Mackie OUTRAGE !!!

Page: 12 > Showing page 1 of 2
Author
Gamergirl
Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 181
  • Joined: 2006/10/31 16:23:14
  • Status: offline
2011/11/22 17:39:17 (permalink)

Mackie OUTRAGE !!!

Greetings Bretheren And Sisteren,

It has been some time since I have raised my voice in these bright realms, as I prefer to visit silently and take in information, rather than produce it. If indeed it can be said that there is a problem with information in the world today, I believe we can all agree that any problem lies in the perception that there is too much, rather than too little, of said. If you will permit me the fleeting whimsy of a literary personification and forgive the banal silliness of it, then you may perhaps find yourself at the very least somewhat amused, and at the most perhaps a bit more enlightened than you were before yhou happened upon this author's humble Thread.

Of course, the previous statement is an oversimplification of the true nature of the problem, as I suddenly realized even as I typed that sentence, therefore, first permit me the qualifying statement that and I have found, O. Verse, that the dread Imp 'Flickashin' - particularly when accompnied by Her nagging, ever-present companion and husband, Gross General I. Xation, to be quite  in error. I say this, naturally, with all due respect to the General and that afforded his rank, and in saying which gives one to wonder how one fits a Gross of stars on one's lapel. Perhaps I err in assuming Gross to be a numerical value, however.

Anyways, now that I'm through being absurd, let me cut to the point. I just bought a BRAND NEW Unopened Mackie Universal Control Pro for my modest SONAR-powered studio. Imagine my shock when, after opening the box, and following a thorough inspection of all its contents, I failed to locate a User's Guide ANYWHERE. I mean, NOT so much as A Quick Start Guide could be located. This, after Spending a Damn GRAND on a lousy control surface, which I had reservations about from the GITGO.

Okay, that was bad enough, but it was perhaps dealable. That is, until I discovered the document explaining WHY mackie failed to include a manual with the Control Pro. THIS DOCUMENT VERY VERY NEARLY MAKES THE LACK OF A MANUAL A DEAL-BREAKER.

This document (and I use that term loosely) was what I can only begin to describe as this insufferable, patronizing, extra thick, CARDBOARD politco pin-up flyer explaining to the purchaser that SOME CORPORATE BIG-WIG EXECUTIVE OR CEO OR WHATEVER at Mackie, Inc., who remains quite safely nameless (and therefore lawsuit-proof, I presume) and is referred to on the cardboard as "THE VP"- while at the same time making it clear that said individual is NOT "THE VP", but rather that he's just some nameless Important Big Deal who is referred to by the moniker "A  VP". However, the punch-line here is that this "A VP"-according to this flyer- has had some sort of- and brace yourself, b/c you are likely to be overcome by a fit of laughter here that cannot be easily dispelled, if you are like I was-- anyway apparently this "A VP" has for somereason had some kind of Generic Spiritual Awakening, this time not about alcohol or drugs but about "The Environment."

Now, finish laughing before you read on, because trust me, it gets even BETTER ! This nameless Wall-Street executive type person not only has had this Great Spiritual Awakening about this nebulous political cause known as The Environment, but- get this--- he has decided to pass  his awakening on through the practices of his company.

I'm sure you can guess the rest. The reason there's no manual in the Mackie Universal box is, of course, because as we all know, had they chosen to put one in there, then Trees would have had t o be killed, and that would have HURT this nebulous Star-Wars like Force for All Good in the Galaxy known as "The Environment.'

Before I continue, please understand, I AM A VEGAN. I have been doing my best to reduce my personal carbon footprint on this planet for the past 10 years by working my rear off to change my bad habits as a consumer and to reduce the amount of physical waste I'm forced to throw away. Working to save the environment is a (usually) thankless, difficult, and PERSONAL job. That means the only way to make a difference is to change your PERSONAL habits (eg, use less toilet paper, recycle, reduce the amount of toilet flushing, ration paper towels and products, COOK INSTEAD OF EATING OUT-ESPECIALLY FAST FOOD. The most effective way, however, has been demonstrated time and time again to so dramatically negate a given individual's carbon footprint, however, is to stop eating ANIMAL AND DAIRY PRODUCTS.

Now, to the business at hand, which is heaping upon Mackie every last shred of ridicule that they so richly deserve for choosing to screw their own customers like this.

HEY MACKIE!!! You are NOT fooling anyone !!!! You quit putting printed manuals in your products for one reason and ONE REASON ONLY, and that is TO SAVE ONE MORE LOUSY MISERABLE BUCK.

