• SONAR
  • Is there a simple way to make a MIDI track not seem so mechanical? (p.5)
2017/04/15 02:44:31
cpkoch
 
Cactus Music
Funny after all everyone with any musical knowledge have said you still think a humaniser plug in will solve the problem. I love Craig's definition of feeding your computer alcohol. That's about it.
 


I have read and shared the very good article  that Craig suggested. I don't have a problem per se.  I am simply trying to learn different means of using MIDI tracks and determine if they suit my needs.   



2017/04/15 18:38:58
eikelbijter
Sanderxpander
I have to wonder, since eikelbijter (dickhead biter) has a profile showing him as Ricardo Belled living in California, if he has a Dutch background and knows what his handle means.



Maar natuurlijk Sander de Expander! Geboren en getogen in Nederland, woon sinds 1992 in L.A.!
En trouwens, een eikel is gewoon van de eikenboom, toch?
 
Groet,
R
2017/04/15 18:41:11
eikelbijter
chuckebaby
eikelbijter
There's a very easy way actually: hire an actual musician to play it for you! It might cost some to a lot of money but is FAR easier than trying to recreate the feeling of an actual player with your mouse. These days it's easier than ever....
 
R


 
technology troubling you
 
eikelbijter
You know, for people who can actually play something in 1 take, without the need for editing and Frankensteining!
 
R

 
My projects are 90% real instruments, but I have no problems using technology to advance my craft.
We all started some where. the next generation is too.
Hiring someone is an undertaking. and to hire someone good, its expensive.
Good luck




 
I'm not troubled by tech at all, and as a matter of fact can Frankenstein and do with the best of them. Obviously the OP has problems and asked for an EASY way. Even for someone with tremendous skills, it's still easier to just record a competent musicians who doesn't need editing!
 
R
2017/04/16 03:40:42
Sanderxpander
eikelbijter
Sanderxpander
I have to wonder, since eikelbijter (dickhead biter) has a profile showing him as Ricardo Belled living in California, if he has a Dutch background and knows what his handle means.



Maar natuurlijk Sander de Expander! Geboren en getogen in Nederland, woon sinds 1992 in L.A.!
En trouwens, een eikel is gewoon van de eikenboom, toch?
 
Groet,
R

Ha ok, dat is al een hele tijd. Ik zou niet zo snel aan een eikenboom denken bij die naam, maar dat kan natuurlijk ook aan één of andere mentale afwijking mijnerzijds liggen :)
2017/04/16 04:00:20
Cactus Music
A good way  to make midi parts sound real , play the part on a good midi or ?  instrument.
Example play drum parts on a digital kit instead of drawing notes or poking at a keyboard.  
 
My first backing tracks I programmed my Roland 505 and then recorded the midi output to my Atari. 
I used those patterns as the basis of all my tracks. Talk about a machine drum part for you, 100%.. At first I didn't care and I don't think the punters noticed either. But is soon drove me bonkers. 
I soon bought a midi keyboard, A Poly 800, but it only output Velocity 64. 
Later I bought a Roland PC 100 and now I had velocity, so drums are starting to sound better. 
Now I have a Yamaha DX 450 kit and things took another jump in realism. 
Next would be a better digital kit which you can pretty much achieve close to real.  
Even if you suck as a drummer ( me)  you can just go for it and edit the results. 
 
 now the bass. 
I soon learned how to play bass parts on the Poly 800. I'm a bass player with a million hours stage time, My keyboard bass parts were far short of what I could actually play on a real bass. I slowly improved my chops but there that mechanical feel, all perfectly placed, quantizied and velocity 64. No soul. 
I bought a Roland GR50 guitar synth hoping to play bass to midi. It didn't really work as back then storage was an issue and the GR50 cranked out huge amounts of Controller data filling a floppy disk with only 3 songs! And you can't really play bass on guitar. 
Along comes Sonar and now I can record real Bass and just in the last year I discovered how to drag and drop that audio bass track to a midi track and we now have what you are wanting. A pretty authentic midi bass part. 
 
So there's one tip, grab yourself a $ 100 bass, It barley needs to work, Record the audio, drag to midi, edit and assign to SI Bass. You'll have a pretty convincing bass sound.  
 
2017/04/16 05:07:53
mettelus
Hey Conrad, can you put your situation in perspective for us? IIRC, you have predominantly been using MIDI tracks as background to sing over, and I am not sure if you have a MIDI controller available? Are the tracks predominantly keys, winds, drums?
 
