mt_evans

Rob[atSound-Rehab]
 
Studio One supports Mackie ctrl surfaces but using the VS700 only properly supports faders and mute & solo buttons. To get the rest properly working will have to do a MIDI intercept+remapping exercise for which I use BOME MIDI translator.

 
Rob, 
 
Do you use the Bome MIDI Translator Classic 1.6.1 for Windows or the Pro 1.8 version? 
 
Also, out of the box you said Studio Ones supports faders and mute and solo.  Do you recall if any of the transport is functional? 
 
thanks

I use BOME MIDI Translator Pro 1.8
 
Sorry, haven't had much time with Studio One yet but transport is part of the Mackie protocol so that should be fine ... I can only look into Studio One when time allows ... still working Sonar just fine on projects.
 

I was a loyal Cakewalk devotee for about twenty years.  But since Gibson pulled the rug out from under us, I decided to go for the crossgrade offer for Studio One 3.5 Pro.  It has some terrific features I'm really looking forward to trying.  Of course I know there will be sacrifices...including lost functionality on my beautiful VS-700 setup.  That hurts, no doubt.  Will it be worth it in the long run?  I think so.  Naturally, there's nothing stopping me from going back to Sonar when needed, but as someone else mentioned, I would prefer to continue forward with a "living" product.  

So far I have been able to get the VS-700C up and running by using it as a Mackie controller.  Functionality is limited.  The transport works (mostly).  The faders, pan, mute, solo, arm, and select work.  The shuttle works but not the jog wheel.  The display works, including the time display (yay!).  I haven't tested everything, yet, but of course the rest of the buttons are somewhat unpredictable.  It will take a little experimentation to figure out what else works, what doesn't, and how to fix it.  It's still a good console, even without all the Sonar features.

Setting up the audio in/out routing for the VS-700R wasn't too difficult using Studio One's input matrix.  I was a little surprised the ins/outs weren't set up automatically, but no big deal.  In fact, this way you can really personalize the ins/outs and label them to suit your needs.  So that's kind of cool.

One thing I've noticed is that although Studio One picked up most of my old synths and plug-ins just fine, there's no sign of my Fantom synth plug-in.  Hopefully I'll figure out how to get that in there.  I'm not sure how to set up instrument definitions, either.  I foresee a lot of reading in my future...

If I hadn't been stuck with X2, I probably would have stayed with Sonar longer.  I had always intended to upgrade to the latest Sonar Platinum, when I had the chance.  But that obviously didn't work out as I'd planned.  I thought about crossgrading to Cubase, but their offer did not include X2 (only Platinum).  So Studio One seemed like the way to go.  I wish I could've stayed with Sonar, but it didn't work out that way.  So I'm looking forward to exploring and learning a new, cutting edge, living DAW in Studio One.  

I'm thinking of eventually upgrading to a Slate Raven control surface, which would be a major step up in any case.  I have really loved and enjoyed my VS-700, and leaving it behind will feel bittersweet.  But things change, and life goes on.  In the long run, I will have a better, more capable studio.  

Update:  Still no luck loading the Fantom VS VST plug-in.  Almost every other plug-in works fine, so I'm thinking that it's simply designed not to work outside of Sonar.  Major bummer.  I have managed to get the Fantom to play in Studio One, by setting it up as an "external instrument."   But apparently Instrument Definitions don't exist in Studio One, so changing patches is a matter of entering the bank/program number in the track inspector.  It's clumsy and irritating.  This isn't a problem only for the Fantom, but for any external hardware synth.  There's simply no elegant manner of controlling hardware synths inside Studio One, which, to put it mildly, sucks.  

I haven't quite given up yet.  Studio One seems to do some things really well, with features we'll obviously never see in Sonar.  For instance, although there's no staff view in Studio One, it can easily send and receive notation from PreSonus Notion.  Notion is a terrific notation software, especially on iPad.  This integration will really be useful. 

Speaking of iPad, Studio One has a fantastic remote control app.  I've used other iPad remote controllers for Sonar, but this is much slicker and more comprehensive.  

