• SONAR
  • Pro Channel and/or Inser FX feel messy (p.3)
2015/09/19 21:43:34
John T
That's a really good point. It's taken me forever to get around to using the browser at all, didn't touch it for literally a couple of years. But I've got into it a lot more in the last few months. And PC modules not being in there is a strange omission.
2015/09/19 21:50:28
John T
Anyway, in reply to the OP.
 
I'm kind of old school on this, I suppose. I have a default Pro Channel that goes EQ > SSL compressor (whatever that's called in Sonar) > Console Emulator set to S-Type.

I regard that as being basically like the channel strip on a console, and it's what I make the vast majority of my foundational mix moves on. If necessary, I'll add a gate at the top, and for vocals and bass I'll almost always swap out the compressor for the LA-2A emulation. But broadly, EQ and compression, like on an analogue desk.
 
Everything else usually goes in the FX bin. Which I see as more like insert points.
 
Some of this is just old habits dying hard, but actually, I think it's a solid convention. EQ and compression are your pots and pans and hotplates. Everything else is spices.
 
2015/09/19 22:01:45
John T
Way back when I first studied sound engineering in the mid 90s, the course tutor really impressed on us the distinction between "processors" and "effects". I think the line between the two is fuzzy and porous, but it's a useful distinction, and I still approach things that way.
 
So I'll be a good hour or more into a mix without using anything more than the PC strip I describe above. I have a default basic reverb bus I kind of sketch things out on, that never survives to the end of the mix, but that's the only spice I'll use until I've got things working well with just balances, EQ and compression. Those are your processors; basic management of the tracks you've got to work with.
 
If you take that approach, the PC is a brilliant design; a simple tidy channel strip, albeit with lots of flexibility if you need it for a special case.
 
If you don't work like that, it probably feels like "why are there two FX bins?". I understand that; not everyone has to work the same way.
 
2015/09/19 22:02:51
Anderton
Speaking of old habits, remember too that there's a rich history of how to do mixing with live sound, where time and immediacy are of the essence. The modern studio takes some of the pressure off, because you have as much time as you want. But, I believe we're often at our best when working without a net, taking chances, and slamming controls in fits of inspiration.
 
(As a side note this is the beauty of Mix Recall. Take all the chances you want, then listen back the next day and decided which "performance" really did justice to the music.)
 
For me, mixing with a mouse is like entering MIDI notes in step time. You can do it, but I'm not sure it's the best way to have fun. And I'm in this to have fun, because if I'm having fun, it increases the odds of the listeners having fun...another lesson from live performance .
 
So I can relate to mixers. I see them as instruments...and if anyone has ever seen Dr. Walker (Ingmar Koch) live, then you know a mixer can be an instrument.
2015/09/19 22:06:38
eph221
I totally understand what he's saying, although I can only commiserate.  It's like decorating your house in primary colors...when everyone knows earth tones and pastels are the way to go.
2015/09/20 06:59:01
Kylotan
Beepster
I'm guilty of not using this feature myself but maybe the Console View Prochannel (the one that pops out beside strips in the CV) would fit your workflow?

 
No, because Console View is worthless to me. It just takes the mixing controls that I already have in Track View and makes them take up more space. Some people like that, but I have no use for it.
2015/09/20 07:07:44
Bristol_Jonesey
You can access the Pro Channel from the Inspector in track View.
 
Any use to you?
2015/09/20 07:14:17
Kylotan
Anderton
I don't think those who use Console view do so because they're attached to mixing console hardware, but because of the associated workflow being optimized for mixing.

 
I only see 2 aspects where Console View is optimised for mixing: (1) you can see the controls for more tracks at once, and (2) the faders and meters are bigger. The second doesn't interest me. The first would be useful, except I mix as I go along and rarely need to have my eye on all the tracks.
 
I forget whether Cubase or Logic invented the Inspector concept but to me it is brilliant, because it gives access to the "channel strip" whether I'm arranging/editing in Track View or mixing in Console view.

Apart from the ProChannel, everything in the Inspector is already right there in Track View in 'All' mode, with a couple of tiny exceptions (interleave, phase). It's not in a channel strip format, but I don't use mixing desks so that doesn't bother me. So I don't use the Inspector except where I'm now forced to (eg. Clip properties). This is a small step backwards in usability from 8.5.
2015/09/20 07:14:45
Kylotan
Bristol_Jonesey
You can access the Pro Channel from the Inspector in track View.
 
Any use to you?


No (see above) :)
2015/09/20 11:10:15
Anderton
Kylotan
I only see 2 aspects where Console View is optimised for mixing: (1) you can see the controls for more tracks at once, and (2) the faders and meters are bigger.

 
Both of which are important - (1) when you want to take in an overview of the project, including levels, metering, and EQ plots, and (2) for making fine adjustments. (FWIW you can make the meters longer in TV than in console view by using horizontal mode.) But the main feature CV has that TV doesn't have is the assignable FX faders. That's huge for real-time mix performances.
 
Apart from the ProChannel, everything in the Inspector is already right there in Track View in 'All' mode, with a couple of tiny exceptions (interleave, phase).

 
To me, that's the advantage. If the strips are all in narrow mode so I can see all my tracks spread across two monitors, it's very convenient to click on a channel and see the details in the Inspector rather than have to jump to TV (as well as have a place for entering notes and such).
 
I find both CV and TV to be very useful, which is why I like the D command so much.
 
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