You didn't do it for The Environment. You did it to save a few cents to a dollar on production.  Please hear me here, and don't misunderstand. I am not your typical free-love peacenik hippie. I am a hippie, yes, but I am also a scientist, an author, and a philosophical pragmatist. Hippie is only a stupid (but sometimes useful) label that serves to describe a colleciton of qualities and general beliefs that I adhere to. However, Hear This:  THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH TRYING TO SAVE PRODUCTION COSTS.

Also, TRYING TO SAVE PRODUCTION COSTS Just So Happens to also "BE GOOD FOR 'THE ENVIRONMENT'" , YES !! All this IS TRUE.

But what I object to is being TOLD THAT you are no longer giving your customers printed manuals BECAUSE IT IS GOOD FOR THE ENVIRONMENT. Poppycock And Balderdash !!!

Okay, so to recap, I have been deprived of my rightful owner's manual by you, and not only that, I have been patronized, condescended to and finally I have weathered a nearly unendurable beachhead of assaults upon my intellect so massive as to nearly rival the actual famed Allied beachhead at Normandy. .

All of which, however, I might possibly find tolerable if it actually did something-anything, really, for the environment. But perhaps the biggest Lemon off all here is that this decision will, after all is said and done, have such a negligible effect on total 'carbon production' (which is an unfortunate misnomer, too, but that is a rant for another time but one which we WILL have, so important is it).

You may well ask* HOW? Well, because the Big Studios who purchase this item are going to want a reference in print. Reading and looking up stuff on line is still inconvenient when compared to the handiness of carrying around a manual. Therefore, they will log on to the provided site where the PDF version of the manual is. What will they do, then? Will they index it, perhaps, so all the I Phone  and IPad-weilding  employees can log on at willl when they need to consult the manual?

In a pipe dream, perhaps. In reality, though, they will PRINT OUT the manual using a laser or inkjet printer.

IT IS A FACT, HOWEVER, THAT DUE TO THE WASTEFUL NATURE OF THESE PERSONAL PRINTERS AS COMPARED TO THE STREAMLINED, COST-EFFECTIVE PROCESSES DEVELOPED BY PROFESSIONAL PRINTERS AND SUPPLEMENTED BY COMPUTER TECHNOLOGY, AS WELL AS BEING HONED TO A FINE ART FORM BY CENTURIES OF EXPERIENCE BEGINNING WITH CHARLES GUTENBERG, THE USE OF SUCH PRINTERS WILL LEAVE A CARBON FOOTPRINT THAT IS SO MASSIVE AS COMPARED TO THE ONE THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN LEFT HAD MACKIE SIMPLY CONTRACTED AN EXPERIENCED PRINTER TO DO THE MANUAL FOR THEM, LIKE EVERYONE ELSE STILL DOES, THAT THIS DECISION BY MACKIE WILL ACTUALLY DAMAGE THE ENVIRONMENT.

Let me say that again: Mackie's decision will CAUSE A MUCH LARGER CARBON FOOTPRINT TO BE MADE than what would have resulted had they simply continued to include printed manuals like a REAL Music Recording company, such as ROLAND, does. Personal printers are some of the most wasteful devices still in use on the planet. IN FACT- get THIS- The ink that personal printers use, that is being sprayed DIRECTLY into the environment as it splashes off the paper in the form of vapor and said paper is in most cases eventually tossed away and hauled to land fill, not to mention the millions upon millions of empty ink cartridges being buried in landfills where they decay and are broken, their contents mingling with the moisture whenever it rains and eventually seeping into the groundwater itself.

Anyway, this INK is almost PURE CARBON !!! That, my friends, is the punchline of Mackie's little joke.

IF Mackie had simply stated something like this: "We, Mackie, Need to Cut Costs Or We may loose profits- ergo investors, etc, etc, leading eventually to our demise and failure to offer you anymore of our fine products. Therefore, we are asking you, the customer, to assume the cost of printing the manual yourself, or even better, if you can afford it, purchase a device like an Amazon Kindle, that you can use to COMFORTABLY READ THE MANUAL ON WHILE IT REMAINS DIGITAL, tthen you will not only be helping us and saving yourself some dough, you'd be helping the environment too."

Had Mackie put a flyer in saying something like htat, then they would have not only gained my respect, retained my patronage, and that of many others, they would have also ACTUALLY DONE SOMETHING TO HELP THE ENVIORONMENT.

What they Chose To Do only pays lip service to helping the environment, and it embodies everything that the political enemies of clean air and water hate about our movement.