I get the feeling PreSonus only wants us using their hardware, like Faderport 8 (which works great, so I've heard).  While I can understand their thinking, I think they're making a tragic mistake by not offering integrated support for a wider variety of hardware.  I'm sure they'll expand that support as time goes by, but for now it's lacking.  Some part of me dared to hope that someone might have considered the VS-700, but alas...it was not to be.

Maybe I should have held out for Cubase after all?  We'll see.

Thanks for your feedback, Heather. I hope we can keep this thread alive for a bit until we got the VS700 properly working in Studio One ... unfortunately I haven't had much time and energy to pursue this myself yet. I still feel so much more comfortable pulling up the old track templates in Sonar and get right into it than figuring out software ...
 

HeatherHaze
So far I have been able to get the VS-700C up and running by using it as a Mackie controller.  Functionality is limited.  The transport works (mostly).  The faders, pan, mute, solo, arm, and select work.  The shuttle works but not the jog wheel.  The display works, including the time display (yay!).  I haven't tested everything, yet, but of course the rest of the buttons are somewhat unpredictable.  It will take a little experimentation to figure out what else works, what doesn't, and how to fix it.  It's still a good console, even without all the Sonar features.

 
Studio One advertises something called "Control Link" which looks like Sonar ACT (at least from afar). That's what I'll be checking out first to see how far I can get this to remembering custom mapping ... whatever doesn't (which are probably wrongly mapped Mackie ctrl functionality button like bank up/down) I will try to fix using a MIDI translator ...
 
Any experience with "Control Link" & VS700?

HeatherHaze
Setting up the audio in/out routing for the VS-700R wasn't too difficult using Studio One's input matrix.  I was a little surprised the ins/outs weren't set up automatically, but no big deal.  In fact, this way you can really personalize the ins/outs and label them to suit your needs.  So that's kind of cool.

 
that's something that works different. yet having the short input/output list per project is not a bad thing ... does anyone know how to turn this into something like project templates or input templates?

HeatherHaze
One thing I've noticed is that although Studio One picked up most of my old synths and plug-ins just fine, there's no sign of my Fantom synth plug-in.  Hopefully I'll figure out how to get that in there.  I'm not sure how to set up instrument definitions, either.  I foresee a lot of reading in my future...
 
Update:  Still no luck loading the Fantom VS VST plug-in.  Almost every other plug-in works fine, so I'm thinking that it's simply designed not to work outside of Sonar.  Major bummer.  I have managed to get the Fantom to play in Studio One, by setting it up as an "external instrument."   But apparently Instrument Definitions don't exist in Studio One, so changing patches is a matter of entering the bank/program number in the track inspector.  It's clumsy and irritating.  This isn't a problem only for the Fantom, but for any external hardware synth.  There's simply no elegant manner of controlling hardware synths inside Studio One, which, to put it mildly, sucks.  

 
this could be a 32bit (fantom) vs 64bit (studio one) problem ... are there any bit-bridging options in Studio One?
 
is there any kind of replacement for "instrument definitions". I use a lot of external synth and FX which I control via instrument definitions. I need to figure out a way to do this somehow in Studio One!

HeatherHaze
I get the feeling PreSonus only wants us using their hardware, like Faderport 8 (which works great, so I've heard).  While I can understand their thinking, I think they're making a tragic mistake by not offering integrated support for a wider variety of hardware.  I'm sure they'll expand that support as time goes by, but for now it's lacking.  Some part of me dared to hope that someone might have considered the VS-700, but alas...it was not to be.

 
most definitely they want us to buy faderports. anything else wouldn't make sense for a hardware vendor.
however, having been burnt once by buying a dedicated controller, I'll rather try getting the vs700 to work before buying the Faderport16 which is ~1000EUR and will not work (at least as well as the vs700) in Sonar ... so I would need 2 controllers on my desk while I still go partly with Sonar (which may be years in fact) ???

