@LRR
What you're basically suggesting is incremental purchase, where the more you pay the more you get to keep if you stop paying.
 
So what about the folk that choose Artist and then stop paying after 6 months? Does it downgrade to HomeStudio?
 
 
This is NOT subscription,  you pay up front, or you pay in instalments. If you choose instalments and don't keep them up, it's taken away.  It's simple, it's clear.
 
 
This thread is just going around in circles and degrading each time around, it's getting close to being locked.

However, since they may have spent money within, say six months of payments, that money would be lost.

  
 
I think you are wrong here.  The way I read the  FAQ if they pay for 6 months they are credited for 6 months of payments.  They could resume their payments and they don't start over at ground zero, they just need 6 more months of payments, and the product is theirs.  Can anyone from Cakewalk confirm my interpretation of this?
 
If in the case they make payments for 6 months and never chose to renew, the payments are not lost, they counted for the time of operational use that they used the product and this is right in line with what everyone else with monthly membership offers.
 
The difference between what CW is doing and someone like Adobe, is with Adobe, you have to pay forever, for use of the product.  With CW, after 12 payments you can quit, and the product is yours.
 
The more overall point here is that CW has the right to sell the product for what they deem a marketable price.  You as the consumer have the right to chose if that is reasonable or not.  If you look at this objectively, CW is very fair here, if you just take the up-font price, this is really not that different from the X3 upgrade, they are just offering another option, which I think is a great move.
 

As you say, they have their projects.  However, the content in said project is already owned by the performer (author, etc.).  Whether recorded or not, that remains true.  So, the project itself is of little to no value without the content.  Therefore, in context, I am referring to a product, not a production.

 
This is arguing semantics.  If they exported the project to wav, then they have everything they need.  In a project format they are calling access to the plugins and settings within Sonar, so yes they have to own the program and any of the plugins they are using. 
 
Again, it would be nice to know where you are going with this, because we are running around in circles.  Bottom line CW could have not offered membership in which case everyone would have to pay up front for access.  They are offering an option which actually costs more than a straight upgrade, but may be easier on people's budget.
 

denverdrummer
[
Again, it would be nice to know where you are going with this, because we are running around in circles.  

After reading all his arguments, you really have to ask??

Paul P
 
Let's love our fellow humans, no matter what they do...

 
No! Let's NOT!
 
7+ billion on the planet.  I don't gots time to love more that a couple dozen.
 
And some should leave behind this mortal coil ASAP.

denverdrummer

However, since they may have spent money within, say six months of payments, that money would be lost.

  
 
I think you are wrong here.  The way I read the  FAQ if they pay for 6 months they are credited for 6 months of payments.  They could resume their payments and they don't start over at ground zero, they just need 6 more months of payments, and the product is theirs.  Can anyone from Cakewalk confirm my interpretation of this?

Cakewalk have made it quite clear that 12 consecutive payments are required to keep the software.  It's no different to defaulting on any other credit agreement, which is effectively what it is.  If you agree to make 12 payments and you default, you loose to software.  If you then get back in by starting to pay again, you get the software back but you're buying in from a new starting point. Your 12 payment count is reset.

OK this part of the FAQ needs to be clarified by CW:
 

If I choose Monthly Membership payments, can I cancel before 12 Months?

Yes, but 12 consecutive monthly payments are required to permanently activate SONAR and any updates you have received. If you cancel payment or don’t pay for at least 12 months, SONAR will revert to demo mode. This means you can’t save or export projects, however anything you saved up to that point will still open and play in the demo. Once you resume payments, you can make new edits and save them.

 
I could not find anything in the FAQ that stated how resumed payments were handled.
 

denverdrummer
OK this part of the FAQ needs to be clarified by CW:
 

If I choose Monthly Membership payments, can I cancel before 12 Months?

Yes, but 12 consecutive monthly payments are required to permanently activate SONAR and any updates you have received. If you cancel payment or don’t pay for at least 12 months, SONAR will revert to demo mode. This means you can’t save or export projects, however anything you saved up to that point will still open and play in the demo. Once you resume payments, you can make new edits and save them.

 
I could not find anything in the FAQ that stated how resumed payments were handled.
 

The first sentence states how resumed payments are handled... that is to say... 'they are not'! 12 payments must be 'consecutive'. If you skip a month you fail to make them 'consecutive'. Very clear.
 
However... the use of 'resume' is somewhat misleading. It implies starting from where one left off. Perhaps 'renew' would be more appropriate?

