ORIGINAL: mildew

ORIGINAL: Ogis


I doubt anyone will take you seriously. If I were you, I'd move on to other topics, you are starting to dig yourself a hole...

if you did not take my opinion seriously, you would not bother to keep fanning the flames.

i posted a link above to some music i recently produced. im the only person in the thread so far with enough balls to back up my opinions with a link to my playing.


m

Good on you, I bailed on it, it was painful, but I believe you. Here's one I went through three drummers til I found one who could play with a click. It was a replacement track for a drum machine.
www.caveffect.com/Guilty2.mp3

so its not actually you drumming?

ive backed up my personal opinions with actual recordings of me playing all the instruments to a click, so i guess i had better quit this thread now:)


m

Hmm. Sarcasm or not?

Oh, I'm NEVER sarcastic!

;)

ORIGINAL: madratter

ORIGINAL: manfriday

Good drummers are really easy to find though, so you should not have any trouble replacing him with someone more obedient.

Hmm. Sarcasm or not?

Thats what I was thinking. If you have a ton of "good" drummers running around, where in the world do you live

btw mildew I haven't recorded anything in a long time other than DAW stuff. I don't have anything I was percussion on, on my PC. Yet that's neither here nor there. You said that drummers aren't musicians at all. You also said the only drummers that are any good, are drummers that play sometimes on the side. I am saying that shows your ignorance. That's like saying someone that sings in the shower twice a year is the best vocalist. It's just a very ignorant thing to say. BTW, ignorant means you don't know any better. I'm not calling you stupid, I'm calling you ignorant. It's not a flame if it's a fact. I do not flame people.

Imho, drum teachers do their students a great disservice by not having them play with a metronome or
click as part of their early training.

i learned piano and my teacher made me do metronome from the get-go .. to this day, i find it
no big deal to play to a click track .. because i did it as a kid. invariably, everytime i work with
a drummer that wanders, they have confessed that they either haven't practiced with a metronome
or said they "did it for a while" .. it wasn't a big part of their training.

jeff

This is one of the best "internet tough-guy" situations I've ever seen. You guys are hilarious.

And by the way, mildew... my dad can beat up your dad. Seriously.

Timing is aquired by experience.
I've played with drummers that could follow a click track ( bass sequences, keyboard / synth parts, horn parts on the laptop ) in head phones, live, and make the band really happen.

I've also played with drummers that couldn't keep time and even had no clue that they couldn't keep time.

An "experienced" and well rounded drummer has no problem with click tracks.
They know how to listen, they know how to mix it with their own sound so it isn't competing.

you're right on about that Steve. you can tell a studio cat because they trained to
laser-lock .. you can turn off the click after the count-in and they don't budge. it's
not an accident. what i find amusing is when they tell you the drift was intentional ..
as if the piece called for it ... ;-)
jeff

ORIGINAL: ByronSanto

My gigging band is 150% sequenced so my drummer is forced to play with a click. After 14 years of using a click my drummer has developed the technique of playing ahead or behind the click. So the drums now have movement. He can make the tempo appear that it's rushing or dragging and all while staying in time. Playing in time is critical but being able to play the entire kit or one inst of the kit ahead or behind the beat is critical for a grooving drum beat.

Through our 14 years of working together we have also developed quite a few tricks in using a click track.

Maybe it's because I'm another bass player/composer, but I agree with this 100%. The click is the reference. You don't have to play your snare right on it. It all depends on what kind of feel you want.

In this day and age of MIDI, not having a click as a point of reference for live drum recording is insane. My last band had a fantastic drummer; awesome chops, great sound...one of the best players I've ever seen.......live. He completely falls apart in the studio when given a click. So because of the absence of the click, it makes doing sequencing of keyboard parts very difficult, calculating delays, etc., etc.

I actually have wanted to use him for a project, but the project requires a lot of synth sequencing, and I really don't want a live key player since I'd rather the keys more focused on creating textures and parts rather than making sure another human is getting enough solo time. I don't like using keys everywhere, and my experience is most key players want to play everywhere....but I digress.

Drums should be about more than just keeping time-they add personality to a band or album. But they should always conform to a metronome.

A truly great drummer knows how to work the click, not be a slave to it.