HeatherHaze
Maybe I should have held out for Cubase after all?  We'll see.

let's leave that question for later ... it is also on mind my mind ;-)

Greets all...
I can tell you that the 700C is a very solid option with Harrison Mixbus. If you have the patience you can map everything across which is pretty much what I started to do.
Buying also the Studio One u/g meant it was not well featured with the 700C as Heather mentions. For me it was simpler to (sadly) jump to the X-Touch for a controller and it is a lot easier now having solid integrations with the two packages. We spend most of our time with Studio One hence the decision to change controller.
The 700R across the two softwares was not quite as solid primarily when jumping to Mixbus which still has a development journey ahead of it IMO so there is now a Focusrite Saffire 56 on it's way.
 
My V-Studio gear is sadly currently listed on Gumtree for $200AUD each and there is little interest even at that low price. It is still excellent hardware but to continue recording in Sonar was a dead end street for us....it has been a long journey with Cake and changing platforms has shown just great a package Sonar really was/is.
All the very best wishes with your individual experiences.

One other note, the actual VS-700 hardware is working just fine.  I'm not willing to give up the VS-700R and have no reason to, especially now that the Fantom is accessible again.  Great pre-amps, plenty of ins/outs, etc.  I use the ADAT digital input to receive 8 additional channels of digital audio from across the room via a Roland VM-3100 Pro and a DIF-AT24.  I use that as my keyboard mixer.  It's old stuff but still works great.  The console still works fine with Mackie control, although obviously not as well as it did with Sonar.  I haven't played with mapping functions in Studio One, but it does seem like it should be possible.  My main issues now are really with Studio One itself, not the VS-700 system.  So...there ya go.

I realize now one of my posts didn't...well, post.  Probably user error.  In any case, the info about how I got my Fantom VS running in Studio One (and now Cubase) was omitted.  
 
The key is a program called JBridge.  JBridge basically wraps 32-bit VST plug-ins in 64-bit wrappers, so they work in 64-bit applications like Studio One and Cubase.  It costs about $20 USD and is available at https://jstuff.wordpress.com/jbridge/ .  A demo is available if you want to try it first. 
 
JBridge will create an alternate version of the Fantom VS.dll that you'll want to save in a separate JBridge folder somewhere.  Then just add that location to your VST setup in Studio One, Cubase or any other 64-bit DAW.  

Once the Fantom VS Editor is available in your DAW, you can add it to a track.  Note that in both Studio One and Cubase, you'll always need two tracks to run your Fantom, an instrument track for the Fantom VST and an audio track for the Fantom output.  

Once set up, the Fantom VS works great.  

Please note I'm using Windows 7 Pro.  I can't verify any of this for other operating systems, but I imagine it should work fine.  I believe JBridge has a Mac version as well. 

Since my last post, I came to the sad conclusion that Studio One wasn't going to cut it for me.  It's a great DAW in many ways, and I can see why so many engineers are shunning Pro Tools for Studio One.  But it falls short in a few key areas, especially regarding MIDI.  Studio One can handle the basics, but it really isn't designed for MIDI work.  The deal-breaker for me was the fact that you can't control your MIDI tracks from the console or control surface.  At all.  They don't get their own channel strips, and there's no easy way to mix them.  Ugh.  It's a "requested feature" but for now, it's really not usable for a lot of my work.  It handles audio like a champ, and I already used it to mix a 51 minute solo set for myself.  When I'm wearing my composer's hat, however, it's completely inadequate.  

So, I made the logical next step to Cubase.  Mind you, none of this was cheap, but I did at least get their competitive crossgrade.  So basically I got both Studio One and Cubase for the cost of Cubase, alone.  And it's not like I'll never use Studio One, either.  It's a great choice for mastering, with its integrated project editor.  For all work involving MIDI, however, I'll be turning to Cubase.  That is, when I'm not still using my trusty old Sonar.

Cubase is much more like Sonar than Studio One.  It has a similar range of features and customization.  It is a complex and infinitely tweakable application.  One really awesome feature that soars way beyond Sonar is the score editor.  Wow!  You can set up a very accurate score right inside the program.  It looks great and works like a charm.  

