Jim Roseberry
Could you all check something?
What happens if you power down the AVB units (prior to starting your machine).
Then, once booted into Windows... turn on the AVB/s.
Does the problem persist?
 
Are you all on Win10 with the Anniversary Update applied?

ok. I think now I can reproduce this thanks to Jim's suggestion ...

• when coming from a cold boot it usually works fine (i.e. I can power up all studio gear and then boot the DAW, the AVB is recognized)
• when rebooting the DAW and leaving the AVB on, I do get the connection issue i.e.
  • it shows as windows device and shows in MOTU web app when using "MOTU Pro Audio WebUI Setup", but
  • it does not show up in the "MOTU Discovery" app
  • windows sound will not work properly e.g. when playing a video file it stutters
  • ASIO drivers will not show in Sonar
  • interestingly: a power cycle of the AVB re-established connection
• when rebooting DAW while power cycling the AVB at the same time, it works and re-establishes the connection, even if the AVB is done rebooting before the DAW

so it looks there is something not properly initialized if the USB bus remains powered while rebooting (compared to a full power cut )
 
what I also get - and that is new since one of the recent win10 updates: @ boot I sometimes (not always) get the following error from the Microsoft Security Client: "An error has occurred in the program during initialization. If this problem continues, please contact your system administrator"  Error code: 0x80070426 ... and when this happens, the "MOTU Discovery" app often remains unresponsive or does not find the AVB ... although the device itself works - very strange
 

Rob,
 
This is almost exactly what I see - except I can't reproduce anythign 100% of the time.
The problem is definitely based on re-booting the PC (with AVB still up and running)
 

interestingly: a power cycle of the AVB re-established connection

This one only works for me sometimes.
 

when rebooting DAW while power cycling the AVB at the same time, it works and re-establishes the connection, even if the AVB is done rebooting before the DAW

Same with this one. This used to be the case in the earlier betas - but now it's a crap shoot whether it will work or not.
 
Jim's method worked for me quite a few times (I'm sitting here like an idiot rebooting over and over to test these scenarios) but finally failed once last night.
 
Also - my MOTU support ticket has gone quiet. He was supposed to get back to me first thing (East Coast USA time) yesterday, and I sent a full report with screen shots and full explanations - but I've heard nothing.
 
Although it's a little bit of a pain, I wouldn't even mind if I had to power everything off when rebooting - but that only works 80% of the time or so. The real pain - is never really knowing if sound is going to come out (and pfaffing around if it's not working)
 
Can you verify - that once it's up and running and working - everything is fine?
The problem is only after a reboot - right?
 
 

jbraner
This is almost exactly what I see - except I can't reproduce anythign 100% of the time.

 
same here. i had it working perfectly for 2 days (with several intentional reboots in between just to check on this), but yesterday I could then reproduce it a few times as described above

jbraner 
Also - my MOTU support ticket has gone quiet. He was supposed to get back to me first thing (East Coast USA time) yesterday, and I sent a full report with screen shots and full explanations - but I've heard nothing.

 
Yes, I've also added my most recent description to my ticket and haven't heard back yet. Maybe MOTU dev started looking into this themselves rather than having support give the usual troubleshooting guidelines ... they should have realized that these issues appear on decidated properly setup DAWs that worked fine before and work fine with other interfaces
 

jbraner
Can you verify - that once it's up and running and working - everything is fine?
The problem is only after a reboot - right?

so far this is my observation. it usually shows and works, and keeps working solid and steady, no issues when changing buffers, routing, DSP mixing, etc. just as advertised ... only sometimes after booting the DAW it does not show up, then to fix it, it may be one power cycle, or cable unplug/plug, or totally shuting DAW, boot it first, then AVB ...
 
BTW, I was actually thinking about testing this with a USB hub that has an on/off switch in between because I noticed a similar thing with the 2 MIDI intefaces (ESI M4U XT) but much less frequently (about once a month) that only 1 will show while the second does not) ... there a quick off/on flip of the hub fixes it within 2 seconds ...

BTW, I was actually thinking about testing this with a USB hub

I always assumed that hubs = one more level of things that can go wrong
 
I'm glad you have a ticket open too - hopefully something will work out. Even if they officially say to use the old version for now

All quiet at MOTU - have you heard anything Rob?

I had a feeling that powering down the MOTU while rebooting would eliminate the problem.
Obviously the issue should be fixed... but at least you have a workaround.

Jim Roseberry
I had a feeling that powering down the MOTU while rebooting would eliminate the problem.
Obviously the issue should be fixed... but at least you have a workaround.

The best workaround is really to go back to the older driver.
I don't think anything is wrong with it - and I don't see any "improvement" in the new driver (I know it has Thunderbolt support - but for USB the old driver is great) except that the latency settings are more granular, and you can now bring them down lower than anything that will possibly work (like 8 samples with 8 sample safety buffer)
 

jbraner
All quiet at MOTU - have you heard anything Rob?

no. all quiet here as well.
 

jbraner

Jim Roseberry
I had a feeling that powering down the MOTU while rebooting would eliminate the problem.
Obviously the issue should be fixed... but at least you have a workaround.

The best workaround is really to go back to the older driver.
I don't think anything is wrong with it - and I don't see any "improvement" in the new driver (I know it has Thunderbolt support - but for USB the old driver is great) except that the latency settings are more granular, and you can now bring them down lower than anything that will possibly work (like 8 samples with 8 sample safety buffer)
 

This workaround - plus pulling the cable seems to get it working (I had a very stubborn one yesterday that didn't go away with DAW reboot and AVB reboot afterwards, so pulling the USB cable fixed it then)
 
I will stick with the driver until MOTU releases newer ones. Once the device is up and running it works brilliantly. I enjoy the ultra low latency (now sample libraries can be triggered by e-drums like never before - I always had a slight latency feeling, even at RTL of 8ms, so having to ~4ms is really nice)

 (I had a very stubborn one yesterday that didn't go away with DAW reboot and AVB reboot afterwards, so pulling the USB cable fixed it then)

This is what really annoys me!
Sometimes it just stays "broken"!
 

 
I will stick with the driver until MOTU releases newer ones. Once the device is up and running it works brilliantly. I enjoy the ultra low latency (now sample libraries can be triggered by e-drums like never before - I always had a slight latency feeling, even at RTL of 8ms, so having to ~4ms is really nice)

Do you get lower latencies with this driver - than with the previous one?

UPDATE:
MOTU support thinks that me and one other person (maybe you Rob?) are the only ones seeing this problem. I don't think anything is going to happen too quickly with this - esp if they can't reproduce the problem.
 
I wonder if it is down to different types of USB port? or USB controller?
 
I'm back on the old driver for now...