Hi
 
I'm researching options to upgrade (MOTU AVB vs. RME) and appreciate comments and answers to my questions.

• I'm most interested in the MOTU 1248 AVB and MOTU 8M, but I think AVBs are all the same on the inside and when it comes to drivers ...?
• So far I could not find any round trip latency figures posted when used with PC (win10) via USB2 @96 kHz. Can anyone share? Latest drivers (still beta) claim to have significantly improved performance.
• While I'm intrigued by the features it offers, especially scalability via AVB / CAT5 cables, I'm a bit worried it might not be fully baked yet (beta drivers, B stock i.e. returned devices available for most AVB devices at Europe's biggest online retailer). Any comments regarding stability when used with Sonar on win10 (compared to RME) or encountered troubles (also when extended via AVB while connected via USB) are much welcome!

 
Thanks a lot,
 
Rob

Hi Rob,
 
With the release version drivers:
AVB series yields 4.9ms total round-trip latency at 64-sample ASIO buffer size/44.1k
 
The new beta drivers allow setting the "safety" buffer smaller.
 
Round-trip latency wise, the new MOTU AVB series is right on par with RME.
The noise-floor on the higher end AVB models is slightly lower than the RME UFX.

The beta drivers work fine - and they will let the you go down to ridiculous latencies ( <1ms) but of course your computer will give up first ;-)

I have the Ultralite AVB, but as you said, I think all the AVB interfaces use the same driver.

Here are the figures from Reaper for the MOTU Ultralite AVB with the May 18th Beta Drivers and Firmware 1.2.7.
I don't have the time to measure using Oblique or any of the other loop back tools but Reaper's numbers have been within 0.2ms or so of Oblique from past experience. 
 
What I did was load up Synthogy Ivory American D, every option on (1000 voices etc), balls to the walls. When I say Not Playable, I am saying you can't hit a single key without crackles. Truly unplayable.. My computer is optimized and the specs are in my sig.
 
This is a wonderful sounding interface and is an absolute steal for the money IMHO. MOTU is not who I would think of as a Windows lover, at least from the past (I'm an old fart), but they are clearly writing excellent Windows drivers and from what I understand it's either done in house or with a subsidiary that they own which is unlike the typical canned drivers that other companies provide. 
Whatever they are doing, it's excellent. You can find MOTU reps on GS and they are always helpful and do listen to suggestions from users. For example the previous beta driver removed the ability to adjust the Safety Buffer. People screamed and MOTU quickly released an update with that feature enabled again.
I like that.
Besides, it's a riot laying in bed and linking to the MOTU mixer app from my iPhone and screwing around with it remotely. I dunno, just seems kinda cool to me. :)
 
44.1k
Host Buffer Size Host Safety Offset RTL Reaper Comment
64 Samples 8 Samples 1.6ms / 1.6ms Not playable
64 Samples 12 Samples 1.7ms /1.7ms Not playable
64 Samples 16 Samples 1.8ms /1.8ms Not playable
64 Samples 24 Samples 1.8ms /1.8ms Playable
64 Samples 32 Samples 2.1ms / 2.1 ms Playable
64 Samples 48 Samples 2.5ms / 2.5 ms Playable
64 Samples 64 Samples 2.9ms / 2.9 ms Playable
64 Samples 128 Samples 4.3 ms / 4.3 ms Playable
64 Samples 256 Samples 7.2 ms / 7.2 ms Playable
 
*Just did these two for fun*
128 Samples 48 Samples 3.9ms / 3,9 Playable
256 48 6.8ms /6.8 Playable
 
Here is my system as sig didn't show:
 
Intel Gigabyte Z97X-UD3H 
Intel 4790K 4.0 GHZ
16G Corsair Vengeance 2133 Memory.
Samsung / PNY SSD for OS and Synthogy Ivory, qty 4 WD Black 7200 RPM drives.
2 Samsung 27 inch LED monitors
Windows 10 Porfessional x64
Presonus Studio One V3 / Reaper / Protools 12
MOTU AVB Ultralite
Event ASP8 Monitors
Sonarworks- Room / Headphone correction software
AKG Q701, ATH-M50x, Sony 7506, V6

steveo42
64 Samples 24 Samples 1.8ms /1.8ms Playable
64 Samples 32 Samples 2.1ms / 2.1 ms Playable
64 Samples 48 Samples 2.5ms / 2.5 ms Playable

Thanks for posting those figures Steve!
 
This is the range of "workable" (low) round-trip latency that I'd focus on.
You can work effectively at these settings (depending on speed/configuration and load)
 

Thanks all. That's excellent feedback. Much appreciated!

Jim Roseberry

steveo42
64 Samples 24 Samples 1.8ms /1.8ms Playable
64 Samples 32 Samples 2.1ms / 2.1 ms Playable
64 Samples 48 Samples 2.5ms / 2.5 ms Playable

Thanks for posting those figures Steve!
 
This is the range of "workable" (low) round-trip latency that I'd focus on.
You can work effectively at these settings (depending on speed/configuration and load)
 

Yes, that is definitely the sweet spot!
 

steveo42

Jim Roseberry

steveo42
64 Samples 24 Samples 1.8ms /1.8ms Playable
64 Samples 32 Samples 2.1ms / 2.1 ms Playable
64 Samples 48 Samples 2.5ms / 2.5 ms Playable

Thanks for posting those figures Steve!
 
This is the range of "workable" (low) round-trip latency that I'd focus on.
You can work effectively at these settings (depending on speed/configuration and load)
 

Yes, that is definitely the sweet spot!
 

I finally got a MOTU 1248 to test (just started testing really) and I'm getting impressive low latency.
 
At 96 kHz the lowest setting for a "small" project with several Kontakt instruments that plays without any glitches is 128 samples buffer + 48 samples safety buffer (which is exactly double of what you reported for 44.1 kHz and makes sense). Sonar reports 3.7 ms RTL, which is roughly 1/3 of the lowest I could go with the Roland interface (9-10ms).
 
Interestingly, Sonar reports RTL exactly as
 
RTL = 2 * (host sample buffer + safety buffer) / 96 = (total sample buffer size) / 96
 
which looks like Sonar just estimates latency based on an equation. So I should presumably follow up with some measurements ...
 
 
 
 

I have one coming tomorrow.  ( a 1248)  My only concern is the web based software.  After reading the manual online and a couple reviews it appears that some features require using the internet.  So I am going to ask the dumb question.  Does the avb series require the web based app to use?  I don't get it I guess.
    Is there just a software app that manages ins and outs etc that does not require internet connection?

You don't need to access the internet.  Just connect the 1248's LAN port to your router.
MOTU chose to make the control panel LAN/Browser based... so the control-panel applet can be run from any computer/tablet/smart-phone.