I was just going through the features, specs and layout of bitwig studio and it seemed to me that Sonar had most of all the GUI features pretty much built-in within the skylight interface. But somehow this bitwig thing seems to have taken the world by storm as a new generation music DAW. I too couldnt ignore some of the specs which I would wish were built in to Sonar. Now CW, are you guys listening ?? Now now, I could be jumping leaps due to sheer ignorance, that is, these things could probably be done in Sonar too already but I just may not know or may not have realized. So, if someone could throw light if below features in bitwig already exist in Sonar cause some of these seem to be revolutionary :
 
1. Plug-in sandboxing (for damage control during plugin crashes)
2. Unified Modulation system
3. Open Controller API
4. Interactive Histogram parameter editing (looks like some dynamic on-the-fly envelopes creation capabilities)
5. And it being cross platform including Linux
6. Forthcoming plans for an Integrated Modular System (ability to modify devices and even create new ones !)
 
There are still more...now I really love Sonar for its versatility, feature richness and comprehensiveness. Am I missing the above somewhere that can be done in Sonar X3 ? Or CW, can we expect some game changers in X4 or an update to X3...X3f ?
 
CW...are you guys listening ?! Peace...
 

I have only heard of its existence.  Now, you've got me curious...I may have to check it out, although, to me, Sonar X3 covers practically all of the bases.  One thing I wish that Sonar had that Cubase's current version has is that chord creation thingy...
 
Cheers!

I would throw in one feature request thread at a time in the "feature and ideas" forum. You would have six threads here.

If you want new features that is a much better forum for such a discussion (people can vote on it as well).

Cakewalk is more likely to "listen" over there.

Thanks

SONAR RULES...

ramscapri
But somehow this bitwig thing seems to have taken the world by storm as a new generation music DAW.

 
They're mainly competing with Ableton Live, and Bitwig has an uphill climb to compete with a program in that genre that has been around for much longer and has a loyal, and established, user base. I'm sure Bitwig Studio is a cool program and all that, but getting people to switch from Live to Bitwig will be a challenge for them.
 

So, if someone could throw light if below features in bitwig already exist in Sonar cause some of these seem to be revolutionary :
 
1. Plug-in sandboxing (for damage control during plugin crashes)

 
The concept of sandboxing is not particularly ground-breaking, for example Chrome and Java sandbox plug-ins to restrict access to the system. Windows does that for programs as well (I think it started with Vista but I'm not sure), so that if one program crashes it (hopefully) won't take down the system although it's not foolproof. Cakewalk's solution has been the plug-in manager, where you can selectively exclude plug-ins that cause problems. Also, it won't load plug-ins again that crashed, unless you ask SONAR to try again. According to their tech specs Bitwig doesn't support VST3, so I'm not sure whether that means sandboxing will also work with VST 3 plug-ins, should Bitwig support that format at some point.
 

2. Unified Modulation system

 
This seems to be a feature of the synths that are built into Bitwig and doesn't translate to third party plugs. Dim Pro and Rapture have modulation matrices that do pretty much the same thing, but require more "manual labor" than Bitwig's drag and drop orientation but also, they don't "talk" to other effects or instruments, whether 3rd party or those made by Cakewalk. IMHO Reason is still the most flexible program in this respect, but it attains this by using virtual patch cords and being a "closed" system. The Bitwig system is very similar to how Arturia and Native Instruments add modulation to their synths and effects, like Kontakt, Guitar Rig, or the Moog Modular. As to the Macros and Device Panel Mapping, SONAR's effects chains have six controls with four available assignments, six buttons with four assignments, and customizable graphics.
 

3. Open Controller API

 
Looks like their version of Active Controller Technology.
 

4. Interactive Histogram parameter editing (looks like some dynamic on-the-fly envelopes creation capabilities)

 
I couldn't figure out exactly what this means; seems sort of like QuickGrouping taken to the individual parameter level. If it's about the automation absolute or relative modes SONAR has this, as well as sophisticated grouping where different elements of the group can have different responses and limits.
 

5. And it being cross platform including Linux

 
SONAR runs very well under Boot Camp and Parallels on the Mac. Cakewalk doesn't publicize this because they don't want to have to deal with Mac tech support issues for SONAR. I think they get upset with me when I mention this...but it's reality, I know a lot of people who like Macs for the hardware and SONAR for the software.
 

6. Forthcoming plans for an Integrated Modular System (ability to modify devices and even create new ones !)

 
Given that it doesn't exist it's difficult to give any definitive assessment, but it doesn't seem particularly groundbreaking - more like they're trying to match Ableton's integration with Max.
 

There are still more...now I really love Sonar for its versatility, feature richness and comprehensiveness. Am I missing the above somewhere that can be done in Sonar X3 ? Or CW, can we expect some game changers in X4 or an update to X3...X3f ?

 
Bitwig competes more directly with programs like Ableton Live, FL Studio, and to some extent, Reason. So the features are addressed to that audience. SONAR is designed for a broad range of users. For example, I don't think Bitwig has video support, surround, ARA integration, VST3 and DirectX support, comping (at least I didn't see any mention of it), and I didn't see mention of 64-bit mix engine/driver bit depth/bit resolution/ReWire support, REX or Acidized file import (although I assume they just forgot to mention it in their list of importable formats), the ability to create/edit Acidized files, touch support, staff view, MusicXML export for import into notation programs, etc. 
 
No DAW will be all things to all people, so you need to use the DAW that's targeted most clearly at the kind of projects you do. Seems to me like Bitwig wants to offer Live users the same kind of groove orientation, but with a deeper level of synthesis that's more like Reason. But this is just speculation, Bitwig is one of the few DAWs I haven't used.
 

I would have to agree with Craig - if they are basically competing with Ableton, then it will be an uphill battle.  For me, I could never get into the basic premise of Ableton, the way it works as opposed to the Cakewalk paradigm.
 

digimidi
I would have to agree with Craig - if they are basically competing with Ableton, then it will be an uphill battle.  For me, I could never get into the basic premise of Ableton, the way it works as opposed to the Cakewalk paradigm.
 

I'm glad someone gets this.  If you use enough audio software so often it's an apples and oranges comparison.  There is nothing wrong with being a multi DAW user either.  Some people also treat them like religions as well.

digimidi
For me, I could never get into the basic premise of Ableton, the way it works as opposed to the Cakewalk paradigm.

Well, I totally "get" the Ableton paradigm, but it is indeed very different from SONAR.
 
You could describe an instrument as having strings, being percussive in nature, and quantizing its notes into semitones. That describes both a guitar and a piano, but technique learned on one doesn't translate to the other. However, some people double on guitar and keyboards.

 
Thanks a ton Craig for providing your feedback point by point to my post !
Was very helpful and does convince me all the more now that Sonar has features far more at a broader level.
I think for me it was always about how a DAW could work primarily for music composition from scratch, be it audio recording or midi recording into soft synths, and NOT just about pulling in millions of existing loops (which can also be done in Sonar if need be including the matrix variant of arrangement)...
and for music composers, Sonar just seems to excel...
 
but I would still be intrigued by what this histogram feature is all about in bitwig...would love to have something like this in Sonar...here's a link to a CM mag video about the feature :
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RluXZ19Iqo
 
Craig, is this something we could do in Sonar in some way that I am possibly missing ?