Steve_Karl
No problem Michael. :-)
Other questions that comes to mind:
What actually was sold to BL as Cakewalk intellectual property?
Does it include SPLAT?
Would it be in violation of the agreement between BL and Gibson for BL to release and authorization patch for pre CbB versions?
A clear answer to the above would end a lot of discussion.

 
BL in effect bought SPLAT and the name Cakewalk, and other assets BL felt would make sense to accompany those. Gibson are left with a non-trading shell subsidiary 'empty' of those assets and that subsidiary can either stay dormant or be liquidated to tidy things away, depending on whether there are reasons to let it continue as non-trading, e.g. tax losses being carried forward for offset somewhere else in the group.  The sale agreement would have stipulated that Gibson can do nothing to prejudice BandLab's commercial use of the assets it bought, so no, there is in effect no 'pre CbB' version of what used to be called Sonar Platinum.  It is no longer exists.  It is late software.  It has gone to join the choir eternal.  All that exists now is the DAW called Cakewalk by BandLab.
 
Owners of the old Sonar Platinum can keep using it for as long as they wish, but it will never be patched, augmented or any other way maintained.
 

sharke
...this is stuff that we agree to when we purchase a license and install the program. You went in with open eyes and were quite entitled to reject Cakewalk's offer and purchase another DAW license instead. 

 
Your eyes may have been open, but you didn't have any choice. The "Terms of Service/End User License Agreement" has always been a corporate escape clause. They're all the same and nobody reads them because if you don't like it, you can't use the software you just bought, and in most cases you can't get your money back, either. If there were any justice, these so-called contracts would all be classified as "coerced" and invalid.
 

sharke
This forum is a form of social media. People meet here collectively, they communicate, share ideas, post songs, offer comments, goof off, post interesting articles and generally do everything that you can do on any other social media platform. It's just a "venue" and you can either lurk or participate. BandLab is no different in that respect.

Here's the difference: This forum is very small. Scraping our data and targeting ads to us based on our participation here would cost more than you could possibly earn. Bandlab is quite large. The CEO says it's a social media site, and they are offering enticements for free, so I expect some sharing or selling of my data.
 
That said, I have no problem with the Bandlab involvement here. Meng has shown an admirable attitude toward the whole thing, which is reassuring, and I had ~4 months to make other DAW arrangements in case this goes south, so I'll happily use SONAR and/or Cakewalk by Bandlab until I'm no longer getting value. My credit card info went to Cleverbridge, not Cakewalk or Bandlab, and as a Facebook user I can't imagine that a "social music network" could target me in a more offensive or intrusive way than Facebook does. Besides, when you have Equifax managing your financial information, why worry about Bandlab? 
 
PS: James - This is not an attack and I hope you don't read it that way.

bitflipper

...I understand a lot of older people have this innate mistrust and/or hatred of social media

That's because we old people are the last generation to have experienced both worlds: before and after social media. Younger people have no basis for comparison. They are far less likely to value privacy, because they've grown up in a world where it never existed. In another generation everyone will know everything about everyone else, and it'll be viewed as completely normal.
 

This is, in fact, Mark Zuckerberg's stated objective for Facebook.
 

I find it very exciting with nothing to loose.
Gibson the betrayers are no more and we are in good hands with everything to gain
with Bandlab.
The big difference is Bandlab is not a huge comglomerate and is much more personable.
To me it equates to more certainty about the future of our DAW.
We are dealing direct to Meng.
It is a very exciting era for Cakewalk!
 
 

Larry Jones

sharke
...this is stuff that we agree to when we purchase a license and install the program. You went in with open eyes and were quite entitled to reject Cakewalk's offer and purchase another DAW license instead. 

 
Your eyes may have been open, but you didn't have any choice. The "Terms of Service/End User License Agreement" has always been a corporate escape clause. They're all the same and nobody reads them because if you don't like it, you can't use the software you just bought, and in most cases you can't get your money back, either. If there were any justice, these so-called contracts would all be classified as "coerced" and invalid.
 

sharke
This forum is a form of social media. People meet here collectively, they communicate, share ideas, post songs, offer comments, goof off, post interesting articles and generally do everything that you can do on any other social media platform. It's just a "venue" and you can either lurk or participate. BandLab is no different in that respect.

Here's the difference: This forum is very small. Scraping our data and targeting ads to us based on our participation here would cost more than you could possibly earn. Bandlab is quite large. The CEO says it's a social media site, and they are offering enticements for free, so I expect some sharing or selling of my data.
 
That said, I have no problem with the Bandlab involvement here. Meng has shown an admirable attitude toward the whole thing, which is reassuring, and I had ~4 months to make other DAW arrangements in case this goes south, so I'll happily use SONAR and/or Cakewalk by Bandlab until I'm no longer getting value. My credit card info went to Cleverbridge, not Cakewalk or Bandlab, and as a Facebook user I can't imagine that a "social music network" could target me in a more offensive or intrusive way than Facebook does. Besides, when you have Equifax managing your financial information, why worry about Bandlab? 
 
PS: James - This is not an attack and I hope you don't read it that way.

I think what people forget about "data scraping" though is that they can only scrape data that you provide for them. It's quite possible to sign up to Facebook with a false name and offer them no personal information whatsoever. If companies are willing to pay for a data point which says that I, some unidentifiable rando with a false name, am interested in cats and steam engines, then good luck to them. 
 