Mackie, I expected better of you.

Take a hint from Roland and Cakewalk, Mackie. Roland actually HELPS THE ENVIRONMENT by their actions.

More about how, if you guys are interested, in my next. Please, pass the word on.
Also, tell me what you think:

Should I keep my Universal Pro Controller? Or should I send it back in the face of this insult and buy something else from a company that is ACTUALLY HELPING the environment instead of PRETENDING to help it while actually damaging it even more?

Please let me know what you think!!!

Courtney Patricia "GuitarGamerGirl" Parsons


This I would
* You might also ask as well as WHO is this girl to say these things? She might e and idionsd hold a BS in Chemistry and Physics, and a MS in Quantum Bio-Physical Chemistry  (also known as 'Computational Physical-Organic Chemistry' from North Carolina. That is not really what qualifies me here, though. My actual title at Oak Ridge was Environmental Analytical Research Chemist, and in PA I worked as what is known as an Industrial Hygienist. Is that enough to qualify me?



"As above, so below."
-Hermes Trismegestus

"The more complex the mind, the greater the need for the simplicity of play."
-James Tiberius Kirk

"Do what thou Wilt shall be the Whole of the Law."-Aleister Crowley
#1

32 Replies Related Threads

    gustabo
    Max Output Level: -49.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 2591
    • Joined: 2009/01/05 17:32:38
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/22 17:55:40 (permalink)
    Apparently the Mackie Universal Control Pro is meant for guys because guys never read instruction manuals.
    Why? Because it's just another guy's opinion!



    Cakewalk by Bandlab - Win10 Pro x64 - StudioCat Platinum Studio DAW - 32 GB Ram - MOTU UltraLite-mk3
    M-Audio Keystation 88ES - Akai MPD26 (hot-rodded) - Alesis DM10 - a few guitars, a few amps
    Novation Launch Control - Korg nanoKONTROL2 - PreSonus FaderPort - DAW Remote HD on iPad
    Adam A7X - Behritone C50A
    PreSonus Monitor Station v2 (controlling the mons)
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/sonarusergroup/

    #2
    Gamergirl
    Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 181
    • Joined: 2006/10/31 16:23:14
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/22 18:28:24 (permalink)
    AGAIN IN SUMMARY:

    Mackie, your decision to NOT INCLUDE printed manuals with products succeeds in your STATED PURPOSE (The reduction of overall Carbon output) if and ONLY IF the customer who buys the product CHOOSES not to PRINT the manual themselves.

    The more intelligent "VP" and "CEO" types will doubtless at this point, respond to the above by pointing out that it is likely that a substantial number of buyers will choose not to print the manual. I might even agree with this, though I think the reasons would have more to do with personal laziness than any desire to help "The Environment". Though many will justify their decision not to print by citing this wondrous new Force For Good in the Galaxy as their reason for "choosing" (again, a discussion for another time) NOT to Print Out the manual (more than a few will 'console' rather than 'cite', as well, though they may well 'cite' to soothe their clinical Ego when it naturally responds to their inaction by telling themselves that they aren't literally too lazy to say syu-ee if the hogs were eating them alive, but are instead "Helping The Environment."

    Yeah. Sure You Are.

    But I digress; what I mean to say is that a few personal printers spewing away at 3 AM and spitting invisible carbon byproducts in the air (this is the way an 'ink jet' printer works. The 'JET', so to speak, as in "JET STREAM", sprays a highly concentrated STREAM of ink, much of which winds up decorating the paper. Much, however, does not) do a LOT MORE DAMAGE that a print run or two of manuals done by a pro printer.

    And, even if  that weren't true- and I challenge anyone to prove to me that it isn't, using like, actual facts and figures. If you are a FOX viewer, you might as well forget it already.- even if that weren't true, there's a million better ways to actually HELP the environment. Mackie pretends that this decision to not include manuals is but one tiny step in a massive move to overhaul their company and make it "Green". However, they are unable to name a SINGLE other step in this so-called "Massive Overhaul".

