• SONAR
  • Audio issues with Sonar
2018/11/24 09:35:14
jonel
Hi All,
   I have been using Sonar since version 8 and currently using X3. I had a recurrent issue with audio that I couldn't seem to pin down. I would use Sonar for a complete session using the FocusRite NIO 2 | 4 with its drivers and everything worked fine. When I would come back to another session I could not get any audio and had to mess about changing the the driver to ASIO4ALL and then somehow it would work and stay working. But another time I would have to swap this again to yes another driver (FL Studio) and perhaps back to Novation. In fact I gave up Sonar at Sonar X3 and moved to Ableton and that solved the issue for me.
 
However, I recently wanted to use the staff feature in Sonar which is not available in Ableton and then I realised, again, how good Sonar is (when it is working). I think I had forgotten why I had dumped Sonar in the first place but, bang, there it was, back again. I knew what to do but I wondered if it is really just my fault here, or does anyone else suffer from this problem.
 
Thanks
 
Jonel
 
2018/11/24 09:42:17
Kamikaze
Have you considered trying Cakewalk instead?
2018/11/24 14:19:56
Leadfoot
Have you got the latest drivers for your interface?
2018/11/24 14:55:39
jonel
Yes, I do have all the latest drivers. But it would seem this is a problem with my own setup so I will look to try and solve that,
 
Thanks though
2018/11/24 15:18:10
scook
If the same audio interface is used for Windows and SONAR make sure the sample rate is the same in Windows and SONAR.
2018/11/24 19:50:05
Steev
Wowzer, the Focusrite NIO 2 | 4 is an ancient piece of audio interface, as is SONAR X3.. Sorry to say, there is really no such thing as a great vintage piece of digital audio gear, and computer software such as DAWs and choice FX plugins and instruments mature to greatness with upgrades not age.
 
Shutting down one DAW and starting a different DAW without a fresh system boot for comparison tests can cause problems. They all handle audio very differently and may leave some configuration settings behind in system RAM memory that can weird out the path to your audio interface.
 Things can get very weird and unstable with a Focusrite shutting down Cakewalk and opening Pro Tools, as they use two very different drivers, and if memory serves me right, shutting down Ableton Life and opening Cakewalk is a crap shoot, especially if SONAR is set to use it's built in x64 sound engine that runs natively within SONAR on a x32 system.
 
My studio Rule #1 is NEVER, EVER, EVER use any audio interface drivers except those specifically designed for it by the manufacturer.
My studio Rule #2 is NEVER, EVER, EVER fall too far behind in upgrading no matter how tight your finances are, because it will not only get bone chillingly prohibitively expensive to upgrade everything at once, once eminent failure occurs, your learning curve will only get that much more bone chillingly prohibitively much difficult. 
 
 Unfortunately Focusrite most likely stopped supporting the NIO 2 | 4 around the time when Cakewalk stopped support for SONAR X3, which would be around a decade ago. In relative terms of computer technology, decades=millennia.
  Today Focusite's technology progress has matured the NIO 2 | 4 into what is now known as the Scarlett 2i4 gen 2. Not only is it the world's most popular and reliable USB audio interface, the Scarlett series are the world's fastest USB Audio interfaces supporting the lowest latency for the extremely reasonable low, low price of around $150 (us).
 EXTREMELY reasonable considering Focusrite bundles several hundreds of dollars of excellent high quality FX plugins, VSTi instruments through their on going "Plugin Collective" program which would cost you several times more than the interface itself if you purchased them through the 3rd party vendors Focusrite partners with.
 Vendors like Soft Tubes, Eventide, XLN Audio that have cut a great and well earned reputation in the world of professional world class recording.
  Opinions excluded, these vendors ALL very arguably offer up to "The Best There Is."
 Oh and you also get licensed for Ableton Live Lite (I'm not really a fan of Ableton anything), and licensing for Pro Tools First which I find myself to be objectively shockingly impressed with. It's essentially a 16 track version of Pro Tools 12 and comes with a very nice plugin bundle, all downloadable from AVID.
 MORE than enough ultra cool Pro Tools to get you hooked into being financially strapped to AVID for LIFE! LoL
 And that's why I pretty much why abandoned and orphaned my Mac Pro Tools rig for my now fossilized Windows 2000/SONAR X3 Producer workstation. May it rest in peace, it was a great friend and I will always look back in nostalgia and sincere fondness for it.
 
OK the rest is a rant, and not intended reading material for anyone easily offended and or lacks a sense of humor.
 Please stop reading now...
 
