• Features & Ideas
  • Feature R... Midi Multi Band Frequency Filter w the Ability to Solo the Individual Bands
2016/02/20 10:48:39
kennywtelejazz
 
I would like to have a Multi Band Midi Frequency Filter that would allow me to solo the midi note range frequency's and set it to the ranges of my choice ...  
Just Like a Multi Band Audio Compressor that has the ability to solo the chosen frequency's and set the dynamics across the audio spectrum .
Think  GUI along the lines of the Sonitus Multi Band com-presser ..... also , I would like this Midi Multi Band Midi Frequency Filter to be a stock plug included in SONAR not a 3 rd party ...
 
A 4 band Multi Band Midi Frequency Filter would be nice
 
Kenny
2016/02/20 19:00:34
jpetersen
You mean as in selecting all notes from, say, C4 to C5 and pulling up the softer velocities to higher levels proportionally?
2016/02/21 07:35:22
kennywtelejazz
jpetersen
You mean as in selecting all notes from, say, C4 to C5 and pulling up the softer velocities to higher levels proportionally?




not exactly ,
I'm thinking more along the lines of other things ...my apology for not being clear , it is hard for me to put it into words ..... 
 
Let me just keep trying ...
 
OK simple terms for an example of what it is I'm looking for ,
 
I would like to be able to take a single track midi file of a great Piano Player and be able to set where I want the Bass to be , where I want the treble to be and then be able to filter out one or the other ...
edit either or , and be able to transpose independently...and export what I chose to keep ...
that's a two stage ...
 
for a 3 stage Multi filter while in midi   I would like to be able to set a bass range , a chord range and a top line or melody range and have the ability to edit at will , set the ranges at will , transpose , and export at will any section I may choose too...independently of each other 
 
4 and more stages plus ....the same as above with the included ability to extract rhythms , edit to scale preference , and the ability to create chords and arpeggios ...
 
there's more I want to keep it simple for now ...
 
Kenny
2016/02/21 09:46:20
azslow3
kennywtelejazz
jpetersen
You mean as in selecting all notes from, say, C4 to C5 and pulling up the softer velocities to higher levels proportionally?

not exactly ,

Since MIDI is strictly digital, each note has Pitch and Velocity and there is no way to predict how loud final synth is going to be when let say there is a chord instead of single note (and so usual "compressor" technology is hard to apply), there are not many variants:
1) simple MIDI Note range, for example C4 to C5 (exists in the Event Filter MFX)
2) velocity scaling per note, for example C4 -> 0.5, D4 -> 0.6 ... A4-> 1. (so, some "slope" of "EQ"). Not sure either such MFX exists, but that is easy to write.
 

 and be able to transpose independently...and export what I chose to keep ...
that's a two stage ...

So, Transpose MFX.
 
And so we have 3 FXes (Select/EQ/Transpose) for 3 bands.
 
In current Sonar we have a small problem with that: one MIDI track can not be routed to several VSTi. So, either you are bound to multi instrument (TTS-1) for audition, you need arbitrary MIDI routing in Sonar (there are such requests) or you simply copy the clip and process each "band" separately.
 
In the last case, you do not need "multiband" functionality and you can do this now (except EQ style filtering).
 
kennywtelejazz
 ..... also , I would like this Midi Multi Band Midi Frequency Filter to be a stock plug included in SONAR not a 3 rd party ...

The most problematic part of your requist. That imply many Sonar users also want that (since the price will be included into Sonar). That is hard to imagine. I (while I can develop "MIDI EQ" part within a hour) definitively do not want pay extra for such feature.
 
Another direction is to find VST MIDI processor. There are many since Sonar is the only DAW with DX style MFXes. Unlike Sonar MFX, VST can produce several MIDI outputs are so routed to different instruments without problem.
2016/02/21 10:28:24
jpetersen
 A single-track MIDI file is just a bunch of keyboard note numbers. There is no intrinsic concept of Bass, or Treble, in MIDI. And definitely no concept of Frequencies as such. The piano sound will be tuned to equal temperament. But another instrument might be tuned to a just intonation, meaning the same notes will have slightly different fundamental frequencies.
 
