• SONAR
  • Guitar effects (p.2)
2017/07/23 13:54:35
chuckebaby
Agentcalm
Thanks guys..    Some good tips there.   This will save me buying guitar pedals only to find I'm not gone on their.   I'll download some plug ins first such as amp sims, reverb etc.  
Thanks again all :) 
 


You didn't mention which version of Sonar you are using ?
Not that it matters that much but better versions come with better plug ins.
Digital audio recording is very similar to the old school way of doing it (well almost).
You record a dry track and use FX during the mixing stages. In most cases now a day, most home studio users are recording dry DI/line level guitar in to an amp sim and then adding FX later.
Where as 10 years ago, almost all tracks were recorded with distortion, through an amplifier and then adding FX later in the mixing stages.
2017/07/23 14:36:44
tlw
Be prepared to be a little disapointed by "emulations" of some guitar stuff. Fuzzes, overdrives, distortions and wahs/filters in particular. Many "emulations' aren't very close to what they are supposed to sound and respond like. Guitars are also a very touch-sensitive instrument and many emulations just aren't.

And be prepared to put much more work in to get a decent sound than you would have to with a "conventional" guitar setup.

Give it a try though, the emulators do seem to work OK for many people. My particular hangup with them being that I can set up a chain of stuff that's supposed to be accurate emulations of the hardware I'm used to and it doesn't come close. The Amplitube Mesa Boogies, a couple of their Fenders and Scuffham's amp emulations are the ones I've found to be the most natural in sound and feel.
2017/07/23 15:11:18
Agentcalm
Thanks guys .  Im using a very basic X3 so if I dont have a lot of built in stuff I can upgrade to Artist or Pro.  Its not that expensive to upgrade and I think its only about 200 bucks.  So not bad at all.
Thanks TLW , I'll bear that in mind.   What I'd like to try is an emulation of things like Phaser or reverb and if I think it sounds ok I can then go buy a decent pedal of that type of effect.
Im hoping the plug ins will allow me to sort of take it on a test drive so to speak. 
2017/07/23 15:16:11
space_cowboy
The Amplitube package is great.  More versatile sounds than most of the other plug ins.  Revalver is good too and you can run VSTs from inside it.  That means my Sound Toys stuff is available, and it is excellent for delays, chorus, phasing....  And I like the TH 3 thing Sonar includes.  Guitar Rig sounds thin to me.  I had some Wave amp sim but never liked it.  Ditto on Vandal.  Never tried Studio Devil.  
 
I really love the Universal Audio amp sims, but you have to own a UA card or interface to run their plugins.  
 
One thing to think about... 6msec of latency is equivalent to standing about 6 feet from your amp.  You can shoot for lower latency, but I am not sure below 6 is buying you much.    
2017/07/23 15:49:40
lapasoa
davidt64 got the right answer. Turn on input echo on the track and then put the effects you like on FX.
That's it.
 
2017/07/23 20:42:11
JohnEgan
chuckebaby
You record a dry track and use FX during the mixing stages. In most cases now a day, most home studio users are recording dry DI/line level guitar in to an amp sim and then adding FX later.

Good to have dry guitars tracks to experiment with some FX and amp sims after recording, but when creating/improvising solo's, hooks, even some rhythms, you really need the FX applied, amp sound and volume levels while playing, as it affects the way you play and inspires some of the sounds that you create which you may not create playing/listening dry, and many sounds you can't easily reproduce later by simply adding FX, (say like expressions and feedback), I guess splitting the signal and recording both the dry and wet on separate tracks would be ideal. I do usually record direct, (not mic'd), from amp using MESA CabClone, and rarely monitor the electric guitar Im recording through the DAW/Amp Sims/FX, and studio monitors or headphones, although have done so to experiment with some of the FX chain presets sounds, not saying its a bad thing if you're getting sound you want without latency issues. If I do want to record/monitor dry electric plugged directly into audio interface or often with acoustic guitar I would be monitoring direct signal from audio interface mixer not going through DAW. 
 
Otherwise not sure if its feasible/safe to route guitar through AI/DAW/FX and out into a guitar amp to make use of DAW FX through a guitar amp? (I guess you'd need to convert line level back down to a mic/instrument level or the amp would need to have a line input available?).
 
Cheers     
 
2017/07/23 21:01:41
Thedoccal
The answer is yes.
 
But you can do even more.  Plug your guitar into your amp AND your computer's sound card at the same time.  Then you can play through your amp with all your favorite live effects and play with mojo, while recording the direct signal into a track in Sonar.  You can even record both, then try and match your amp sound with plugins on the computer.  It is a worthwhile exercise.  All you need is a Y cable for your guitar cable.  In addition, when you decide to buy Melodyne, you have a perfect direct, dry signal in one track to tidy up all that needs tidying.
2017/07/23 22:20:15
Agentcalm
Hi John.   Just on the point you were making about the need to lay the guitar with the effects in real time rather than later.  Thats exactly what i want to do and for the reasons you mentioned.  Its pointless trying to play a solo on a clean guitar with the  aim of adding distortion later.  
By the way its working great so thanks to all fro the above suggestions.
Hi T   Thats a great idea of using the amps DI to go straight to the DAW.  I could mic the amp and use a DI at the same time.   Very cool.  
Space cowboy suggested Revalver and Amplitude so I'll go search for those and start playing around.   Up n runnin guys.  Thanks again. 
2017/07/24 12:01:11
JohnEgan
Thedoccal
All you need is a Y cable for your guitar cable.  



Not sure, as I understand it a simple Y cable would also split the signal strength, and possibly cause impedance mismatch issues, usually its recommended to use a buffered signal splitter to maintain original signal strength and tone from guitar going to both the outputs. There may also be ground loop concerns to be wary of between the dry guitar signal and amp output signals both going into audio interface, not sure splitter prevents that possibility (in my case my CabClone has a ground float switch (and phase invert), which may help grounding issues. It would be a good experiment/exercise/challange to see how well an amp-sim through studio monitors or headphones could emulate a real tube amp, amp-sim may seem OK itself, but compared side to side, not sure  
Otherwise, I guess a 3rd track option could also be mic'ing the amplifier.
 
Cheers  
2017/07/24 12:50:43
JohnEgan
Agentcalm
Hi John.   Just on the point you were making about the need to lay the guitar with the effects in real time rather than later.  



Yea, we're on the same page there for sure, and glad you got it working. I would like to try to use some of the plug-in FX routed to my guitar amp, just to hear how they'd sound, also would be easier adjusting FX setting on screen rather than getting down on floor adjusting hardware pedals. (getting older its harder to get back up, LOL). Im thinking I could do it as an external send, as my go to amp also has external send and receive connections, another "to-do" item. Honestly though I haven't really even touched my hardware FX pedal board for years since I got a Mesa-Boogie amp, typically I can get the sound I want from it alone and its output is my dry track, (may also be cuz Im getting older to, LOL). But do often add extra or special FX's, in Sonar production, so splitting and recording a dry guitar signal track simultaneously is a good idea to have as a reference track, however not sure a simple Y cable splitter is best option.
 
Cheers  
© 2026 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1

Use My Existing Forum Account

Use My Social Media Account