 And that being said; my beloved Windows 2000/SONAR X3 Producer workstation was without a doubt awesome and inspiring back in the day, but today it compares as a hammer, a screwdriver, and a pair of plyers in my tool box to my current Windows 10 Pro/Cakewalk by Bandlab workstation which has matured into a full blown Multi-track "Recording" studio, "Mixing" studio, "Mastering", "Video Editing" studio fully capable and really to render to any known audio and video formats including professional grade "Red Book CD, HD DVD, and 4K Blueray disc master Surround Sound authoring, and researching and preparing for the 3D sound 8K video world of Virtual Reality. Not because I want to, because that's where we're headed to.
 And soon I will be retiring this aging killer arse AMD FX 8350 based 8 core custom built workstation.
 Most likely within the year, and replacing it with a new AMD Rysen 7 based 8 core system I'm currently researching bench test results, configuring specifically for DCC (digital content creation) as opposed to gaming (slaying enemies and stealing cars without motion blur has never been my thing), and just generally preparing to build a workstation that will serve me right with the least amount of problems for the next 6 to 8 years as this one has and currently continues to do with the proper periodic preventive maintenance.
 Ya know, little things like running a system maintenance program like "PC Matic" to keep Windows and registry healthy, blowing the dust out of the case every month or so is a good idea, cloning and swapping out hard drives every 3 to 5 years or so is a great idea to keep your work files alive, well, and where you expect the to be
 I've always had much greater success, performance, and stability with AMD than I ever had with Intel i7 based systems, and at a fraction of the costs, it makes little to no sense to assume Intel is better because of hype, name recognition and inflated costs.
 And having a solid 37+ years or so in the music business with a deep desire to at least TRY not to make the same mistakes over and over again (yeah good luck with that, I've only achieved moderate success with that annoying human condition) but having a working knowledge and understanding of the processes, paths, steps, and services to use for promotion and distribution helps. 
 And sooo, even though my ancient Windows 2000/SONAR X3 Producer workstation still works as good as the day I retired it, I can't even GIVE IT AWAY! Both Catholic Charities and Salvation Army have already convinced me with pure logic the giving poor people a free computer with anything older than Window 7 on it is no act of kindness, especially if it's not even an x64 version of Win 7. Support for x32 is rapidly going, going, gone.
 
 And even I don't bother firing up the SONAR X3 Producer workstation anymore,  because this current soon to be retired workstation is still an over powered box of tools that has many kinds of hammers, full sets of screwdrivers, many types of plyers, wrenches, ratchets, and POWER TOOLS that perform their duties measured in milli seconds, as opposed to minutes, and minutes as opposed to hours it's virtual SnapOn warehouse full of high quality tools that I have practiced and experienced a deep understanding of what they are and how to use them effectively over the years.  Which in the end result, hasn't really cost me one red cent. All my out of pocket expenses have come back in spades, well into the profit margin..
 And that all happened not because I'm a rock star genius, it all happen primarily because I fully realize the natural laws of the physics of cause, effect, and consequence is always equal to the natural laws of balancing positive and negative energies. 
 And THAT's why I never quit my day job just because I fell blindly into the luck of snatching up a couple of 4 digit dollar payouts by submitting tunes for TV or movie sound tracks.
 And while it's really nice when it happens, there are no guarantees it will keep happening, only guarantees that guarantee it WON'T happen if you don't TRY to finish what you start, than submit your music submissions before dead line.
 
Recording sessions, clients actually recording in my studio are so infrequent has also dried up to now officially being considered a thing of the past. Now that technology has come to the point where anyone can make their own music at home, whether they are musicians or not, they can become some rather stiff competition for even the most accomplished musicians and artists simply learning how to use Ableton Live. Pick up the A L Push and all of a suddenly you become Diplo, Grand Master Beat Master, King or Queen of never ending Dance Hall or you can whip out 30 to 40 Hip Hop master class backing tracks a day if the muse strikes and spit all over them until you drop or run out of things to say.
 But that's not offends me about using Ableton Live, not at all, in fact I think it's some amazing mind blowing technology. As a musician and composer, Ableton Live offends me because it makes too many decisions for me that I prefer to make for myself and that throws me off course. But Cakewalk doesn't, and I pretty much mastered that DAW by SONAR Producer 4, and kept on growing and expanding with it till present day
 And so it's all OK by me, because DAWs like Garageband, Ableton Live keeps my "Mixing" and "Mastering" sessions end of the business alive.
 Some artists, while perfectly happy and inspired to create music by them selves in the comfort of their own homes or even in chaotic atmospheres of dive bars, saloons, night clubs, cafe's, or where ever still have an appreciation of the value of representing themselves with well produced and designed merchandise.
I can still make a few dollars from applying a professional mix and mastering sheen, and also make a few dollars more by offering clients a 100 retail ready CD package shipped right to their door within 2 weeks, and for an extra nominal charge, include 100 pretty, impressive, and colorful barcode scannable download cards with their mug shot(s) on them.
 Yeah I know, why bother, everybody knows CDs are out digital streaming is in.
 Except on a local level, a CD makes for one hell of a calling card that exponentially increases your fan base, while providing you with a very easy no brainer 200% to 400% CASH return on your investment.
 Download cards, and streaming services not so much, however still an important part of your promotion and revenue.
 Keep in mind while iTunes indeed pays out the highest streaming rate for indie artists, they also take out 49% for all downloadable sales, then there is credit card or PayPal fees, never mind taxes, blah, blah, blah, and pretty soon you just might come to realize that you may be the lowest paid partner in your own enterprise, and need to get famous enough to sell 10's of millions of downloads and streams before you can afford quit your day job.
 But DON'T! It's possible to sell 10's of millions of downloads if you put enough effort into it, and if everything goes right, but doubtful that everything will go right. But even if it does, it's not really sustainable, and extremely tiring to sustain the level of effort it takes to do so for too long..
 
