MIDI recording with audio metronome is off

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Kylotan
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2011/06/30 12:34:15 (permalink)

MIDI recording with audio metronome is off

I've often noticed that when I record MIDI in Sonar, I'm often slightly ahead of the beat. I figured this was just my error and fixed things up afterwards with shift and quantisation.

Then recently I've been reading various threads on here complaining about the metronome, about latency, and so on, and I thought I'd perform a little test.

First, I recorded 16 notes on the beat playing along to Sonar's audio metronome.
Second, I recorded 16 notes on the beat playing along to an RXP audio drum loop which was aligned to the tempo.

Both used the master bus and then out to my Audiophile 2496 via ASIO, so latency shouldn't differ in either case. I also used the same keyboard (E-MU XBoard 49 via USB) so the MIDI latency should be consistent too.

It turns out that when I play to the metronome I am much more likely to play the note early, with it landing anywhere between tick 880 and 940 on average, when obviously I want to hit 960/0. Against the audio drums, the earliest I came in was about 920, usually closer than that.

Does anybody else see behaviour like this? (And while I'm here, does anybody have a sample-precise audio loop that would work as a metronome? The drum loop I tested with is a bit busy-sounding for the job.)

Sonar Platinum (Newburyport) / Win 8.1 64bit / Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 / Absynth / Kontakt / Play / Superior Drummer 2 / ESP LTD guitar / etc
 
Twilight's Embrace - gothic/death metal | Other works - instrumental/soundtracks
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    Chappel
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    Re:MIDI recording with audio metronome is off 2011/06/30 16:40:27 (permalink)
    I haven't noticed the timing off when using the metronome but then I never had enough of a problem with it to pay much attention to it. Regarding an audio loop to use as a metronome, have you tried creating one in Midi (or using a Midi groove clip) and bouncing it to an audio track using a soft synth? You could then make that audio clip a groove clip which would follow any tempo changes.
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    Cactus Music
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    Re:MIDI recording with audio metronome is off 2011/07/01 00:43:06 (permalink)
    I never use the metronome unless it's something very simple. I always use my drum machine patterns I've stored away in a file.
    I still have the old Roland 505 ,  I synced it up and recorded most of the patterns. There very easy to make from scratch if you take the time.
    Just start with different hi hat grooves. Then add variations on Kick Snare. Session drummer has a bunch of simple patterns too.
    It's no big deal if your playing off time to the metronome anyway, It's all going to be quantized anyhow.

    Johnny V  
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    Kylotan
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    Re:MIDI recording with audio metronome is off 2011/07/01 16:52:37 (permalink)
    But if everything is early (or late) then quantizing is more likely to get it wrong and align something to the wrong place. (And sometimes you don't want to quantize - usually my timing is good enough if I'm going for a human feel, but only when it's aligned properly.)

    I will probably just record my own metronome clip. But I'm still intrigued as to whether anybody else can reproduce this behaviour.

    Sonar Platinum (Newburyport) / Win 8.1 64bit / Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 / Absynth / Kontakt / Play / Superior Drummer 2 / ESP LTD guitar / etc
     
    Twilight's Embrace - gothic/death metal | Other works - instrumental/soundtracks
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