MC4 Vs Sonar for vocals / final mix

Greetings!

Making significant headway with my MC4 thanks to many of ya (especially Beagle and 57Gregy!) I've just about finished my first recording (as much as one can be finished with a song) and am not terribly pleased with the quality of the final mix, especially the vocals. I realize that production is an art, and takes significant skills beyond what can be related via forum... but... :-)

I cant seem to figure out how to get my vocal tracks to "sit in" nicely with the rest of the mix. Problem 1 is that the volume is hard to keep consistent. I've applied a compressor, but there is still enough play in the volume of the vocals to make it hard to mix. Also, I've tried every reverb preset and fiddled endlessly, but my vocals still seem to stick out. Is there another FX I should be applying to vocals, or perhaps best practices that could be shared on recording vocals in MC4 that covers compression / reverb and whatever else is critical in recording vocals (EQ?)?

Also, the final mix does not have the same quality as a professional recording. The sound is very narrow in the stereo field, and instrumentation looses "punch" and definition, especially when playing back in car stereo. I believe this is a compression issue as well, but not sure. Again, best practice recommendations would be appreciated.

Certainly my inexperience in production is to blame here. But, mainly wondering if MC4 simply does not have the tools to provide the level of production that I'm used to hearing? What tools might Sonar have that MC doesn't that would increase production quality? Is there a "export this song with magical do-hickies applied to make it sound great" function in Sonar missing from MC4?

Many thanks!

I try to keep an eye on the recording meters while singing, to keep the vocal at a fairly consistent level. Which sometimes makes me lose track of where I am in a song, unfortunately.
Mic technique helps, moving closer to it when singing softly and moving away for those Roger Daltrey screams. Keeping an eye on the level all the while. If you have a vocal complete, which is good except for the varying levels, try cloning the track, and where the softer parts are sung, increase the cloned track's volume using a volume envelope. Just the process of cloning will make the track louder. Use the Boost 11 compressor in the master bus.
Try to pan the instruments to the sides a little to open up the space, you don't want everything right down the middle. You can pan in the console view or the track view.

One question is how do you apply the reverb?
This will tell alot about what to do with it. "sitting" a vocal in a mix has to do with eq as well. for every instrument voice included, you need to "carve out" a place for them. That entails panning, and Eqing so that frequencies do not step on each other. Reverb will push a vocal out front and pull it back in, but it must have a plce to "sit".

Thanks all for the suggestions!

I cloned the vocal track, panned them hard each direction. It definitely gave some "space" to the vocal track and separated it from the instrumentation and I'm much happier about the sound. Still have volume issues, but I'll work with the envelope tool... I was just hoping there would be a simpler way :-).

I have no method to applying verb. I apply it after the track is recorded, and just try different presets and settings until I find something that is OK.

How I can analyze the sounds to find a space for vocals, frequency-wise? Is there a spectrum analyzer in MC or am I just not understanding?

Where is the Boost 11 compressor? I'm looking under audio fx / cakewalk and not finding it.

>>I don't think I have heard an out of the box master piece yet.
Unpossible! LOL! Your point is well taken. Have been experimenting with EQing but need to understand it better. Will be reading up.

With sincerest apologies to Pat Benetar fans (and who isn't?)
http://www.myspace.com/cynicJEB
First two have vocals. Open to suggestions (short of "quit" / "never sing again") :-) These are pre-experimentation as per these suggestions.

I listened to your top song, and I see what you mean about the vocals being uneven, volume-wise. That could be a technique thing. Do some recording, well you don't have to record, but armed for recording so you can see the meters, and practice your singing and try to keep the level at the same, well, level. A compressor/limiter could help your existing track, but I'm not the one to offer advice in that area.
What kind of microphone are you using?
I liked the song, though, well-produced, well-balanced.

ORIGINAL: gamblerschoice

There was a recent post on free plug ins for mixing/mastering, maybe a search, or some one here might re-direct you.

Albert, if it's the thread Legion and I started that you're thinking about, it's over in the Software forum - click this link to go straight there: 25 Free Mastering and Mixing VST plug-ins

Steve