Personally I don't have a problem with Facebook mining my data because I've never harbored any delusion about it being even the slightest bit private. I log into the site completely aware of what parts of my profile are public, and although others' mileage may vary, I actually have no problem with companies targeting ads at me based on my Facebook activity. I've tried to feel paranoid about it, but I just can't. If they somehow managed to get my medical records or my banking details from it, I'd be worried. 
 
I think the point I'm getting at is that the modern digital information age comes with a few caveats that everyone has a personal responsibility to protect themselves against. In cases where you're worried about being tracked online, use anonymous accounts and/or make a conscious effort to restrict the amount of personal information linked to that account. 
 

bitflipper

...I understand a lot of older people have this innate mistrust and/or hatred of social media

That's because we old people are the last generation to have experienced both worlds: before and after social media. Younger people have no basis for comparison. They are far less likely to value privacy, because they've grown up in a world where it never existed. In another generation everyone will know everything about everyone else, and it'll be viewed as completely normal.
 

Lol...enough with the old. I'm only 42, and I grew up in a world without social media. I also am the first generation to grow up with a computer - I've used and owned computer since I was 10.

Social media is a problem...but only if you don't understand all the mechanisms. In that if you don't understand that it's a tool, much like our hand held computers...then we become tools of the tools :). Furthermore, social media really has taken the place of the talking heads and the nightly news. If you use social media properly...you free yourself from the talking heads and learn to analyse facts and data and form your own opinions...you know you learn to think for yourself.

Ben

bitflipper

Leadfoot
The big difference now is that offline Splat users are pretty much out of luck when it comes to updating to CbB...

A temporary problem. Noel has promised that an offline registration option will be forthcoming, and I have complete faith in Noel's word. Don't fall prey to the FOMO syndrome. Given that this first version of CbB is essentially the last release of Platinum, you're not missing out on anything by holding off a bit.

 
I think Noel said offline reg would be available if online activation was made unavailable. Seeing that owners of Platinum were gifted it when Gibson offloaded (vsts in platinum but not in bandlab too) I don't see why Platinum even needs an activation code now given than bandlab is free.
 
edit: owners of platinum should open a bandlab account with same email so vsts carry over
 

sharke
I think what people forget about "data scraping" though is that they can only scrape data that you provide for them. It's quite possible to sign up to Facebook with a false name and offer them no personal information whatsoever. If companies are willing to pay for a data point which says that I, some unidentifiable rando with a false name, am interested in cats and steam engines, then good luck to them.

No, the data mining involves gathering information about your Facebook "friends,' their likes and dislikes and what sites they visit and what they buy. Most of them are signed up under their real names, too, and their locations are logged by IP address. Your connection with them means something. Cross-domain cookies alert the Facebook Machine what you (and your "friends") are Googling, Bing-ing, Yahoo-ing, etc., so they can put together a profile of you even if you are pretty careful. And if just one person wishes you a happy birthday or congrats on graduating college or the like, that gets added to the profile. In the end, all they don't know is your real name.
 
This is still no big deal to me. But I think these giant companies need to be reigned in a little regarding selling ads to the KGB in an election year.

Larry Jones

sharke
I think what people forget about "data scraping" though is that they can only scrape data that you provide for them. It's quite possible to sign up to Facebook with a false name and offer them no personal information whatsoever. If companies are willing to pay for a data point which says that I, some unidentifiable rando with a false name, am interested in cats and steam engines, then good luck to them.

No, the data mining involves gathering information about your Facebook "friends,' their likes and dislikes and what sites they visit and what they buy. Most of them are signed up under their real names, too, and their locations are logged by IP address. Your connection with them means something. Cross-domain cookies alert the Facebook Machine what you (and your "friends") are Googling, Bing-ing, Yahoo-ing, etc., so they can put together a profile of you even if you are pretty careful. And if just one person wishes you a happy birthday or congrats on graduating college or the like, that gets added to the profile. In the end, all they don't know is your real name.
 
This is still no big deal to me. But I think these giant companies need to be reigned in a little regarding selling ads to the KGB in an election year.

That's pretty much what I meant by "the data you provide for them." I've never been phased by companies knowing my purchase history. That ship sailed a long time ago with the invention of credit cards. Stuff like this is easily avoided by anyone who's worried about it - for instance, you can clear out your cookies every day, and you can use your browser's incognito mode to browse and shop without leaving a cookie trail. 

backwoods

bitflipper

Leadfoot
The big difference now is that offline Splat users are pretty much out of luck when it comes to updating to CbB...

A temporary problem. Noel has promised that an offline registration option will be forthcoming, and I have complete faith in Noel's word. Don't fall prey to the FOMO syndrome. Given that this first version of CbB is essentially the last release of Platinum, you're not missing out on anything by holding off a bit.

I think Noel said offline reg would be available if online activation was made unavailable. Seeing that owners of Platinum were gifted it when Gibson offloaded (vsts in platinum but not in bandlab too) I don't see why Platinum even needs an activation code now given than bandlab is free.
 
edit: owners of platinum should open a bandlab account with same email so vsts carry over
 

My comment to that is that Platinum owners with the full paid up app also had a range of plugins that come with the package. Those plugins are not included in Version 24.04 released by BandLab. So it’s not an equal replacement from that perspective. While it’s true you can use your activated Splat plugins in CbB will that continue?
I don’t recall having read anything from Meng or Noel on that subject.