Getting back to the VS-700, the audio works really well, as expected.  The Fantom works well too, with the JBridge fix (I only had to run JBridge once, the "wrapped" VST works fine in both Studio One and Cubase).  The VS-700c Console is another story.  I mean, it works.  Basically.  Very basically.  The faders work, along with solo, mute, arm, and select.  The transport works (mostly).  The shuttle wheel works (slowly).  Bank +8/-8 buttons work, but are reversed.  Oddly, the pan controls don't seem to work.  Everything else is "press at your own risk".  I pressed about every button trying to figure out what they do, but most of them either don't work, or do something mysterious.  I haven't been able to figure out how to map functions to the VS-700c, if it's even possible.  So...it's usable but far from satisfying.  
 
I hope this helps someone out there.  It's been quite an adventure.  One thing I have learned for sure, if you're happy with Sonar, and don't have any compelling reason to jump ship...by all means keep using it.  The more I use other apps, the more I appreciate how great Sonar is (was).  I'll always enjoy going back to it, like coming home.  But I'm also enjoying exploring everything Cubase has to offer (which is a lot).  

HeatherHaze
The VS-700c Console is another story.  I mean, it works.  Basically.  Very basically.  The faders work, along with solo, mute, arm, and select.  The transport works (mostly).  The shuttle wheel works (slowly).  Bank +8/-8 buttons work, but are reversed.  Oddly, the pan controls don't seem to work.  Everything else is "press at your own risk".  I pressed about every button trying to figure out what they do, but most of them either don't work, or do something mysterious.  I haven't been able to figure out how to map functions to the VS-700c, if it's even possible.  So...it's usable but far from satisfying.  
 
I hope this helps someone out there.  It's been quite an adventure.  One thing I have learned for sure, if you're happy with Sonar, and don't have any compelling reason to jump ship...by all means keep using it.  The more I use other apps, the more I appreciate how great Sonar is (was).  I'll always enjoy going back to it, like coming home.  But I'm also enjoying exploring everything Cubase has to offer (which is a lot).  

sounds familiar ... and is the reason why I stick to Sonar for anything serious for the time being. i played around a bit with Studio One and managed to hookup/configure up my external keyboards and synths but that took me several hours ... so I realized that the vs700C will be at least a couple more hours as the intuitive config of the external synths didn't work likewise for the vs700c in mackie mode.
 
BTW i believe the mackie mode has been implemented only in a rudimentary way in the vs700 (plus has some bugs like the switched buttons ... which are switched in Studio One and Mixbus ... so most likely the vs700 having it wrong here)

Rob[atSound-Rehab]
 
sounds familiar ... and is the reason why I stick to Sonar for anything serious for the time being. i played around a bit with Studio One and managed to hookup/configure up my external keyboards and synths but that took me several hours ... so I realized that the vs700C will be at least a couple more hours as the intuitive config of the external synths didn't work likewise for the vs700c in mackie mode.
 
BTW i believe the mackie mode has been implemented only in a rudimentary way in the vs700 (plus has some bugs like the switched buttons ... which are switched in Studio One and Mixbus ... so most likely the vs700 having it wrong here)

I understand.  I found the VS-700c a little easier to set up in Studio One as opposed to Cubase.  The controls and display also seem to work better (less crazy, more workable).  I also believe Studio One has more configuration options, but I haven't dived into that yet.  For now I'm focusing mainly on Cubase because it suits my needs better, in spite of the limited console functions.  

You're probably right about the VS-700c and its rudimentary Mackie compatibility.  Oh well...

Hey everyone, long time CW and Splat user....and forum lurker.  I thought I'd chime in because I was also searching for an alternate DAW.  I found Reaper, have been playing with demo for a while.  I'm not sure it's the right DAW for me, especially concerning using the VS700 system.  However, I did stumble upon a discussion thread about creating a more robust control surface integrator.  https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=183143&page=25 
 
I stepped in and provided a full map of the midi control addresses for the entire console.  Looks like that project is in the alpha stage right now.  I have given up on Reaper (for now) so I haven't had the time to delve into the alpha release yet, but if you're interested please check it out.  If it works, it will probably be the only other place to get absolute full functionality out of the console.
 
Dave