vintagevibe
 
Wow!  You've misrepresented or misunderstood so much that it's just tiring.  You'll argue forever and life is too short.   Rather than try, yet again, to correct you I'll start over.   Here are my predictions with great certainty:
 
1) The sun will rise tomorrow.  
2) Cakewalk will never invest significant resources to overhaul the staff view and make it on par with (or even close to) Cubase, Protools or DP.  It will always be substandard.  People who are waiting for this will be disappointed.
 
All things are possible and anyone can be wrong.  I do, however, expect the sun to rise tomorrow.  Let me know if I'm wrong.
 

With all due respect VintageVibe, you are wrong.  I just spent 2 months using DP every day and night.  I spent the largest percentage of that time in the staff view.  DPs staff view has a few things going for it, namely the capacity to display tied and dotted triplets.   That's it.  Sonar's notation has several things going for that in my opinion are superior, namely the width of the staff view is far more practical for large-form composition and the tab-and-lock feature is invaluable for moving quickly between various staff views.  Sonar' notation editor is also a lot easier to navigate and move from say measure 33 to measure 195, using the scroll bar.
 
Also, DPs notation editor can display up to 13 staves on one "page", whereas Sonar's notation editor can display up to 23 staves on one screen.   Are you aware of that?
 
As far as Cubase is concerned, sure, it has more symbols, but that assumes you're using it to create full-fledged scores rather than using it to compose and edit MIDI data.  Plus Cubase uses the dreaded dongle and it has what I view as the most clunky interface of all the DAWS.  I found Cubase's notation editor quite difficult to use compared to Sonar, and with no real benefit.
 
Jerry
http://www.jerrygerber.com
 
 

 

Back to normal programming...
 

Having started this thread, I see it is finally starting to show signs of deterioration! Again, I say that I am glad to see so much interest in the topic. At the same time, it is sad to watch it dwindle away becoming a point of contention rather than a positive movement towards the repair of a much needed feature for a lot of us. I do have to come down on Craig's side of the argument, though. Not simply because of his well respected position in music media everywhere, but simply because his facts are correct. Now with that said, could we move on with some constructive means towards the not so simple ends of making sure the bakers seeing the size of this forum and the new forum topic added to it. Maybe they will no longer be able to just throw us a band-aid patch for SV but really get to work on a fix.
I was glad to see Craig's comment about Cake being shopped to educational markets. That would be a good sign to me as I feel as if there is more encouragement towards reading and writing music academically.  Here's hoping!

vintagevibe
 
Wow!  You've misrepresented or misunderstood so much that it's just tiring.

 
How is it possible to misinterpret:
 
"(Cakewalk) have concluded that that market doesn't need notation which is why they not only won’t enhance notation but will not even fix the bugs.” I guess you meant to say "Cakewalk will likely start to fix staff view bugs."
 
Or "But, of course, to Cakewalk [education] is just a small niche market.” I guess you meant to say "Cakewalk is actively pursuing the education market, because they see its potential."
 
Or "“Staff View is dead.  No matter what Cakewalk says publicly it will never be addressed." I guess you meant to say "Staff view isn't dead - I predict Cakewalk will start addressing it now that they have this new release schedule."
 
So, my bad!!! Everything you meant to say turned out to be true. I have absolutely no idea why I instead keyed in on what you actually said.
 
 

vintagevibeYou'll argue forever and life is too short.

 
I didn't argue. An argument is an exchange of diverging or opposite views. There were no opposite views. I simply presented quotes of things you stated as fact, and showed they weren't factual.
 

Rather than try, yet again, to correct you I'll start over.

 
You have yet to "correct" anything. You have not cited any factual errors in anything I've said. What you call a "correction" is to say you meant something other than what your words said. That's not correcting me, that's clarifying your comments, and even then, only a portion of them. You still have failed to address quotes like the ones above, which I think are quite clear.
 
 

vintagevibeHere are my predictions with great certainty:
 
1) The sun will rise tomorrow.

 
That topic was never under discussion. Perhaps you consider your statement some kind of riposte.
 

vintagevibe2) Cakewalk will never invest significant resources to overhaul the staff view and make it on par with (or even close to) Cubase, Protools or DP.  It will always be substandard.  People who are waiting for this will be disappointed.

 
Given your track record for predictions, you've now given me hope that Cakewalk will invest significant resources to overhaul the staff view. 
 
You dissed Cakewalk and the credibility of its current staff; dismissed what the new project manager said (who kept his word); and made claims which you stated as fact yet have turned out to be fiction. Instead of being happy that Cakewalk is paying attention to users and fixing bugs (which you stated they would not do), you are so invested in maintaining your negative position that you have doubled down and said your fallacious predictions were simply "misrepresented." Yet your own words undermine that contention.
 
Go have fun with Cubase, it's a fine program and if SONAR didn't exist, I'd probably be using that or Studio One. Meanwhile, SONAR users can enjoy the fact that Cakewalk is listening to what they want, and acting on it. That is a step in the right direction, to say the least.

Anderton
Go have fun with Cubase, it's a fine program and if SONAR didn't exist, I'd probably be using that or Studio One. Meanwhile, SONAR users can enjoy the fact that Cakewalk is listening to what they want, and acting on it

To THE CRAIG::
 
Stop contributing to this thread. You could have finished at least one new song for all the effort you have put into arguing with a guy who has stubborn on his side.
 
I implore you to only post when you are NOT responding to dumb. Let the rest of us whop these guys our big sticks.
 
As the Python said, "He's got to be king cuz he doesn't have stuff all over him."
 
Please stay out of the stuff.

Hi-
 
I may be romanticizing the way things were here years ago, but it seems to me folks used to be able to voice their opinions on these forums without feeling like they had to be on one or the other side of a lengthy debate where one team always had to "win." It wasn't quite so adversarial.
 
Sometimes people would say things that weren't 100% factually accurate to make their point and that would be okay. There would be rebuttals, of course, but they wouldn't be browbeaten into submission or agreement or made to feel foolish by anyone if they didn't agree or be asked to defend point by point by point their side of the argument until they gave in or gave up.
 
Since product registration isn't required to join these forums, I hope things can lighten up a bit so the first impression isn't "You'd better agree, or else" and that there can be a more friendly and less adversarial atmosphere presented here generally.
 
Thanks-
 
-Susan
 

Well said Susan.