cowboydan
If you go to youtube and look up Johnny Geib or go to www.johnnygeib.com You will find a lot of tutorials for Studio One 3. Hope this helps.

I watched several of his videos last night.  He did two videos detailing what you can do with midi in Studio One which were targeted at Sonar users.  Both were very good.
 
Interestingly, he does a 1 hour livestream at 7pm EST where he demonstrates some features.  I caught the end of it last night.  You can watch older ones on his channel, too.

Damn I posted such a big reply and it has totally dissappeared. Not the first time is happening. Too tired to type again.

Interesting finding, Charles.
 
I think assumption that every DAW engine must do everything exactly the same as could be heard from some musician-'theoretic scientists' is wrong.
 
I do not understand why they believe all software is the same but DAW is very complex software with many different algorithms inside, for instance  rounding numbers can be done differently in computing.
 
Many small things... So in fact I am not very surprised if any difference sometimes could exist. How many lines of coding is in advanced DAW? Also sometimes some difference could exists in one conditions and don't in the others (low memory etc - bugs related).
 
It could be small thing somewhere. It is not as simple as 2+2 =4. While programs are written by humans programs will have bugs. Or sometimes maybe it could be matter of different approach for the same task. I believe you didn't missed something in settings both in Sonar and SO :) So I am very curious answer from  support. I hope it would be not like 'you have to have bug in Soar, pls contact Sonar support' ;)

Piotr
Interesting finding, Charles.
 
I think assumption that every DAW engine must do everything exactly the same as could be heard from some musician-'theoretic scientists' is wrong.
 
I do not understand why they believe all software is the same but DAW is very complex software with many different algorithms inside, for instance  rounding numbers can be done differently in computing.
 
Many small things... So in fact I am not very surprised if any difference sometimes could exist. How many lines of coding is in advanced DAW? Also sometimes some difference could exists in one conditions and don't in the others (low memory etc - bugs related).
 
It could be small thing somewhere. It is not as simple as 2+2 =4. While programs are written by humans programs will have bugs. Or sometimes maybe it could be matter of different approach for the same task. I believe you didn't missed something in settings both in Sonar and SO :) So I am very curious answer from  support. I hope it would be not like 'you have to have bug in Soar, pls contact Sonar support' ;)

Thank you so much for your logical and thoughtful reply. I agree 100% with everything you just said.

Actually, this is all very fascinating. I hope no one is taking this in any other way than just a journey of discovery.

Thank you friend.

By the way, I will still be using Studio One and I don't regret purchasing it. Even with the proven difference of its summing engine I know great mixes can be made on it. And nothing else compares with its ARA and Softube Console One integration (except SONAR of course.)

doncolga
 
Dither is on by default on Studio One.  Not sure what variety. 

 
well, that's dumb.
you should never mess with dither until the very last step of mastering.
there is no need to dither, until you prepare the song for redbook format.

Sylvan here's the thing . I spent a good amount of time rerunning the tests you did by downloading the tracks you uploaded. I got the same results. What's interesting is that your exports and my exports nulled. ie. your S1 exposts nulled with my S1 exports and your Sonar exports nulled with my Sonar exports. So basically we did the exact same thing and got the exact same results.  I used triangular dithering, so that is not making any difference. 

I did an additional test. In Test 2 you choose overheads. I did two additional tests with Kick and snare separately. Guess what they dont null like Overheads did. This got me thinking. Then I realized that overheads is the only track recorded in stereo. Here's another thing, The sonar export of kick peaks at -8.0 db and s1's export of kick peaks at -11.0 db. Same with the snare(Sonar -4.1, S1 -7.1). Did you notice, both has 3db difference both caused just coz of mono stereo difference.

That makes me think if the -3db pan law as the reason behind this. Does anyone know how to change pan law in both S1 and Sonar?

sonarman1
Sylvan here's the thing . I spent a good amount of time rerunning the tests you did by downloading the tracks you uploaded. I got the same results. What's interesting is that your exports and my exports nulled. ie. your S1 exposts nulled with my S1 exports and your Sonar exports nulled with my Sonar exports. So basically we did the exact same thing and got the exact same results.  I used triangular dithering, so that is not making any difference. 

I did an additional test. In Test 2 you choose overheads. I did two additional tests with Kick and snare separately. Guess what they dont null like Overheads did. This got me thinking. Then I realized that overheads is the only track recorded in stereo. Here's another thing, The sonar export of kick peaks at -8.0 db and s1's export of kick peaks at -11.0 db. Same with the snare(Sonar -4.1, S1 -7.1). Did you notice, both has 3db difference both caused just coz of mono stereo difference.

That makes me think if the -3db pan law as the reason behind this. Does anyone know how to change pan law in both S1 and Sonar?

I did notice that. I tried the test on just the kick and got the same results as you. I think you may be on to something here. I hadn't considered this before because I assumed that since I am not panning anything that the panning law did not come into play. But maybe it does. This is great. I hope that this is what is going on. If nothing else, it is most excellent that we are learning more about all this. I think it is really cool either way.
 
Thank you so much for taking the time to conduct your own investigation.

If you have dithering turned on in either DAW or both, even if it's the same kind of dithering, then the test is invalid. Dithering introduces random noise. Random anything is a big no-no when trying to see if two signals will null in a test. To compare the summing of two DAW's you have to make sure EVERYTHING is the same with no tolerances or random factors. Even if you think the dithering is doing nothing because of your sample rate, it's not a scientific test until you turn all dithering completely off. 
 
 

Hey, let's change the subject and see if we can get the thread moved again! ;)
 
Just kidding. It seems the Software forum is the place to be. The SONAR forum is like Chicken Little/Henny Penny central.