• SONAR
  • Changing tempo in midi tracks without affecting it
2014/09/24 18:12:24
PiBoy
Hi!
 
Here is a tough question. I recorded an electronic drum via midi but I did not know the tempo. Once I finish recording I could realize the tempo. I recorded it at 105 and it was at 60. I want to change the tempo in the song without affecting the midi track. I know this could be done with audio tracks but can it be done in midi tracks?
 
One turn around was to bounce it to audio then change the tempo but I can not modify the actual hits or make corrections that easy as midi track. Also I can bounce each part of the drum, change the tempo and then convert it to midi but it looses some feeling. 
 
Is there another way so I don't loose that feeling? 
 
Have a Great day!
 
PiBoy
 
Note: I use sonar X3 producer. 
2014/09/24 19:44:51
sock monkey
Well life is much easier if you play to a click track. 
I can't think that anyone would lay down a digital drum track to a project without first setting the tempo. So your possibly the first person to get in this pickle. 
 
Of course anything is possible with Sonar, but I super highly recommend you just do it again and this time to a click track. 
When midi notes are randomly put on the midi time grid that's a big mess and would involve hours or moving stuff. 
Then changing the midi to audio and then back again?? yikes! 
2014/09/24 20:02:22
garrigus
You can try using the Process > Fit Improvisation function.
 
Scott

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2014/09/24 20:07:45
John
MIDI is much easier to control tempo than audio. Simply adjust the tempo in the Control Bar, the BPM. 
 
You can also use the tempo view. 
2014/09/24 21:31:18
robert_e_bone
Am I correct in understanding that you were capturing midi data that was being played at a different tempo than the project tempo at the time of the recording?  And now you want to adjust presumably the project tempo, but you don't want the midi data to playback any differently than the tempo is was recorded at?
 
I am pretty fuzzy on what exactly is at what speed initially, and what exactly is needing to be changed, and what exactly is needing to not be changed.  PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE explain it again for me.
 
Thanks - sorry if I am a bit dense - I would like to get it right, if I am going to try to advise you on what to do to accomplish your goals.
 
Bob Bone
 
2014/09/24 23:38:13
John
If thats the case Bob I'm not sure how you would go about that. Tempo is tempo as far as I know. MIDI can be any tempo and it can be changed to any tempo but so will the project. I recall a DAW that can have more than one tempo but I can't recall what it was. 
2014/09/25 00:03:21
ampfixer
The only thing that comes to mind, is to freeze the output of the midi track and bounce it to an audio clip. Change the tempo to the new target and the audio will still have the original tempo. The only problem is if your time was drifting during the original recording. It will likely not sync to the new tempo. Just turn on the metronome during playback an you'll know pretty quick.
2014/09/25 00:14:16
sock monkey
Midi data recorded at a random tempo will not be in line with Sonars measures and myself I've never ran into this particular issue. It might have been the OP was using the metronome in his drum brain, but if no click track was used then what you have is more or less unusable midi data. 
 
It's funny that if it was audio you could match up the project tempo, but with midi the project tempo will obviously alter the speed. 
 
2014/09/25 08:15:41
Kalle Rantaaho
Does my logic fail or could it be done simply so, that you create a new Project with the intended tempo, and drop the drum track into that. MIDI follows Project tempo?? Or maybe not.... The relative error remains (?) You can scale the MIDI somehow so that fits the bars of the intended tempo, can't you?? And when the MIDI fits the bars, you can adjust tempo anyway you like.
 
It's been so long since I've had proper MIDI sessions that I don't remember. This shouldn't be overly hard. Easier than with audio anyway, of course.
 
If the original is played without any kind of click, the biggest challenge will be the variations of the tempo. It takes more tweaking. You may get first eight bars to match the bars easily, but is that the tempo of the next eight bars?
2014/09/25 10:38:47
bvideo
I don't have a chance to try this right now, but in the Clip Inspector there is a clip lock function that can lock position and data. Does it work for MIDI? and by "position and data" does it lock by absolute time or by measure boundary? After locking all midi clips, then use a "fit to improv" or "set measure/beat" workflow, and see if the midi data stays locked in place.
 
Also, possibly answering the above, note this info (out of the manual):
Note: If a clip’s position is locked, and you change tempo, what happens to the clip’s position
depends on what option the Clip Properties Time Base field is set to: Musical (M:B:T), or
Absolute (SMPTE). If the clip is set to the Musical time base, the clip’s M:B:T position stays
constant, and its Absolute position shifts. If the clip is set to the Absolute time base, its Absolute
position does not move, but its M:B:T position shifts.
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