    Even their Manifesto, this Proclamation in the box in place of the manual, printed on this double-thick super-heavy piece of cardboard (how many trees did THAT kill? It's not EVEN PRINTED on RECYCLED Paper, for Chrysssakes !!!)
    which they have Complete Control over to say Whatever they want to make themselves look better. Even this thing says what amounts to something like this:

     "Mackie is dong LOTS of stuff t o go GREEN. FIRST WE NO LONGER INCLUDE PRINTED MANUALS... OUR PRODUCTS. NEXT, WE... ER, WELL, WE DIDN'T USE QUITE AS MUCH PAPER IN THE PACKING  BOX THIS TIME. NEXT, THEN, WE WILL.... UMMMM...ER, WE'LL, UH---- WE'LL, WELL, JUST YOU WAIT. WE'LL DO A BUNCHA STUFF TO MAKE THIS COMPANY GREEN !!! "

    The fact is, I'm not even exaggerating that much here !! What a load of melarky. Please, it's okay to cut costs especially these days, but please don't try to sell me a load of quasi-religious bull after screwing me out of my rightful manual, you jackasses.

    Who's with me?

    Roland, makers of Cakewalk now, has never done anything like this and I don't believe they ever would. THis i swhy Roland will still be here 30 or 40 years from now and mackie, if it exists at alll in the future, will be under completely new ownership and will have been cut down to the point of unrecognizeablitliy.

    How do I know this? Because Roland was here serving my musical needs during the 90s up until today, and I'm told it was doing so by many a keyboard player (which was mostly what it did at first) in the 60s. Today, Roland does MUCH more than it did in the 60s, when it was little more than a humble syth maker. Now, look at everything they do!!

    But I've seen company after company again and again come and go in the computer recording business (which I've been doing since 1993) and most are gone, and this was preluded by them beginning to mistreat their biggest supporters- their core customer base, whose loyalty- as long as they are treeated properly- was astoudningly similar to the kind of fanatically devoted fandom surrounding Gene Roddenberry and the cast of Original ST.  But many companies have since learned that these fans have a deep seated sense of pride, and if they feel they are mistreated, fans of this calibre can instantly end a company, and it is so much easier (and legal!!) now in this day and age of fan-written product reviews on the 'net.

    Mackie, consider this a 'blog'. Unless you address this issue somehow, and very quickly, the "fan review," will be coming. Next Stop, Musiciansfriend.com !!!

    May The Environment Be With You,
    Courtney Patricia Parsons

    "As above, so below."
    -Hermes Trismegestus

    "The more complex the mind, the greater the need for the simplicity of play."
    -James Tiberius Kirk

    "Do what thou Wilt shall be the Whole of the Law."-Aleister Crowley
    #3
    The Maillard Reaction
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 31918
    • Joined: 2004/07/09 20:02:20
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/22 19:07:59 (permalink)
    gustabo


    Apparently the Mackie Universal Control Pro is meant for guys because guys never read instruction manuals.
    Why? Because it's just another guy's opinion!



    +Ya


    #4
    mixsit
    Max Output Level: -75 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 789
    • Joined: 2004/04/30 11:04:24
    • Location: CathouseSound
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/22 21:27:41 (permalink)
    Gamergirl


    AGAIN IN SUMMARY:
    ...

    This is(was) a summary? Oh my.
     
    Anywho, I figure I have a couple' three cubic feet of manuals.
    Yes sometimes they are preferable- I think it depends partly of how/where something is to be used.
    On the other hand I'm about 75% converted comfort/preference wise to having the pdf at easy call. Also I'm liking more and more the format and it's options; zoom', ease on the eyes, quick access/lookup.. occasionally printing ref points..
    I guess having (at least) the option is nice and the best of both worlds. But then if they don't print a boatload of them the cost per goes up.
    But that's fair enough/ought to be expected right -in 'green mode?

    Wayne Smith
    Part time long time..
    CathouseSound 
    Mother Ships  - StudioCat DAWs   
    Portals - RME
    #5
    Beagle
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 50621
    • Joined: 2006/03/29 11:03:12
    • Location: Fort Worth, TX
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/22 22:01:16 (permalink)
     then you may perhaps find yourself at the very least somewhat amused



    yep.  I was. 

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
    i7, 16G DDR3, Win10x64, MOTU Ultralite Hybrid MK3
    Yamaha MOXF6, Hammond XK3c, other stuff.
    #6
    The Maillard Reaction
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 31918
    • Joined: 2004/07/09 20:02:20
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/22 22:05:31 (permalink)

    I almost lost my tofu when I read "I AM A VEGAN."

    Made my day.

    :-)


    #7
    Beagle
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 50621
    • Joined: 2006/03/29 11:03:12
    • Location: Fort Worth, TX
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/23 08:27:58 (permalink)
    mike_mccue


    I almost lost my tofu when I read "I AM A VEGAN."

    Made my day.

    :-)


    I didn't think Vegans were allowed to purchase Mackies?

