MIDI help

[<font]You explanation seems confusing. Can you post a link to the midi and maybe we can firure out what your going through?

I looked at the event list. The MIDI I tested was 4:00 long. Looking at the Event List showed everything pushed to the beginning and the file was changed to 4 seconds long. So I think the issue is the time encoding. The files I downloaded were fine. So just the files I get from that viewer I guess. They play fine in Media Player so the MIDI is not broken itself, it seems to be in the communication between the file and SONAR, and I am at a loss to how to fix that...

How can I attach the file? I have it on my computer, but I don't know how I can attach it so you guys can see it.

DH1022


How can I attach the file? I have it on my computer, but I don't know how I can attach it so you guys can see it.

Hi - I sent you a Private Message (PM) with my personal email address.  Please use that address to send me one or two of these 'broken' midi files, and I will take a look at them.


Bob Bone

+1 to swamptooth's suggestion.

When I pull midi in from an external source, I open the midi file with Sonar, rather than import it.

Please give that a try and post back, 

Bob Bone

Hi DH1022

I can't offer up any help but wanted to say that I played both those games.  Would love to hear your finished work... Bring back memories! 

The midi files you sent me appear to be corrupt in some subtle way.  They do play fine in Media Player, but opening in Sonar, all events are jammed into essentially single ticks within the first measure.


I suspect this is something to do with that viewer you processed them through, as I have no issues with any other midi files on my system in Sonar.  Is there any other versions of these files that you can get hold of?

Bob Bone

shoot those over to me as well id like to take a looksie!

It looks like all the events are there, just that their start times are all jazzed up.  The one file had something like 426 events in it - I sure wouldn't want to try to line all of those back up.

Bob Bone

*******EDIT****** THIS POST WAS WRONG IN ALL KINDSA WAYS, BECAUSE I FAILED TO RECOGNIZE THAT THE FIRST BYTE IN THE DELTA TIMING WAS RUNNING THE TRACK IN SMTP MODE.  CORRECTION AT BOTTOM, BUT BASICALLY YOU NEED TO CHANGE THE BYTES IN THE FILE HEADER FROM SMTP TO PPQS AND THEN THE FILES WORK FINE.  
MY BAD! :D


hey doug - 
so i figured out what was up with these files... 
in the old days of videogames in a land far far away EVERYTHING was compressed.  including midi files.  it took a little deductive reasoning (and a bit of my programming background).  
first, i played the files in WMP. 
Ending was 4:00 and timepod was :46 - so we know the file lengths.  
next i wanted to look at the midi file header to find out the delta timing - you can read about that here:  http://www.ccarh.org/courses/253/handout/smf/
looking at the bytes that correspond to timing (interpereted as pulses per quarter note) the value was (in hex) E2 02.  in decimal that converts to 57858.  no daw on the market is capable of that many ppqs.  so, where to start?
sonar operates at 960 ppqs as a max.  if you take 57858 and divide by 960 you get 60. this is a magic number of sorts and i'll show you why...
open the timepod file in sonar and zoom in. 
click to select the longest midi clip you see. in track inspector look under properties/length.  if you notice, it's 46 - happens to be the length in seconds of the track! amazing!!!
so next steps - ctrl+a to select all then choose process/fit to time.
new thru will read 00:00:00:01. change it to 00:00:46:01.
insert tts-1 and play back.  you'll see what i mean... :D
you'll notice ending has the same delta timing, so do the same thing... we know the length thanks to WMP, so select all process/fit and 00:04:00:01

note - there are still some glitches in the file, and not quite sure how to accomodate them because it's been a while since i've worked with compressed midi files like this.  i'd try maybe googling around a bit and see if you can track down how WMP does its midi conversion because it seems to be playing it pretty well....

hope this helps out. 
swamp

yeah. i'm gonna keep digging around to see what's going on.  i'm not quite sure the timing algorithm in sonar is working right. but it is fun, right??  nice idea btw can't wait hear your stuff.

heh.  i think the first video game i ever hacked was the bard's tale on an apple IIe.  just remembering about compression of midi files and midi headers was enough - i hadn't thought of them in years.  thank you for the kind words.  i'm really interested in this thread, though, because video game music is just so much fun in general - esp the stuff when the console systems were becoming more advanced in design.  lemme know if you find anything out...
'

swamp

OK, swamptooth, I just shot you my email address in a PM, thanks!

Bob Bone

@Cactus Music

The hip in November was a piece of cake, compared to this right-knee.  I had a pain management prescription refill appointment this week - and they called me to tell me the doctor was going to be out of the office, and they rescheduled the appointment for FOUR DAYS past when I would run out of pain medicine.  (that would be very very bad, as besides recovering from the knee operation, I still have 9 herniated discs in my back and neck, and some other stuff).  So, I called them back, and they were able to squeeze me in to see a different doctor, only now I had to travel to a different physical office, which ended up meaning a 1/2 mile walk from the nearest metro stop to the office, and another 1/2 mile walk to get back to the metro to come home again.  Ouch, ouch, ouch.  My knee swelled way back up, and my flexibility went down the drain, so I now have to work even harder to get the bending and straightening back to where it needs to be - with still a long ways to go.

Sorry to all for the digression.

OK, in simple terms, midi file 0 is data in 1 track, and midi file format 1 is multiple tracks.  I do not believe either of those formats has anything to do with the issues.  I got some edited midi files back from swamptooth that I have to look at, but he I believe has the best handle on the problem.  I will look into all of this some more tonight, after I get back from filling prescriptions.

Bob Bone

Ahh, Ok I used to know all that stuff and thanks for the refreshing course. Was just a wild card. 

( Ya, you walk on it right away and it will swell up like a balloon, Lot's of ice paks in the freezer! Even after a year I can feel it if I overdue it.  Gotta loose weight, that's the best solution but hard to loose weight when your limited in what you can do.. sitting in the studio all day is no help either.. that's why I had the wife buy me a set of digital drums.. my exercise program!~)