 
 I also build custom workstations for very reasonable prices, and offer one year of premium personalized tech support.
 I do not build slopped together Procrastination Stations built from spare parts, or everything must go sales at big box discount centers.
 
 Has anyone here figured out yet why all Apple computers "Just Work" and all those  Windows computers that you purchased used and assembled by a guy named Boot from Craig's List get weird on you when you try to record?
Or maybe a too good to refuse deal with a price too low to mention at a bargain basement big box discount center may all too soon make you want to punch your mother in the mouth for giving birth to you?
Seriously, that's not Cakewalk's or any DAWs fault.
 At least Bandlab had to foresight and wisdom to drop support for x32 systems all together. 
 
making music is my catharsis.
 
 
2018/11/25 06:40:08
Kev999
Steev
...around the time when Cakewalk stopped support for SONAR X3, which would be around a decade ago...

 
Maybe it seems like a decade, but it is actually less than 4 years since Sonar X3 was discontinued.
2018/11/25 07:42:58
Cactus Music
And further more----
2018/11/25 16:26:16
robert_e_bone
jonel
Hi All,
   I have been using Sonar since version 8 and currently using X3. I had a recurrent issue with audio that I couldn't seem to pin down. I would use Sonar for a complete session using the FocusRite NIO 2 | 4 with its drivers and everything worked fine. When I would come back to another session I could not get any audio and had to mess about changing the the driver to ASIO4ALL and then somehow it would work and stay working. But another time I would have to swap this again to yes another driver (FL Studio) and perhaps back to Novation. In fact I gave up Sonar at Sonar X3 and moved to Ableton and that solved the issue for me.
 
However, I recently wanted to use the staff feature in Sonar which is not available in Ableton and then I realised, again, how good Sonar is (when it is working). I think I had forgotten why I had dumped Sonar in the first place but, bang, there it was, back again. I knew what to do but I wondered if it is really just my fault here, or does anyone else suffer from this problem.
 
Thanks
 
Jonel
 




For whatever the worth, this audio issue certainly seems to be local to your system, as that kind of issue was never widely reported, to the best of my recollection.
 
In addition, LOTS of folks have had various issues with ASIO4ALL - many times just having it installed, let alone using it (although to be fair, lots of folks also have/had used it successfully - it just is a bit of a crap shoot with it).
 
I just saw yesterday, where Sweetwater is offering the Yamaha/Steinberg UR-22 audio interface for $49.  While it only has a couple of mic/line inputs, it does work well, I have it running at the moment on my current production desktop with Windows 10 - never an issue whatsoever (I need to make some room for my Presonus audio interface and the expansion unit, but in the meantime, the UR-22 works like a champ).  You might consider picking up one of these UR-22 interfaces - they just work.
 
You might want to make sure Windows and Sonar aren't both competing for the same ASIO driver, as that can be problematic.  I always keep my Windows output set to the native Windows audio drivers, or use the HDMI ones for my HDTV that is used as a display monitor, and that way only Sonar ever uses the ASIO drivers for whatever audio interface I happen to have plugged in for a given Sonar session.
 
Bob Bone
 
2018/11/25 17:24:33
JonD
robert_e_bone
 
I just saw yesterday, where Sweetwater is offering the Yamaha/Steinberg UR-22 audio interface for $49...



It's not there at this price today.  The current sale price is $99.99 (The mentioned $50 discount has already been applied to the sale price).
 
The smaller UR12 is priced at $49.99.
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