Not only that, the MIDI note numbers could trigger a piano sound in the traditional way, but could also trigger drums, atonal sound effects, orchestra cresendos, complete song phrases or even control lights.
 
A piano player might play with both hands way up on the high end of a piano, then do a long cadenza down to the bottom. At all times, the left hand is the "bass", the right hand the "treble". It would take an artifical intelligence algorithm to figure out what's what, it would only work on keyboard playing and it would probably still make mistakes.
 
There are, of course, tools that transpose to another key, suggest chord cycles to inspire songwriters, etc.
 
Sonar has a whole bunch of these MIDI tools. Thanks to your post, I started making a list to reply to you, but gave up because I am beginning to realize there's an amazingly large number of them.
 
I am currently working on a MIDI-intensive project (which is why this caught my attention), but it's becoming clear I can benefit greatly by stopping for a while and just familiarize myself with what's already in Sonar. I remember Craig's Tip of the Week had some MIDI stuff, too. I'll go through that as well.
2016/02/21 11:16:16
jpetersen
2016/02/21 11:24:51
kennywtelejazz
jpetersen
Craig made a brave attempt to explain this monstrous dialog.
http://forum.cakewalk.com/Fridays-Tip-of-the-Week-81-The-Other-MultiFX-Shoe-Drops-m3074655-p14.aspx#3365362
 




That may turn out to be useful , thank you
 
Kenny
2016/02/21 11:40:30
scook
I am pretty sure you can do want you want with the available MFX plug-ins. It will require a separate MIDI track for each range of notes (aka band). The MFX plug-ins involved would be the Event Filter to create the note range for the track, Velocity to adjust the dynamics and Transpose to alter the note values or set to scale. There are several other MFX plug-ins you might find interesting. The tracks themselves provide the Mute/Solo functions for each band. Drum maps also provide an additional layer of control.
2016/02/22 04:52:29
kennywtelejazz
Hello scook ,
What you have described workflow wise is pretty much how I have been "approaching it " when I go there ....in midi ..
It seem a little counter-intuitive to have to clone everything ...not that I have a big problem with that ...
On the audio side of things I remember Craig doing a tips and tricks example in a SONAR advanced video I had purchased .
IIRC , in his example  he took an audio guitar track , cloned it (i think it was 4 times ) then he soloed certain frequency's  on each track while using the all Sonitus Multi Bands to isolate , enhance and redirect the frequency's for various panning and stereo effects ... cool thing for audio ...
 
As far as my intended use for what I have proposed as my feature request ...
 
I thought I have my intended use somewhat clear ...
 
to no one in particular 
As far as who's gonna pay for what ? I more than willing to go third party at this point ...
 
Oh BTW ,
The is a ton of features in SONAR that mean absolutely nothing to me ... yet I happened to purchase the program and pay for them too ...
 
Great I spend two hours coming up with my own little set up using Midi effects on a midi track and then I find out  I can't save it as a user defined Midi effects chain ...WTF ? ....
 
IMHO the midi effects in SPlat should be able to surpass what I had in SONAR 5 and Project 5 because those programs were out a mere  10 years ago  ....apparently they don't ...how sad ...

 
Kenny
 
2016/02/22 06:43:32
azslow3
kennywtelejazz
to no one in particular 
As far as who's gonna pay for what ? I more than willing to go third party at this point ...
 
Oh BTW ,
The is a ton of features in SONAR that mean absolutely nothing to me ... yet I happened to purchase the program and pay for them too ...

In case that is the reaction on my comment, may be you have misinterpreted it. What I thought was:
1) if there are not many users who also want the feature, the chance Cakewalk implement it is small
2) if you are ready to use third party tools, there can be something already available or that can be developed by someone, for example by me... if I understand what you want, that is possible to write and you are not going to refuse the result just because it is not from Cakewalk (money are not involved, all tools I develop for Sonar so far are free to use).
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