This gives me a deja vu feeling.

I seem to remember a thread where there was an aud.ini setting that changed whether or not mute affected post fader busses, could there be a related setting that would make the faders behave like the above quoted VCA mode?

ORIGINAL: MatsonMusicBox

It's actually really flexible as you can something belong to multiple groups at the same time - I think you can get "most" of the way there with groups and busses in SONAR. VCA technology is the standard grouping methodology in high end desks.

Let's see taking the OP's original requirements - he could:

Put all of library 1 on buss A
Put all of library 2 on buss B
Group Violins together
Group Violas together
Group Cellos together
Groups Basses together

I actually think that covers it per his original request.

You managed to explain it far better than I could...! Yes this would essentially be it - I had never thought of it that way before. Thanks!

I was getting hung up on the fact that you couldn't assign controls to multiple groups.

I've just come from using a PM1/D on a large gig, and before that I was using a Euphonix console on a mixdown. We couldn't have done either the show or the premix without VCAs/DCAs. It just semed such a flexible way to route things - or more specifically, not route things, because the VCA channels do not carry audio in themselves, but act as a controller for other channels, for each of which you can assign the response curve - or envelope - of the VCA to the channel.

Given the growing situation where people mix multiple sample libraries for big orchestral projects, this appears on NONE of the current DAW systems (with the exception of Nuendo *with* the Euphonix console - but that console costs tens of thousands!)

Martin

ORIGINAL: FirmamentFX

Given the growing situation where people mix multiple sample libraries for big orchestral projects, this appears on NONE of the current DAW systems (with the exception of Nuendo *with* the Euphonix console - but that console costs tens of thousands!)

Martin

Here's my cue... ready???

Pro Tools HD has it!

Ok, I gotta run now before the Cakewalk cult lynches me...

Haha!! How did I know that one was coming?

Yeah... but Tools is a top end system (whether it deserves to be or not is another matter, and another topic entirely) - and the hardware dependant nature of it - the HD system anyway, which is really the only worthwhile one (and native RTAS but no VST support) means it will always be one step above and beyond.

I can have a 3 PC system with Sonar, 32 outputs from each farm machine into 64 in the main box, for about £4000. Tools HD doesn't even come close to that Value.

The more I think about it, a simple way to achieve this would be to allow each control in Sonar to be assigned to multiple groups. Sure, there is a certain complexity to the logic of the controls (a control that is part of Group A and Group C for example, when being controlled as part of Group C, must not alter any other Group A controls) but nothing that the bakers couldn't work out I'm sure ;)

That, along with MIDI sends, would push Sonar into a real top orchestral scoring workstation (again, and as always, IMHO!).

Martin

Maybe I am misunderstanding the question but the answer as I see it is one word....Groups. Press F1 and learn how to create/assign/rename automation groups.

Absolutely "groups". Learn how to use them... Love them.

I'll throw in my vote for VCA's too. VCA's are very nice and different than using a bus.

This is because if you turn down the volume of a bus, all of the effects routed out of the sends on those individual tracks that route to the bus will lose their relationship to the dry signal.

For example. Let's say you have all your drum tracks routed to your drum bus. Your snare track probably has a different amount of reverb on it then your Kick and etc., thus you have the reverb sends on the individual tracks, not on the bus. Well, if you turn your bus all the way down, notice you still hear all the reverb from the auxillary sends of the individual drum tracks. So, if you turn up the volume on the drum bus, the drums will have less reverb. If you turn the volume down on the drum bus, it will have more reverb. This is usually the exact opposite of what you really want.

A VCA is really nice because you control the actual volume of all of the individual tracks with one fader. Because of this, the auxillary sends maintain their relationship with the dry output.

You can use groups, but that can become very messy when you are automating volume changes on 12 or so drum tracks. Plus, there will be times that you might just want the snare louder, or the toms louder and etc. This leads to really messy automation that a VCA can definitely make easier and cleaner.

Yes, having a VCA-type function to control groups of faders, without actually passing audio through a separate buss AND have this to where you could automate it would be great.

Both Samplitude and Studio one have VCA faders. I have not found a use for them yet. I have both of those DAWs as will as Sonar. Then I don't use groups much either. I do use buses though. 
 
The interesting thing that was posted above about sends being not well controlled with buses v VCA is a little bit interesting but may not be much of a problem in reality.  Buses can be a source for a send too. That seems to me to handle the issue described above well enough.
 
In the end it wouldn't hurt Sonar to have VCA faders as an option. I just think their usage as being a requirement is  a little exaggerated. Nice to have but not a requirement.   

I see how you can write-enable automation for the fader/control surface to where moving one fader controls the group and writes the automation moves, but how would you get a VCA-type function, using just the automation lanes, nodes, etc.? It looks like this just changes the particular track you make the changes to, not the other tracks is the group.