MIDI files I have seen over the years (especially ones from 20 years ago) suffer from the "constant velocity" issue (post #2 of this thread). On beat is not as nasty as all beats being identical, so there are a few options to help in some ways (PRV editing, automation lanes, Step Sequencer), but they can tend to be gruesome to deal with.
 
If not a one-off instance (i.e., you run into this often), another option is to start asking around for folks who play piano/organ (churches, musical functions, songs forum (here), etc.). There are a lot of hobbyists loitering about might simply need a MIDI controller to play on. Those MIDI files can be printed from Staff View as well for them to read. If you are able to share the MIDI files, folks here may be able to help as well.
 
The original question is fairly generic (with no real solution), so understanding your situation better will help.
2017/04/16 05:38:55
Kamikaze
gustabo
cpkoch
 
I've tried that.   I must be somewhat dense but still find no plug-in that suggests I can use the "MIDI Plug-in". How does one access the feature?


Don't use Simple Instrument Tracks and insert the plug in the fx bin of the midi track.
 




 
Or if you like Simple Instrument tracks (I do), open the Track Inspector, select Midi in the bottom tab and add midi FX into the bin from there.
2017/04/16 08:39:54
c5_convertible
Sanderxpander
eikelbijter
Sanderxpander
I have to wonder, since eikelbijter (dickhead biter) has a profile showing him as Ricardo Belled living in California, if he has a Dutch background and knows what his handle means.



Maar natuurlijk Sander de Expander! Geboren en getogen in Nederland, woon sinds 1992 in L.A.!
En trouwens, een eikel is gewoon van de eikenboom, toch?
 
Groet,
R

Ha ok, dat is al een hele tijd. Ik zou niet zo snel aan een eikenboom denken bij die naam, maar dat kan natuurlijk ook aan één of andere mentale afwijking mijnerzijds liggen :)

Dus eigenlijk gewoon een eekhoorn :)
2017/04/16 18:44:16
eikelbijter
c5_convertible
Sanderxpander
eikelbijter
Sanderxpander
I have to wonder, since eikelbijter (dickhead biter) has a profile showing him as Ricardo Belled living in California, if he has a Dutch background and knows what his handle means.



Maar natuurlijk Sander de Expander! Geboren en getogen in Nederland, woon sinds 1992 in L.A.!
En trouwens, een eikel is gewoon van de eikenboom, toch?

Groet,
R

Ha ok, dat is al een hele tijd. Ik zou niet zo snel aan een eikenboom denken bij die naam, maar dat kan natuurlijk ook aan één of andere mentale afwijking mijnerzijds liggen :)

Dus eigenlijk gewoon een eekhoorn :)




Da's het enige dat ik publiekelijk zal toegeven!
 
Woon je zelf in NL?
 
R
2017/04/17 14:51:25
cpkoch
mettelus
Hey Conrad, can you put your situation in perspective for us? IIRC, you have predominantly been using MIDI tracks as background to sing over, and I am not sure if you have a MIDI controller available? Are the tracks predominantly keys, winds, drums?
 
MIDI files I have seen over the years (especially ones from 20 years ago) suffer from the "constant velocity" issue (post #2 of this thread). On beat is not as nasty as all beats being identical, so there are a few options to help in some ways (PRV editing, automation lanes, Step Sequencer), but they can tend to be gruesome to deal with.
 
If not a one-off instance (i.e., you run into this often), another option is to start asking around for folks who play piano/organ (churches, musical functions, songs forum (here), etc.). There are a lot of hobbyists loitering about might simply need a MIDI controller to play on. Those MIDI files can be printed from Staff View as well for them to read. If you are able to share the MIDI files, folks here may be able to help as well.
 
The original question is fairly generic (with no real solution), so understanding your situation better will help.


Good hearing from you Mike!
 
I found a good supply of MIDIs  replicating lots of music of the 50s and 60s.  I thought that I might be able to use them as backing tracks for my vocalizing as my skill as an instrumentalist are poor to non existent. Because the MIDIs are very stilted and mechanical sounding I thought I'd ask the question ... not expecting the responses to continue on to two or more pages.  
 
I am trying to learn (for the sake of learning) more about Sonar Platinum's capabilities to create music in general. No particular instrument is to be singled out as piano, guitar drums etc are all part of the mix of midis. I can purchase most backing tracks of interest so getting the midis to  replicate actual backing tracks with "feeling" is not essential. I've managed to glean a lot from the responses and am playing around with velocity and with CAL for example.
 
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