understand the desire to tell someone he is a jerk. But, giving in to those desires does not enhance the community. It only boosts ones ego.
 
Thanks Bob, for reaching out to the OP, I don't think he would have ever come back if you didn't.

If this were a perfect world things would be much better. I'm not so perfect that I can't understand the responses of some on the OPs original thread. We also need to be tolerant of those that did speak out against the rant too.
 
It goes both ways. We can learn from this or we can dig in on our positions never letting the other any room for compromise.   

Anderton
Another consideration is it would be helpful if people could give some idea of their level of expertise. Some people have been insulted because I've suggested extremely basic solutions, and that made me less likely to offer those...which prevented me from helping someone earlier in the process when it did turn out to be a fairly basic problem.
 
For example if someone was an X2 user who upgraded to X3 and is having problems with Platinum, it's likely the problem will be different compared to "Hi, I just bought my first PC..."
 

Don't change a damned thing. The onus is on the OP to explain their situation. Not the guy who's been helping n00bs, pros and everyone in between for what? 30 years? More?
 
They should bloody thankful a guy like you is even willing to talk to them.
 
And yes I realize that may tick off certain people but come the frack on! If I'm a guest in someone's pro studio asking the experienced engineers for advice I'm not gonna throw a hissy fit if they don't twist their arse in a knot to bow down to me and anticipate all my potential skills and/or deficiencies. It's ludicrous.