• SONAR
  • UnFreezing Synths - Messing Up Synth Sounds! (p.6)
2016/12/28 22:46:26
AdamGrossmanLG
It absolutely has to do with when a synth becomes disconnected.  I have an archived version of the same project from before the freezing, and the patches are in tact (thank goodness).

We really need to get this bug fixed for good.  It's been on going since at least Sonar 8.
 
 
2016/12/28 22:55:28
Anderton
If you bounce the synth tracks, archive, and then return from archive, does it still happen?
 
As to the Bakers seeing it, they've probably already seen this thread but unless they can reproduce it they won't be able to do much. If you have a recipe to reproduce, that's one option; it's equally good if you have a project where this happens consistently. You can then send the project to the Bakers and if it happens on their system, they can look for the source of the problem.
 
If you do have a suitable project, PM Keith Albright, explain the symptoms in a matter-of-fact way (avoid the "jeez, when are you morons going to fix this?" approach), and ask him what's the best way to get him the file.
 
The Bakers do consider file reproducibility important, so I would think this would assigned a pretty high priority.
2016/12/28 23:06:29
AdamGrossmanLG
Nope, bouncing and archiving is OK.  

It is the act of "disconnecting".  

In SOME projects, something happens that causes disconnections of synths to lose their preset parameters.
To add, once you unfreeze and fix the patch (by loading up a saved VST preset), and then freeze again, the settings then stick (even after a disconnect) - for a while anyway, until the problem happens again!

It seems as if something goes in and wipes out the saved VST presets of disconnected synths.   I wish I could figure out what.

I understand about the approach.   I usually try to keep my calm, but I am on Day #3 now of re-creating patches (trying to get somewhat close) to some of the ones I didn't have saved :(

Very frustrating.  Thank you for your help though.

Yea, I would send my project, but I couldn't even get started on what led up to this.

Thank You!
2016/12/28 23:22:02
Anderton
I don't think it matters what led up to it. If you have a project where this problem happens repeatably, that's like gold to a bug hunter. There are already some good clues in this thread that may be very helpful. 
 
Note that I've been charged with finding bugs in hardware and software for...well, let's just say a really, really long time (anyone remember MP/M? Come to think of it, was anyone here even born before MP/M? ). I've encountered bugs sometimes where I've tossed in some last minute observation that seemed not even worth mentioning, but it turned out to be the crucial piece of data that allowed finding the bug. In my experience, what happens with SONAR is about par for the course with a Windows program of this level of complexity, and something like this is probably not too hard to fix with a reproducible project...assuming there's not some inherent, unresolvable conflict. 
2016/12/28 23:32:49
AdamGrossmanLG
this is true, but will they have my VSTs?   In this project, I am not using Z3TA or any of the Cakewalk VSTs.  

Also if they try to save and disconnect a new synth instance now, it WILL work until it happens again.
2017/01/02 09:32:49
AdamGrossmanLG
OK so I am EASILY able to reproduce this, and probably so can you. I will provide you with the patch and even my test file.  It happens with ANY project though.  Here we go:
 
1.  Create a new blank project. (File -> New -> choose "--BlankProject--")
 
2.  Save the project file
 
3.  Insert Z3TA+2 simple instrument track (or any softsynth, but I am keeping it all Cakewalk for now)
 
4.  Choose a preset and then customize a bunch of parameters. Be sure the AMP release is LONG.  I notice this parameter always gets changed.  (feel free to use my preset:  https://www.dropbox.com/s/pmp0eyip9qh7u2j/patch.fxp?dl=0)   (Program -> Load .fxp from within the synth)
 
5.  Record a couple of short MIDI notes (or use my clip:  https://www.dropbox.com/s/zczxgeh3t7ttq3w/midi.mid?dl=0)
 
6.  Playback the notes, notice the long "release" of each note.
 
7.  Freeze the track.  (notice it still sounds the same, all good)
 
8.  Simply UNFREEZE the track.   Playback and you will hear the release time is much shorter.
 
 
Here is my project folder:  https://www.dropbox.com/sh/0t14ezf321bjceg/AAByNGCq05cEKo3tsEtXzGHGa?dl=0
 
This effects not just "release" but various others as well for all different softsynths.
 
At this rate, I am surprised ANYONE can even use this option.  It simply DOES NOT WORK.   

I should NOT have to load up saved .fxp files every time I unfreeze a synth.
 
Total fail on Cakewalk's part.
2017/01/02 12:41:06
Bristol_Jonesey
Just tried this using your patch and your Midi notes and unfreezing does NOT affect the release time of any note.
 
Sounds like this could be system specific related
2017/01/02 12:43:21
AdamGrossmanLG
Bristol_Jonesey
Just tried this using your patch and your Midi notes and unfreezing does NOT affect the release time of any note.
 
Sounds like this could be system specific related




so the problem gets even MORE interesting.

I've had this problem on various machines too!   I will try to disconnect all MIDI hardware now.  I doubt something I have is sending a signal but who knows.  This is NUTS!  

thanks for checking this out.
2017/01/02 13:00:40
AdamGrossmanLG
not sure if i posted it here, but here is the problem, notice how the Release parameter changes after unfreeze

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMv5OCg1kVo
2017/01/02 13:22:37
AdamGrossmanLG
Well, I am coming to find, the issue is not even freezing, its simply just re-opening  project.  I made a new thread:

http://forum.cakewalk.com...-m3539657.aspx#3539657
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