frontier-ddmusic
Thanks for taking the time to explain, I will play a bit more, I thought I had tried clicking just about everywhere for the play marker. It seems to work once then not again, maybe a bug.

 
I think it's that you don't have a big target where you can click.

The notes jump scale. If I set snap to scale and then move it all up, some don't sound right, so there are just a few individual notes in the piece I want to move, so I grab one and drag it up or down and another note further along jumps up or down, usually by quite a few steps. Try to put it back and the one I moved jumps. Turn off snap to scale and it still does it.

 
That is definitely not expected behavior, nor have I seen it before...
 

Also there seems to be no undo, no curl z either. So I can't get it back to how it was. Once it has screwed up the clip I have to exit and remove the edit.

I'm at a disadvantage because I upgraded to Editor and can't remember exactly what is or is not in essential. But check the Edit menu for undo.
 
Melodyne looks like it should be easy to use, but there's a lot going on. Took me a while to wrap my head around it but I'm glad I did. I get much better results now than I did with V-Vocal.

I think Melodyne (I have Editor) is superior to V-vocal in sound. It is harder to use, but once you get the hang of it, it is a great piece of software.  I'm still far away from a power user, but I can get more natural sounding results about two semitones farther from the original pitch than with V-vocal, which is great for harmonies that still sound fairly normal.

Jimbo21
I think Melodyne (I have Editor) is superior to V-vocal in sound. It is harder to use, but once you get the hang of it, it is a great piece of software.  I'm still far away from a power user, but I can get more natural sounding results about two semitones farther from the original pitch than with V-vocal, which is great for harmonies that still sound fairly normal.

Also Editor lets you alter formants, which V-Vocal could do but Essential cannot. Although its primary use is to create more natural sounds, you can also use it to create effects, like altering vocal timbres on backup harmonies so they sound like they're being sung by different people.

 
Is V-vocal 64 bit?

I believe V-Vocal exists in both 32-bit and 64-bit versions depending on installation done, but not 100% sure. I just checked the 3 dll files from this post and they are all 64-bit for me (I have never installed a 32-bit version of SONAR on this machine, but do have 32-bit plugins from older versions).
 
Dependency Walker is the tool I used to look at them.

This is correct. There is no bridge software for DirectX plug-ins like V-Vocal. IOW, when running a 64bit host a 64bit version of the plug-in is required, when running a 32bit host a 32bit version of the plug-in is required.

Many thanks for the responses here on my last question about if v-vocal was 64 bit.
 
One thing I have noticed about v-vocal is that occasionally it muddies up the transient at the very beginning of a phrase.
 
It only does it on certain phrases and it has taken me years to not only notice it was v-vocal but to realize how to fix it. 
 
One way to fix it is to simply take v-vocal off that particular phrase. Once returned to the "original" wave the muddied transient is restored. My ears have learned to immediately pick up on this. This happens even if i am using a 24bit  48khz  project.
 
Another way to sometimes correct the muddy transient is to stretch the first transient at the beginning of the word out ever so slightly though this does not always work.
 
Because this happens I gravitate towards making smaller v-vocal clips rather than large v-vocal clips.
 
I am wondering why v-vocal does not sometimes interpret the beginning of syllables correctly and if there is an optimal db level for clips that v-vocal likes to work with before a wave is loaded into a v-vocal clip.
 
I ask this also because I have noticed that waves that are too quiet, if i have a long sustaining note at the end of a phrase v-vocal will sometimes not trace the entire note with a pitch line. So I have to go back in my undo history to the original wave and then boost up the gain on the clip in order for v-vocal to hear it well enough to trace the entire sustained note pitch line.
 
When i translate a clip into v-vocal a progress meter appears and another program does the translation.
 
I am wondering if there is a way to boost up the quality of this translation process before it is passed on to v-vocal?
Are there other translation/resampling programs and algorithms available as plugins?

The big problem with comparing them is that the version of Melodyne that comes with SONAR is missing the formant manipulation tools, which is really key to getting realistic sounding pitch shifts.
 
It's a shame that they didn't include that with the basic tool. While I understand wanting to hook users on the upgrade path removing essential tools doesn't help it stand as a true replacement tool.
 

FWIW, having a solid clip gain level was always recommended for optimal (or at least consistent) VVocal results, as you've found.   Background noise or a low(er) s/n ratio can trip up the analysis process and result in a somewhat "phasey" sound, which I'm guessing might be what you were referring to as muddy transients.  
 
This is an area where Melodyne is more forgiving.
 

hi all,
just read this thread from start to finish(it`s cold and wet outside)and am wondering what a newbie would make of it.
I can appreciate correction if you have constructed a backing track and all it needs is vocals but you are a guitarist and drum programmer etc but can`t hold pitch or tune and don`t have a vocalist available.This is fine if you are a songwriter/composer and literally a one man band but to me,reading this,there is an inference that voice correction is a production tool along with panning and eq.
I have yet to record a vocalist who doubted their ability,regardless of their technical prowess as by the time they are confidant enough or have saved enough to record they,or the band are happy with the sound they have.
Leo Kottke said his voice sounded like "geese farts in mud" and raw emotion and alternative phrasing can distinguish an artist or song.
i guess what i am trying to say is are there VV/ME equivalents for guitar,bass,horns etc?
to be a vocalist is no different to being any other musician-whether it be a chord chart or sheet music or a guide track,if you cannot replicate or successfully interpret the music in your chosen field then relying on post production correction,to me,will not encourage young vocalists to tackle the established technical trials that will improve their range and accuracy-why bother with singing lessons when you can fast track your way in post production?
don`t get me wrong,if i record a drummer who is reluctant to remove half a roll of gaffa tape from his/her kit i give them the option of Drumagog(without alignment!)on the skins and most are happy to accept and learn from it.
why should vocals be exempt from ability and technique when everyone else has to cut it?
once again,for the hobbyist it is probably a valuable tool to complete a project but,in my case, for live recording it seems counterproductive if you,as an engineer are striving to record as accurately as possible the music that is being played.
 
footnote:am currently tracking a demo for a pretty hardcore screamo band and if VV or ME can help me interpret the shouting/lyrics i will gladly give it a go
cheers
tony