Living Room Rocker
In the scenario I have described, some new customers may not make 12 consecutive payments.  However, since they may have spent money within, say six months of payments, that money would be lost.   So, there is nothing to be said in consolation for what would amount in over $50 for just Artist?...As you say, they have their projects.  However, the content in said project is already owned by the performer (author, etc.).  Whether recorded or not, that remains true.  So, the project itself is of little to no value without the content.  Therefore, in context, I am referring to a product, not a production.

 
What the performer owns is IP, not the tools required to create it. But remember those tools have IP of their own, and it's owned by Cakewalk. The consolation is the performer would have been able to tap Cakewalk's IP for six months to create music they may not have been able to afford otherwise. During those six months, if they didn't create music and mix it down to a stereo or surround mix they can exploit, again, that's not Cakewalk's problem.
 

Surely it could be considered as some kind of "credit" at the end of 12 months from the date of the initial payment should no other payments be made.
 
Is what I am proposing so unreasonable or, perhaps, impossible for Cakewalk and Gibson to consider?  Is it too out of this world?

It would create an overlay of complication for a membership program that is supposed to be straightforward. What if they come back in 2018 and say "Well I paid for three months in 2015..." What if they stop after one month - why didn't they just download the demo? What if someone pays for two months, then gets re-instated for another two months, then drops out...how many "drops" do you allow? An unlimited amount? A limited amount?
 
And it opens up plenty of ways to game the system. Someone could buy for a month, drop out for two, then buy for a month and get the software that he missed - unless Cakewalk modified the installation so that people didn't get what was given to members during the months they didn't pay but got updates for a single month. Basically there would have to a zillion custom installations generated by Cakewalk to cover a zillion different scenarios. It would be a technical, logistical, and accounting nightmare for a small company that wants to simplify the process, not make it more complicated - and the people who didn't game the system would be penalized by the higher prices Cakewalk would have to charge to cover all the additional effort and overhead.
 
Bottom line is the membership program is not designed for incremental payments or a la carte program updates.

BassDaddy
 
 
Living Room Rocker
 
P.S. On another note, I am disappointed in my fellow members on this forum.  These attacks on me are unwarranted and should be individually addressed by the monitors, as expected.  Okay, I got that off my chest.

Living Room Rocker, I sure hope my talking about Knuckleheads wasn't taken as talking about you. I have no problem at all when a member in good standing is trying to work some things out or get some questions answered. Truthfully I kind of tune the whole discussion out cuz I didn't have any answers and it seemed like you a few others were able to handle it. I always considered you one of the good guys and still do. My whole issue in this thread was people who have not been here before , coming in asking a few odd questions and not even waiting around to get an answer. I'm sure you will get your concern answered. If I could add anything to help, I would be glad to do that.
 



Should not call people names to belittle them further...it hurts the spirit of peace...and insights much ponderings to cause us to assume that is intended for all whom have issues with...Money...., and reflect on in shame....surely some as another poster said...we buy to help others have the means to make their dreams recorded for free...because they cannot afford a cup of soup...let alone a pad to have rest in....Yah...so when names are carelessly thrown around forum town...about cost, and complaints...we all have a cross to say,,,keep it in peace, luv, and respect of all...giving aid to whom we can, for the greater good to prevail over our selves, and our neighbours....otherwise it instigates perceptions of who those names insult....and they will not be silenced until sorry is put forth...be good, with great respect, no matter what...and the glory stays in peace!...so does the forum!

Godling

denverdrummer
OK this part of the FAQ needs to be clarified by CW:
 

If I choose Monthly Membership payments, can I cancel before 12 Months?

Yes, but 12 consecutive monthly payments are required to permanently activate SONAR and any updates you have received. If you cancel payment or don’t pay for at least 12 months, SONAR will revert to demo mode. This means you can’t save or export projects, however anything you saved up to that point will still open and play in the demo. Once you resume payments, you can make new edits and save them.

 
I could not find anything in the FAQ that stated how resumed payments were handled.
 

The first sentence states how resumed payments are handled... that is to say... 'they are not'! 12 payments must be 'consecutive'. If you skip a month you fail to make them 'consecutive'. Very clear.
 
However... the use of 'resume' is somewhat misleading. It implies starting from where one left off. Perhaps 'renew' would be more appropriate?

Agreed, I was confused by "resume" which I seemed to read as you were credited for what your paid.  CW might want to consider revising the FAQ for clarity.
 
As for LRR's point, my previous statement holds that the 6 months paid is not lost, because it was used to have full access to the program, which is no different to how Adobe handles their subscription service, which we use for Photoshop as my daughter is really into Photography and digital art.  As I said the big difference is I will never own anything through Adobe on the subscription service, I'd have to shell out the 5 or 6 hundred bucks for the full version.