mudgel
 But if you'd read the other thread that actually focuses on what Cakewalk has done you'll find that gradually, little bit by little bit, Cakewalk are improving notation.

Do you have a link for that thread? Thanks. 

Great comment, Kenny! As a long time user of the universal language I do applaud the well written post. Although, I do agree with Mudgel that if you want to be able to play or interpret a piece of music it is far more complex on many levels to speak or write the language. That is why we have so many musician's that play by ear!
When I was taking classical piano at a very early age, my mother was taken aside by my teacher one day. My mother was informed that my teacher was going to have to release me if I didn't start learning to read. By her observations I was listening and watching the fingers more than the actual reading of the paper.
Thus, I was dragged kicking and screaming in to learning the universal language. And I am so GLAD I did. That ability has led to me spending the rest of my life being exposed to just about any kind of music you can think of. If it was written it was so much easier and quicker to pick up that sheet and the ear I was blessed with helped me to pick out what was left.
Have you ever thought about how short rehearsal would be if everyone read music? That terrible task of re-playing that one section over and over because there is a note that just isn't right? And all the time you would save not arguing about a lick that isn't right? These are all things that we have experienced in our purgatory of sound.
How shocked I was when I grew old enough to actually start playing in bands. All that time learning to read and write music spent for naught because nobody else in the band has ever even had a music lesson much less read or write.
BOTTOM LINE: There are many reasons to learn to read and write the universal languages. There is also the joy of creation of something that sounds good from thin air without having the least idea how you did it. As long as we are creating something POSITIVE with our art we just may have a glimmer of hope to change this sad, old violent world we live in.
That being said, I wish for Cake to fix the SV but in the time that we spend talking about that we could have written another song! Just one opinion amongst many.LOL

mudgel
I don't mean to be disagreeable but written music in the form of a staff with octaves that comprise 8 full tones etc etc is no more universal than English as a spoken and written language.
 
it is only available and understood by those who learn to read and write and speak that language the same as any.

And staff notation is a pretty poor representation of music.  Putting aside its shortcomings in describing the performance of the music, which is a matter of interpretation anyway, it doesn't even show the basic structure of a piece in a straightforward manner.  It's limited to even-tempered semitones and 12 of them are represented by 5 lines and 4 spaces, so confusion is built in.
 
Different instruments, like drums, really strain staff notation.  I'm learning harmonica and since you (can) use different harmonicas for different keys, you don't care which actual/theoretical note you play is, you only care about its degree in relation to the root.  It's all intervals.  Staff notation is useless for this and many examples are written as if the piece were in C (if you're lucky) and you're left with transposing it in your head.  Or use some bizarre form of TAB.  I've invented my own clumsy graphic tab and transpose any lick I'm working on into a sequence of intervals, which are valid no matter what key I'm playing in.  But it's still limited to 12 semitones and three octaves and shows nothing about dynamics.
 
Maybe we need something better than staff notation.
 

Paul P
 
Different instruments, like drums, really strain staff notation.  I'm learning harmonica and since you (can) use different harmonicas for different keys, you don't care which actual/theoretical note you play is, you only care about its degree in relation to the root.  It's all intervals.  Staff notation is useless for this and many examples are written as if the piece were in C (if you're lucky) and you're left with transposing it in your head.  Or use some bizarre form of TAB.  I've invented my own clumsy graphic tab and transpose any lick I'm working on into a sequence of intervals, which are valid no matter what key I'm playing in.  But it's still limited to 12 semitones and three octaves and shows nothing about dynamics.
 
Maybe we need something better than staff notation.

I'm not sure if I understand exactly what you're trying to say but you're describing the C clef.
That's basic & used in standard notation.

Paul P
 
 
Maybe we need something better than staff notation.
 

(Working) Staff view will suffice for SONAR, IMO.
 
 

mudgel
Both are onl
I don't mean to be disagreeable but written music in the form of a staff with octaves that comprise 8 full tones etc etc is no more universal than English as a spoken and written language.
 
it is only available and understood by those who learn to read and write and speak that language the same as any.
 
Asian music in its various forms bears no resemblance in sound with respect to octaves and 8 tones for each, or written the way you're considering the classical form of presenting composition.

Please give me specific examples of this. [I know one but it is still written accurately using standard notation].
This is absolute nonsense. "Asian" music, whatever that is supposed to mean, uses the same notes as Western music - just different scales to what we might be used to. 
 

Sorry its no more a reason for Cakewalks commitment to improving Sonar's notation. But if you'd read the other thread that actually focuses on what Cakewalk has done you'll find that gradually, little bit by little bit, Cakewalk are improving notation.

More nonsense.
The midi standard is based on standard Western music notation. 
Cakewalk have made no improvements to Sonar's notation in 10 years.
 

Paul P
Different instruments, like drums, really strain staff notation. 

No. Drums use drum notation and every drummer I know can read it.
 
 

Every time notation threads show up we have people turning up claiming that notation isn't important. Sonar is full of features I never use but I don't feel the need to crap on about how useless a step sequencer is to a "real musician" or that I don't need another vintage analogue tube compressing exicator plugin to go with my other three hundred analogue compressors. 
 

I agree with you, Brett.
 
If I'm participating in an art forum, and someone starts a thread about how (for example) all the paint brushes available to them drop bristles left and right and they wish the quality could be improved, I don't butt in to the thread to inform everyone that all the cognoscenti know that sculpting is the only art form worthy of discussion, so the plebeians should keep their disgusting paint brush complaints to themselves (Disclaimer: This is not how I feel :) ).
 
LJ
 
 
 

The thing about Notation requests is that the same people  ( but mpstly vintage vibe )make them over and over and over again and sometimes appear to be zealots. What is more annoying- people who are ridiculously optimistic and will let Sonar brook no criticism or the other eternally pessimistic souls....
 
If the work to notation would require major manpower- why should I as a non user want to fund that?