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
    i7, 16G DDR3, Win10x64, MOTU Ultralite Hybrid MK3
    Yamaha MOXF6, Hammond XK3c, other stuff.
    #8
    Guitarhacker
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 24398
    • Joined: 2007/12/07 12:51:18
    • Location: NC
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/23 08:58:52 (permalink)
    Typical..... Long winded.... using big fancy words trying to impress..... Then I saw "GITGO" and thought this person is from the south..... later ID's herself as vegan, hippy, educated in NC.... Bingo!

    Have you thought to look online? Most companies use this thing called the internet to allow access to their manuals. 


    And yeah... if you were a guy, you wouldn't need the manual anyway. 

    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

    MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW   
    Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface


    BMI/NSAI

    "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer 
    #9
    Starise
    Max Output Level: -0.3 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 7563
    • Joined: 2007/04/07 17:23:02
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/23 09:46:32 (permalink)

     Better yet ,download the .pdf of the manual and have it on hand anytime you need it.

      I'll admit I occasionally need to look it up in a manual,I must not be a true guy ;)

     She makes a good point. The environment is an excuse used by many companies to boost their bottom line. I would venture to say that until the environment and going green were considered trendy most big corporations could care less. Who was green before green was in?

     In many cases going green is just a spin word to attract that type of buyer. A lot of companies use recycled because its less expensive and more readily available, not because it's recycled.

     I like to have a hard copy too but I'm from the old school. The wave of the future is to access data stored on a computer instead of the printed page. Ink being oil based is tied to the price of oil. Like it or not, I think we will continue to see more digital media and less paper.

     

    Intel 5820K O.C. 4.4ghz, ASRock Extreme 4 LGA 2011-v3, 16 gig DDR4, ,
    3 x Samsung SATA III 500gb SSD, 2X 1 Samsung 1tb 7200rpm outboard, Win 10 64bit, 
    Laptop HP Omen i7 16gb 2/sdd with Focusrite interface.
     CbB, Studio One 4 Pro, Mixcraft 8, Ableton Live 10 
     
     www.soundcloud.com/starise
     
     
     
    Twitter @Rodein
     
    #10
    Guitarhacker
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 24398
    • Joined: 2007/12/07 12:51:18
    • Location: NC
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/23 11:10:13 (permalink)
    Starise


      

    I'll admit I occasionally need to look it up in a manual,I must not be a true guy ;)

     Who was green before green was in?




    1. never admit that


    2. Kermit the frog



    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

    MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW   
    Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface


    BMI/NSAI

    "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer 
    #11
    Ham N Egz
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 15161
    • Joined: 2005/01/21 14:27:49
    • Location: Arpadhon
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/23 11:19:40 (permalink)
    Greg Mackie was one of the original "hippies" I use that term loosely, in the sense of a commitment to certain ideals. whether the corporate hive embraces his philosophy or as when Sam Walton died the ideas went out the window into his grave, can be debated.

    This is the new age, the new world order, and information is now becoming electronic and digital,, so manuals are PDF abd the like and you can access your X1s manual electronically while you are running your daw, and there is context sensitive help .I have manuals and read them on my IPAD, my Acer netbook, even my Iphone, albeit a PITA since its so small.
    My current love for a printed manual is a Chiltons and its ilk, because if I am wrenching on my 1965 Chevy PU truck, I abhor getting grease on a keyboard whilst I was " turning a page"

    Now to the OPs original question, seriously, if your moral and ethical compass preclude you from using a damn fine control surface, by all means return it and look at Avid, Tascam,or Roland/Cakewalk.


    Green Acres is the place to be
     I dont twitter, facebook, snapchat, instagram,linkedin,tumble,pinterest,flick, blah blah,lets have an old fashioned conversation!
     
    #12
    Beagle
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 50621
    • Joined: 2006/03/29 11:03:12
    • Location: Fort Worth, TX
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/23 11:37:57 (permalink)
    musicman100


    Now to the OPs original question, seriously, if your moral and ethical compass preclude you from using a damn fine control surface, by all means return it and look at Avid, Tascam,or Roland/Cakewalk.

    love it!!!

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
    i7, 16G DDR3, Win10x64, MOTU Ultralite Hybrid MK3
    Yamaha MOXF6, Hammond XK3c, other stuff.
    #13
    Starise
    Max Output Level: -0.3 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 7563
    • Joined: 2007/04/07 17:23:02
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/23 12:01:36 (permalink)
     Or I'll take off her hands........

