Snehankur
Right now I have just finished a video
Sound Design Tutorial: Layering Drums - Native Instruments Battery 4 w/ Evan Sutton
now noticed the duration is 11:19

I've watched a few of Evan Sutton's videos on Lynda.com, he has an excellent style of presentation and gets things across very clearly. His Battery 4 course is very good, as is his "tips on how to get projects finished" or whatever it's called. Very EDM oriented of course but loads of great general tips in there. I'm watching his Absynth course now. I get access to all of the Lynda videos free with my NYC library card and have been very impressed with their range of audio tutorials.

Tom Riggs
The main reason I do not use the start screen is that it slows me down when starting.

I really like the Start Screen but because takes a different amount of time to open each time I keep it off.
Will Analytics know this?

Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
One thing to look at is that the definition of DAW's is changing and we need to cater to all classes of users who use the program completely differently from you and me. Producers and mix engineers are a relatively small segment of those who use music software. If we want to stay relevant we need to satisfy a wide set of users.

Noel, are you in a position to expand on this?
I can think of Video and Game producers. Composers also post here.
Edit: Oh, and some people have said they use it live. So - Backing track fly-ins to live shows?
Maybe DJs?

jpetersen

Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
One thing to look at is that the definition of DAW's is changing and we need to cater to all classes of users who use the program completely differently from you and me. Producers and mix engineers are a relatively small segment of those who use music software. If we want to stay relevant we need to satisfy a wide set of users.

Noel, are you in a position to expand on this?

Read his lips: producers and sound engineers are a small segment of Sonar's user base. So, what's the majority? The casual users and total beginners. They are the ones Sonar is catering to: have you seen the "Add Track" and "LANDR" 'features' in the latest upgrade?

This should be a wake-up call for those who expect Sonar to be competitive with mainstream DAWs like ProTools, Studio One, Logic, Reaper, etc. - the right path for Cakewalk (for financial reasons: LANDR, analytics, etc. are marketing decisions meant to increase revenue) is to make Sonar into the simplest, most powerful, 'beginner-friendliest' software in the entry-level DAW market.

It's a huge gamble that will likely fail because most casual users won't pay for the software they use, while more experienced users will just move on to more robust platforms that cater to their professional needs.

If dumbed-down recording software had any future, Magix Music Maker would be selling like hotcakes...

In any case, a more interesting topic - to me at least - would be Cakewalk's full disclosure of EXACTLY what data is being gathered. Does it go beyond program usage? Does it go beyond Sonar?

And, no, I'm not worried on a personal level: Sonar has never been my main DAW. Odds are I will just completely uninstall once the current project that required I use it is over. Sonar - to me - is a pretty decent DAW being butchered by some very disturbing trends...

irvin
 Sonar - to me - is a pretty decent DAW being butchered by some very disturbing trends...

In what ways do you think it has got worse?

John T

irvin
Sonar - to me - is a pretty decent DAW being butchered by some very disturbing trends...

In what ways do you think it has got worse?

for me, it's really got worse with the whole online authentication/ccc... historically, one of sonar's selling points used to be the simple registration/authorisation process, then we got the ilok-requiring softube prochannel bits, now the ccc... smacks of desperation to me - how long have gibson given anderton to "make a go" of this? what KPIs are they looking at? the blustering defensiveness in the forums is a sure sign of such behind the scenes activity..
 
regarding the analytics generally, this stuff is usually for a company to work out how to best monetise something (in this case sonar), not necessarily to identify new areas of feature development, and as has been stated, it's not for identifying bugs... i expect to see more "dlc", loops and stuff... i'd also be interested to know how the steam sales compare to non-steam, as we know artist is the biggest seller version-wise... i'm sure cakewalk can make more money selling to the new-user/one-button crowd, rather than the pros, and i think things like style dials show this effort in action

irvin

jpetersen

Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
One thing to look at is that the definition of DAW's is changing and we need to cater to all classes of users who use the program completely differently from you and me. Producers and mix engineers are a relatively small segment of those who use music software. If we want to stay relevant we need to satisfy a wide set of users.

Noel, are you in a position to expand on this?

Read his lips: producers and sound engineers are a small segment of Sonar's user base. So, what's the majority? The casual users and total beginners. They are the ones Sonar is catering to:

 
My question was honestly intended. But if it's to do with forward-looking strategy, I can understand the Bakers' reticence.
 
Making Sonar accessible to beginners is not a bad thing. I feel like a beginner every time I try something new (thanks to Craig's Tips)

irvin
This should be a wake-up call for those who expect Sonar to be competitive with mainstream DAWs like ProTools, Studio One, Logic, Reaper, etc. - the right path for Cakewalk
...
If dumbed-down recording software had any future, Magix Music Maker would be selling like hotcakes...

