• SONAR
  • Making MIDI Drums Sound "Real?"
2018/12/06 19:20:28
Larry Jones
Added December 27, 2018: Since this forum is scheduled to be locked soon and there will be no more new content, I'm leaving this note for future explorers: What follows may be the best set of tips, tricks, techniques and best practices about the topic in the title -- how to make your digital drum tracks sound real. It contains so many different ways of achieving realistic drums using the tools built into SONAR/Cakewalk by Bandlab as well as third party software (and even tin cans!) that you may never get around to trying everything.
 
We all have incredible power in our DAWs these days. We can make radio-ready recordings with a laptop. But as the old saying goes, power corrupts. In the world of digital recording, that means you might be tempted to misuse your power and create tracks with flawless-but-robotic timing and percussion, and who wants to listen to that? I hope the methods found in this thread will help you rise to the next level.
 
My heartfelt thanks to everyone who contributed, and best of luck to all of you.
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I've been using the MIDI drums that have come as part of SONAR -- Addictive Drums 2 and Session Drummer. My usual process goes like this: I start with patterns (loops), build up a track, add fills and breakdowns, cymbal hits, etc. as the song develops. Some of my tweaking is with pre-made parts, some of it I play "live" on a keyboard. I've gotten pretty good at this, but my finished product is still lacking, and now I don't think it goes far enough, so here's my request for suggestions:
 
What techniques do other Sonarians use to make fake drums sound real? Do you tweak velocities or randomize timing? If so, how do you do that? Are there plugins that work for this kind of thing? Are there other MIDI drum packages that are better at this than the ones that came with SONAR? (Toontrack? BFD? Others?)
 
I should add that 90% of my recording is pop/rock/blues/old-school R&B. I don't do any hip hop or EDM, so I wouldn't want to spend any time -- or especially money -- on those styles at this time. Other than that, I'd love to hear your recommendations, methods, software, etc.
 
Thanx!

EDITED TO ADD: Hiring a real drummer is not an option for me these days.
2018/12/06 19:39:27
reginaldStjohn
Larry,  I do things just about the same way you do them. I have found that the Superior Drummer 3 or Ezdrummer 2 browse and tap to find help me get in the ballpark. I then edit and tweak the drums to my liking. I still don't think like a drummer and having a real drummer play parts is the best. 
 
I think the main issue isn't that the drums don't sound "Real" it is you worry that your drum parts are what an actual drummer would play for that song or part. However, that is what makes each person's music unique.
2018/12/06 20:33:36
andyjobson85
I've programmed an awful lot of drums, mainly in AD2 and what I've found is that 'humanisation' comes from poring over every drum note, manually. i.e. not using loops or pre-built MIDI clips, make your own. I don't use any auto-randomization stuff.
 
Mainly this results in you manually tuning the velocity and timing of every single drum note, but it can become quite a therapeutic experience. In most of my recordings it takes around 1 hour to program 1 minute of drums to a reasonable level of satisfaction.
 
Usually you only need a few little embellishments to make something feel human.
 
The big picture is dynamics: differing velocities and ghost notes. If the software is simulating mic bleed, use it. If the software is triggering different samples based on velocity, use it. program ghost notes at a lower velocity on a different part of the snare skin. Use tom rimshots for emphasis/effect.
 
Once you've programmed a nice dynamic drum part, don't compress all of your work out of it, turn it down, and let the master bus make it noticeable.
 
Some examples of what I've done using these findings:
 
https://www.facebook.com/jobsonandrew/videos/vb.611805940/10156639594335941
 
https://soundcloud.com/andrew-jobson/anesthetize-porcupine-tree-cover
 
 
2018/12/06 20:54:11
retired_account
Dynamics & time.
 
-You can take a heavily quantized loop & by varying it's velocities change it's feel.
-Try selecting just the individual parts in either sections or the whole tune (hats, kicks, snrs, cymbols, toms) & slide them + or -  a certain amount of ticks from one or each other. It can drive, push or lay-back the groove with the other tracks in your project
- Hire a real drummer
2018/12/06 21:37:34
jerrydf
Every note by hand. Start off with a copy/pasted pattern but revise that note by note as the track develops.
Attention to dynamics, especially those almost inaudible snare notes on shuffled rhythms.
Make sure each pattern would be playable buy a human drummer.
Things like triplets are rarely exactly on time...  a real drummer speeds them up a bit...  make sure the hi hat isn't still going during fills. Would a real drummer really get his hand from that floor tom to that cymbal in that time?
Make sure each kit piece is the sound you want. For AD2 I almost always end up with a hybrid kit.
I tend to keep things simple by having just two tracks for the drums - one for main drums and one for the hi hat and cymbals.
Jerry
 
2018/12/06 22:13:55
brundlefly
I tend to be pretty lazy when it comes to drum programming and mixing, and don't always adhere to my own advice, but FWIW:
 
- If you have the chops, play everything in from a controller to get naturally expressive and variable dynamics and timing, and resist the urge to record 4 bars and loop it. Play all the way through, and take advantage of 'happy accidents' that might occur. To get the interplay between kit pieces, play two or three related parts of the kit together as you record in real time - kick and snare in one pass, open/closed/pedal hats in another, ride/crash/splash cymbals in another, toms in another, etc.
 
- Hats and cymbals tend to have the greatest range of articulations and pattern variability in the real world, and will therefore sound the most 'programmed' if that variability is lacking. They also tend to be where the magic happens in terms of 'groove' and 'feel'. If you're going to spend a lot of time tweaking things, this is the place to focus your efforts.
 
- Use different combinations of kit pieces/articulations in different sections of the song, and find a distinct rhythmic 'hook' for each. 
 
- Try an algorithmic drum package like Jamstix. Use it by itself, or just borrow parts to complement your own stuff.
2018/12/07 03:49:54
Cactus Music
I started out with a drum machine,, a Roland 505 which still use, then when I first got my Atari I also bought a Roland  49 note controller and started entering notes live. 
I had hi hat patterns from the 505 which I still use as a metronome. 
I then would play a ruff piano part to set the arrangement. 
Then I would play the Kick/Snare live. 
Rewind and re do hi hats, ride, crash and toms. As said, a real drummer cannot play those at the same time. 
I would then edit best I could by deleting parts like snares during tom rolls or crashes and bad hits. 
 
I really didn't change this much until I bough my digital drum kit. THAT made a huge difference. 
 
Here's a way to have a digital drum kit for FREE! I tried for fun and it sort of worked.  
 
Mike up anything you can hit, cardboard boxes, an nice armchair works too,, and multi track record it just like a real drum kit. Now play the parts on the "kit" and use drum replacer to turn it into midi!! 
If you want to improve the kit... purchase a real set of drum sticks. Buy a cheapo kick pedal. 
2018/12/07 04:57:57
Jesse G
Basically I use AD2 and export each AD2 kit piece to an individual track except cymbals.  I then process those tracks to taste with EQ, compression and whatever is needed to make them sound right.
 
Check out thus article
 
2018/12/07 08:11:25
Larry Jones
I didn't expect so many great responses! Thank you, all. I have my work cut out for me.
 
(Johnny: I've been accumulating coffee cans and oat meal boxes for years, thinking I might make a cheesy "drum kit." I was planning just to mic them and use their natural sounds, but I'm liking your idea. Did you know that the percussion on "Susie Darlin'" is some guy slapping the car keys in his pants pocket? I love stories like that, where someone just uses whatever is at hand.)
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