• SONAR
  • No notation fixes! (p.71)
2015/06/28 00:57:51
Kamikaze
Can't mark your post as Helpful Amp, as Susan has beaten me to it.
2015/06/28 02:12:51
mudgel
ampfixer
Anderton
vmw
Cakewalk has stated that musicians and composers are not a large part of their customer base.



Well mudgel, sorry to  burst your bubble but it's absolutely true that very few musicians use SONAR. The latest survey shows that the majority of Cakewalk users are astronauts, teddy bear repair technicians, whaling ship captains, IMAX screen cleaners, pet food testers, and undergarment designers. However, I'd sure like to know how vmw managed to get his hands on this highly confidential information...i can only assume he works in marketing at Cakewalk. 
 




The guy has an opinion. You don't have to agree, but you also don't have to make the guy feel like an idiot. Been taking HR training with Alex? I hold you to a higher standard than the civilians.

Please help me understand how your comments are holding anyone to a higher standard.
2015/06/28 04:24:40
mettelus
Wait a second... vmw is mudgel?? This thread has lost me more than it already did now...
2015/06/28 04:37:23
Anderton
ampfixer
The guy has an opinion. You don't have to agree, but you also don't have to make the guy feel like an idiot. Been taking HR training with Alex? I hold you to a higher standard than the civilians.

 
Jeez, the guy said as a fact (not an opinion) "Cakewalk has stated that musicians and composers are not a large part of their customer base" and talks about how they're happy to dumb down music, but does anyone really think those are even remotely true statements? I didn't call him a liar or anything, I tried to inject some levity into it and point out that it was kind of preposterous to think that Cakewalk's user base consists primarily of non-musicians who don't compose music. 
 
It took some effort to find really off-the-wall examples of gigs so I could be suitably absurd and people would understand I was trying to be funny. Well, at least two people did. There was a lot wrong with the post from which I quoted, but I refrained from taking it any further and chose to be funny instead...frankly, though, it bothers me a lot when people present speculation, especially unfounded speculation that impugns the motives of good people, as fact.
 
It was bad enough when someone stated Cakewalk would never fix staff view (there have been several fixes), it was not on their to-do list (obviously it was), and Studio One Pro 3 would integrate notation (it doesn't). All of that was stated as fact. All of it was B.S. I have no patience for that kind of thing. I have no patience for someone who says hosts falsify posts - without providing a shred of evidence, despite claiming there were "many many" instances of it. But I have lots of patience for people who are trying to contribute something positive to a discussion - and that certainly includes people who have complaints or problems, as long as they're more interested in solving the problem than complaining about it.
 
If others want to express their thoughts, that's totally fine but it should be with the understanding that they are subject to have someone enter into a dialog with them. The nature of that dialog will be shaped by how they choose to open it. Ampfixer, you decided I was trying to show he was an idiot and gave a response you thought was appropriate to that motivation. JSG and Bluzgbog decided I was trying to be funny and gave responses they thought were appropriate to that motivation.
 
In a way, you're both right. I thought his post was absurd, but just thought I'd make a joke about one specific statement rather than bear down and call him on all the things that were wrong with his post. I half expect he'll come back with "Yeah, I actually can't show where Cakewalk said that, and it does make sense that musicians are the target audience for SONAR."
 
Then we can enter into a fact-based dialog about what part of the customer base uses loops, what he thinks would prevent Cakewalk from "dumbing down" music, the issues involved in open sourcing large amounts of SONAR that expose the MIDI engine, why SONAR is not just a hardware sequencer replacement (digital audio recording and all that), and if you're going to diss something because it was from the last century, then music notation must REALLY suck because four lines on a stave is about 10 centuries old. Does that make it invalid? 
 
I'm the kind of guy who got up in front of the New Music Seminar last week and said the industry was in denial and all the talk about streaming and such didn't address the devaluation of music - in terms of sound quality, monetary returns, and impact on society - that's happened steadily for the past 15 years. Some people didn't want to hear that. Some did. Some agreed, some didn't. But at least I got them to think about it.
 
I'm really getting sick and tired of this world. Honestly, I look forward to departing it but want to contribute as much as I can before I go. I have no patience for people who have nothing better to do than start a dialog that tears others down without justification, or bends a dialog in that direction. I never start a dialog that tears anyone down. But I'll damn well respond to one that does, because I have just as much of a right to an opinion as anyone else. Until Cakewalk, or people here whose opinions I respect tell me to get lost, I'm going to keep expressing my opinions.
 
And you're entitled to tell me my opinions suck. I've been a public figure for 50 years, and have had everything from awards to death threats. Just be aware that at this point, I don't really care that much what other people think about me. I do the best I can, and I'm comfortable with what I contribute. Could I be a better person? Sure. Who couldn't?
2015/06/28 04:46:01
mudgel
mettelus
Wait a second... vmw is mudgel?? This thread has lost me more than it already did now...


No I'm not.
2015/06/28 04:47:52
Anderton
mettelus
Wait a second... vmw is mudgel?? This thread has lost me more than it already did now...



No, VMW was the one who said "Cakewalk has stated that musicians and composers are not a large part of their customer base." Mudgel, not surprisingly, took him to task for that. 
 
I tried to inject some levity into the situation by telling Mudgel I had to burst his bubble because he was wrong and the other guy was right - Cakewalk's customer base consists of "astronauts, teddy bear repair technicians, whaling ship captains, IMAX screen cleaners, pet food testers, and undergarment designers."
 
Some people got the humor. Some didn't. I know humor doesn't always translate well in print but I try anyway. Next time I'll remember to put lots of smilies   
 
Look on the bright side: people reading this thread now know that if the music thing doesn't pan out, that being a teddy bear repair technician is a legitimate field of employment. I'm sure it's very gratifying to have some little girl come in devastated, and have her leave with Mr. Bear back at full strength.
 
Oh right, I almost forgot - that was another attempt at humor. I was not making fun of little girls or calling them idiots. And that last statement was also supposed to be funny.   
 
2015/06/28 04:52:48
jih64
mudgel
mettelus
Wait a second... vmw is mudgel?? This thread has lost me more than it already did now...


No I'm not.



Are you sure ?
 
The clues are all there - (vmw)
 
Mike = (m)
V = (v)
Wombat (avatar) = (w)   just shuffle them around a bit
 
lol
 
2015/06/28 04:53:46
mudgel
Yeh well, that's all well and good, but what about my bubble. Sure get your teddy bear repaired but who's going to fix my bubble?
2015/06/28 04:54:08
mettelus
I should stay out of the forums when tired! I saw the quote and seemed like a reply to it. Whew, all better now (good for a couple minutes anyway).
2015/06/28 05:12:29
mudgel
jih64
mudgel
mettelus
Wait a second... vmw is mudgel?? This thread has lost me more than it already did now...


No I'm not.



Are you sure ?
 
The clues are all there - (vmw)
 
Mike = (m)
V = (v)
Wombat (avatar) = (w)   just shuffle them around a bit
 
lol
 


That's actually very funny; and not an emoji in sight.
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