When I explain what I do, many times I get asked "Oh, do you use Magix?" Those with studio experience assume ProTools or Steinberg. Logic is also known.
 
But Cakewalk Sonar? Blank expressions.
 
We can argue about how best to change this, but basically, it's not good for our future with Sonar.

irvin
And, no, I'm not worried on a personal level: Sonar has never been my main DAW.

 
Ah. OK.

irvin
Read his lips: producers and sound engineers are a small segment of Sonar's user base. So, what's the majority? The casual users and total beginners. They are the ones Sonar is catering to: have you seen the "Add Track" and "LANDR" 'features' in the latest upgrade?

This should be a wake-up call for those who expect Sonar to be competitive with mainstream DAWs like ProTools, Studio One, Logic, Reaper, etc. - the right path for Cakewalk (for financial reasons: LANDR, analytics, etc. are marketing decisions meant to increase revenue) is to make Sonar into the simplest, most powerful, 'beginner-friendliest' software in the entry-level DAW market.

It's a huge gamble that will likely fail because most casual users won't pay for the software they use, while more experienced users will just move on to more robust platforms that cater to their professional needs.

If dumbed-down recording software had any future, Magix Music Maker would be selling like hotcakes...

In any case, a more interesting topic - to me at least - would be Cakewalk's full disclosure of EXACTLY what data is being gathered. Does it go beyond program usage? Does it go beyond Sonar?

And, no, I'm not worried on a personal level: Sonar has never been my main DAW. Odds are I will just completely uninstall once the current project that required I use it is over. Sonar - to me - is a pretty decent DAW being butchered by some very disturbing trends...

That's not exactly what I meant. I didn't mean that "beginner" users were the majority, rather that the majority are users who are producing their own music - i.e singer songwriters, solo artists and bands who like to record and produce their own music. Fewer musicians are going to recording studios these days because of the costs and the fact that its very hard for most to make a profit on sales of CD's. So increasing numbers of people are using digital media and producing the music themselves. These people are hardly beginners - they can be very accomplished musicians and even have a fair amount of DAW experience though they may not have more traditional audio engineering skills. They are a different class of user and all DAW's that want to stay relevant have to cater to this audience. We have several users who fit this category even on our forums. I think the word pro gets associated very narrowly these days with only recording engineers who make a living producing others. Those are the users who are in the minority not the ones who use music software as a tool to produce their own music.
 
We are NOT dumbing down the software by catering to them at all but rather exposing functionality that enhances their workflow. Our plan is certainly NOT to dumb down the software.

pwalpwal
for me, it's really got worse with the whole online authentication/ccc... historically, one of sonar's selling points used to be the simple registration/authorisation process, then we got the ilok-requiring softube prochannel bits, now the ccc... smacks of desperation to me - how long have gibson given anderton to "make a go" of this? what KPIs are they looking at? the blustering defensiveness in the forums is a sure sign of such behind the scenes activity..
 
regarding the analytics generally, this stuff is usually for a company to work out how to best monetise something (in this case sonar), not necessarily to identify new areas of feature development, and as has been stated, it's not for identifying bugs... i expect to see more "dlc", loops and stuff... i'd also be interested to know how the steam sales compare to non-steam, as we know artist is the biggest seller version-wise... i'm sure cakewalk can make more money selling to the new-user/one-button crowd, rather than the pros, and i think things like style dials show this effort in action

We moved to this model to support frequent updates and to allow for a scaleable business model.
If you are against any model that has any authentication or any online activity you are going to be disappointed with any modern software developed today, not just SONAR. You see modern software development as desperation? :) And I don't see how us trying to explain our strategy is defensive. Would you prefer that we didn't discuss it at all like we are doing here?
Also analytics is not just for market research its also actively used for application development. Look at how Microsoft uses analytics in this article that someone posted which is very developer centric.

jpetersen
My question was honestly intended. But if it's to do with forward-looking strategy, I can understand the Bakers' reticence.
Making Sonar accessible to beginners is not a bad thing. I feel like a beginner every time I try something new 

 
 
Its a forward looking strategy but its absolutely NOT for beginners. The term beginner gets tossed around in an almost derogatory way here. Modern software should be designed to adapt to a wide array of workflows whether it be a pro engineer or someone who just wants to create some music but who doesn't have engineering chops. One is certainly not a beginner if they aren't an engineer. There are different kinds of users and we need to be careful to support them all.