I've recently been working with some younger bands and I've been having the guitarist obviously get their distortion sounds the way they want before recording, making sure they are happy with the amount of distortion before we record. After recording we listen to the playback for performance and tonality with no issues. Once I finish the mixing, inevitably I hear from the guitarist that there is too much distortion on the guitar. I'm not adding any additional distortion I use a little compression and a little eq to the track. Hence what the guitarist was after was more of an overdrive as opposed to a full distortion. So two questions, is there some trick possibly to thin out the amount of distortion without rerecording the track and how do you guys work with younger musicians to get them to understand the differences in amounts of distortion and overdrive?

Yes to everything. Recorded dirt guitar sounds almost always use less distortion than the live sound. About half the gain they usually play with is a good starting point. The reasons are myriad and complex but the results are clear.

AC/DC records their guitars through a Marshall amp with all the knobs turned up about halfway-- that's it, no distortion pedal, nothing else. It's amazing how a little gain goes a long way.

Cheers.

Hi all,

ORIGINAL: yep

The reasons are myriad and complex...

That's probably true, but I know that the biggest reason I myself hear more distortion with recordings is that when I play (and "play" is an gross exaggeration), I hear an appreciable acoustic component that is not recorded, although that could be done. In other words, I hear the strings being plucked quite clearly as well as their vibrations as a part of what I hear for the sound because I'm so close to the strings.

When I play the recording back, those acoustic plucking sounds are gone, hence I conclude that there is more distortion --- but it's not so much that as the acoustic portion has been subtracted. I'm not really recording what I'm hearing.

These younger folks are probably not used to this, so some explanation, demonstration, and iteration may be necessary.

Regards,
Dave Clark

As yep stated, less is more, it took me quite a while to get used to this, but it iis what it is.

Everyone else covered the obvious, but I have an idea:

Maybe the extra compression you added to the guitar track increased the guitar's sustain in a way that was perceived by the guitarist as more gain.

It's worth a shot - reduce or remove the compression on the distortion tracks and see if the guitar player is happy. If that doesn't do it, then it's time to re-track with less gain. Another possibility would be to overdub a cleaner guitar sound and mix it with the distortion sound to bring back a little articulation.

It's too late for this project but on future projects you can split the guitar signal with a direct box and record two tracks, one direct and one from the amp set the way the guitarist 'likes' it.

Then if he doesn't like it later, reamp the direct track (go backwards thru a passive direct box before the amp) and reset the gain on the guitar amp and re-record it to yet another track. This is the way I always do it now.

One trick I use and learned in "professional studios" was to record 2 tracks simultaneously; one effected and one clean. What you're describing is a loss of ATTACK. Effects can certainly muddy that up. If you have 2 tracks, you can make one sound the way you want, and bring the clean one up in the mix to emphasize the actual notes. You'll be surprised at how great it sounds.

If recording 2 tracks simultaneously isn't an option, it would be best to record the track clean to begin with (unless that'll confuse the young pup). Copy the track into 2, and then put your effects on one track.

That's pretty much the way that I record all of my string instruments, if I'm planning on using effects like overdrive, distortion. It also limits my need for much chorus as I'm creating a natural chorus just by doing that. It just gives you more flexibility in the end.

Good luck!
Scott

ORIGINAL: spindlebox

One trick I use and learned in "professional studios" was to record 2 tracks simultaneously; one effected and one clean.
Good luck!
Scott

In fact it's really a great habit to get into doing this with everything you record if possible. And as spindlebox stated it can add alot to a distorted track.

You can't really subtract distortion from the tracks....but you could filter some of the ugly stuff out. Try using span or some other frequency or spectrum graph to eyeball where the grossest frequencies are on the guitar track. Then try to set up a few sharply notched narrow band frequency cuts and work the frequencies up and down in context of the mix until you find if something sounds better. You may find an area where loosing a narrow band of guitar signal is filled in with some other instrument and it might give the effect of lesser distortion. It's definately worth experimenting with trying to tap a clean guitar signal before they dirty it up and throw it on another track for a back-up.

I think the best thing of all is that AFTER they here it in a mix they see on their own that they need to change the way they sound when recording.... that means they're learning how to hear..which is good.. so sell them on re recording it again.