• SONAR
  • AudioSnap...worth the extra $100? (p.2)
2015/02/16 08:30:11
dwardzala
I think this is the difficulty in the new membership model.  There may be some features or content that you will value, that you don't know about right now.  We know drum replacer is coming for Platinum only, but that may or may not be of interest.  We don't know what else is on tap.
 
Vocal sync is also a platinum only feature that might be worth it if you need to edit vocals for timing or do ADR for video.
2015/02/16 09:05:02
FastBikerBoy
I record a group of people playing freely and then set the tempo approximately to the song played. The tempo invariably changes at the start and end of the tune.

 
That is something Audiosnap can do quite well. Invariably I want to add MIDI instruments or timing critical effects to a recording and the tempo map extraction method demo'd in the video I linked to earlier is perfect for that. (the second link is free btw) 
2015/02/16 10:09:17
Anderton
The way I usually use AudioSnap makes it indispensable to me. I set the Edit Filter to Transients, and adjust individual transients to line up things like guitar chords if I need them to hit right on the beat. This tip details the process. This tip gives some background about how to tweak AudioSnap's Transient Map.
 
I've also found AS useful for locking bass to drums.
 
Here are some articles on AudioSnap applications you might find helpful. They relate to older versions, but the capabilities are still there.
 
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/may10/articles/sonarnotes_0510.htm
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/mar07/articles/sonartech_0307.htm
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/nov11/articles/sonar-workshop-1111.htm
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/sep11/articles/sonar-tech-0911.htm
 
AudioSnap's effectiveness varies depending on the timing grid. It's very easy to use on something like a drum loop with defined transients, plucked or struck notes, etc. For sustained sounds, it's more fiddly. A good rule of thumb is that anything that's easy to convert into a REX or acidized file is a good candidate for AS.
 
FastBikerBoy
 I also wouldn't write off the prochannel as just another load of fx. If you've never used it not only do most, if not all of the modules sound great but there is a convenience there that you don't get with regular FX in the FX rack, although plugin recycling has improved that greatly with fx, with the prochannel they are already there to use without having to bother inserting them.



I agree that the ProChannel is about workflow as much as FX. But also, it has effects for which I don't have equivalents. The Tube distortion is outstanding when you add a slight growl to electric bass. The Console Emulator is generally very useful and the Tape Emulation can do very cool things with acoustic guitar, drums, and bass.
 
Platinum also gives the Blue Tubes effects, which are more "vintagey" if your tastes run along those lines.
2015/02/16 10:16:03
gswitz
@FBB, I was working to have the tempo follow the tune for a while until I noticed that lots of tempo-sync'd plugins do not handle tempo changes well.
 
For example the VX-64 Vocal Strip gives (gave?) a nasty pop every time the tempo changed. When you let the tempo adjust with the musicians this was disastrous. I don't know if it's still an issue, I just decided that for the tempo-sync'd FX, that pretty close was close enough for me. If the tempo doesn't change the FX work fine. I can set the tempo within 1 BPM or so and if the song picks up speed at the beginning or slows down at the end, the Sync'd Effect will just be a little off for that time. Oh well.
 
Its not worth my time to carefully vet every plugin on a project to make sure a tempo change doesn't cause an audible click.
2015/02/16 10:52:03
FastBikerBoy
gswitz
@FBB, I was working to have the tempo follow the tune for a while until I noticed that lots of tempo-sync'd plugins do not handle tempo changes well.
 
For example the VX-64 Vocal Strip gives (gave?) a nasty pop every time the tempo changed. When you let the tempo adjust with the musicians this was disastrous. I don't know if it's still an issue, I just decided that for the tempo-sync'd FX, that pretty close was close enough for me. If the tempo doesn't change the FX work fine. I can set the tempo within 1 BPM or so and if the song picks up speed at the beginning or slows down at the end, the Sync'd Effect will just be a little off for that time. Oh well.
 
Its not worth my time to carefully vet every plugin on a project to make sure a tempo change doesn't cause an audible click.




I can't say that's something I've noticed but I don't use VX-64 that often. Is it caused by big jumps or any change at all? Most of the stuff I'm doing stays within about 5 BPM or so and drifts around a centre point.
2015/02/16 12:48:12
Anderton
gswitz
Its not worth my time to carefully vet every plugin on a project to make sure a tempo change doesn't cause an audible click.



Hopefully this will save you some time   In my experience, time-based effects as an overall category glitch when doing tempo changes. (I presume this is because buffers have to be flushed and replaced with new data, but that's conjecture.) On the other hand amplitude-or filtering-based effects (e.g., Tremolo, auto-pan, LFO Wah, etc.) can handle tempo changes well.
2015/02/16 18:59:18
gswitz
Thanks, Craig. I totally agree with this finding.
 
When I record a band playing a song and then double back to set the project tempo, I'm usually doing it so I can apply a tempo-based effect like delay to a vocal or something. Consequently, in that exact case, if I vary the tempo a lot to follow the tune, I shoot myself in the foot.
 
That's all I was saying.
 
Obviously, if you start in the box with a click track or a drum track, then you're good to go and the tempo never changes.
 
I'm not sure what the case is for having the tempo of the project follow the tempo of the song through live real-time musician based variations if the tempo-sync'd FX can't be used. What's the benefit of having the project follow the tempo of the song more precisely if it precludes the use of tempo-based FX?
 
The only use I can think of is if you wanted to extract the score and print it (which I never do).
 
Here, I want to give respect to the Bakers for making it the easiest yet to switch clips and tracks to time-based setting so you can alter the project's tempo without re-arranging your project in an unwanted way. Setting a song to a single tempo is something I often do.
2015/02/16 21:13:54
Anderton
gswitz
I'm not sure what the case is for having the tempo of the project follow the tempo of the song through live real-time musician based variations if the tempo-sync'd FX can't be used. What's the benefit of having the project follow the tempo of the song more precisely if it precludes the use of tempo-based FX?



You can often get away with "stepped" tempo changes. It's the continuously variable ones that wreak havoc with delays and such.
2015/02/17 21:02:55
Myriad_Rocker
This thread kind of grew some legs.
 
I've done a bit more comparing and something else that entices me is the inclusion of Dimension LE and other soft synths in the next level up.  Is anyone aware of there being some comparable soft synths on the market that are cheap or free?
 
2015/02/17 22:03:44
Paul P
Myriad_Rocker
I've done a bit more comparing and something else that entices me is the inclusion of Dimension LE and other soft synths in the next level up.  Is anyone aware of there being some comparable soft synths on the market that are cheap or free?



Both Rapture and the full Dimension Pro have been known to go on sale for 20$ each, which is an outstanding deal on some pretty nice synths.  If you can wait, and if the new store still has sales.
 
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