    Intel 5820K O.C. 4.4ghz, ASRock Extreme 4 LGA 2011-v3, 16 gig DDR4, ,
    3 x Samsung SATA III 500gb SSD, 2X 1 Samsung 1tb 7200rpm outboard, Win 10 64bit, 
    Laptop HP Omen i7 16gb 2/sdd with Focusrite interface.
     CbB, Studio One 4 Pro, Mixcraft 8, Ableton Live 10 
     
     www.soundcloud.com/starise
     
     
     
    Twitter @Rodein
     
    #14
    Beagle
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 50621
    • Joined: 2006/03/29 11:03:12
    • Location: Fort Worth, TX
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/23 12:11:58 (permalink)
    Starise


     Or I'll take off her hands........


    for the cost of a printed manual, of course! 

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
    i7, 16G DDR3, Win10x64, MOTU Ultralite Hybrid MK3
    Yamaha MOXF6, Hammond XK3c, other stuff.
    #15
    ChuckC
    Max Output Level: -61 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 1488
    • Joined: 2010/02/13 01:22:55
    • Location: Port Charlotte, Fl
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/23 19:44:59 (permalink)
    Sheeze.....  I think... "man, it pisses me off that there was no manual included" would have sufficed don't you?   Hippy liberals amaze and baffle me with the petty things that seem so important to them while the big picture goes ignored.  I am not saying our planet is petty, it is good to recycle as much as possible and I agree that companies use the green movement to save greenbacks and nothing else, but it is now an ACTUAL scientific FACT that man made global warming is a political hoax.  Life and everything in it is carbon based, including my footprint? so be it.  So if you really want to reduce your carbon footprint your gonna need to go out to the garage, and grab a hold of the battery terminals on that high voltage prius and check out (for the good of the planet of course).    Sorry to get ugly, I don't mean too.  It just cracks me up because if I didn't laugh at you, I'd be crying for you.

    ADK Built DAW, W7, Sonar Platinum, Studio One Pro,Yamaha HS8's & HS8S  Presonus Studio/Live 24.4.2, A few decent mic pre's,  lots of mics, 57's,58 betas, Sm7b, LD Condensors, Small condensors, Senn 421's,  DI's,  Sans Amp, A few guitar amps etc. Guitars : Gib. LP, Epi. Lp, Dillion Tele, Ibanez beater, Ibanez Ergodyne 4 String bass, Mapex Mars series 6 pc. studio kit, cymbals and other sh*t.
    http://www.everythingiam.net/
    http://www.stormroomstudios.com
    Some of my productions: http://soundcloud.com/stormroomstudios
    #16
    Guitarhacker
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 24398
    • Joined: 2007/12/07 12:51:18
    • Location: NC
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/23 20:15:23 (permalink)
    Oh my..... just think of all the electricity that is required to feed the server that holds that PDF..... 

      I like the idea of killing trees and turning them into paper, then using toxic ink to print a book..... such a sweet tactile feel and the smell of a freshly printed manual is beyond compare.  And, if you get cold, you can always burn the manual to keep warm.....try that with a PDF. 
    post edited by Guitarhacker - 2011/11/23 20:16:41

    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

    MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW   
    Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface


    BMI/NSAI

    "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer 
    #17
    Starise
    Max Output Level: -0.3 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 7563
    • Joined: 2007/04/07 17:23:02
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/23 22:33:00 (permalink)
    Beagle


    Starise


     Or I'll take off her hands........


    for the cost of a printed manual, of course! 


     I intended to type,I'll take the control surface off her hands,not take off her hands.....typing too fast again.

    Intel 5820K O.C. 4.4ghz, ASRock Extreme 4 LGA 2011-v3, 16 gig DDR4, ,
    3 x Samsung SATA III 500gb SSD, 2X 1 Samsung 1tb 7200rpm outboard, Win 10 64bit, 
    Laptop HP Omen i7 16gb 2/sdd with Focusrite interface.
     CbB, Studio One 4 Pro, Mixcraft 8, Ableton Live 10 
     
     www.soundcloud.com/starise
     
     
     
    Twitter @Rodein
     
    #18
    ChuckC
    Max Output Level: -61 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 1488
    • Joined: 2010/02/13 01:22:55
    • Location: Port Charlotte, Fl
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/23 23:53:51 (permalink)
    LMAO!  I didn't even notice that.

    ADK Built DAW, W7, Sonar Platinum, Studio One Pro,Yamaha HS8's & HS8S  Presonus Studio/Live 24.4.2, A few decent mic pre's,  lots of mics, 57's,58 betas, Sm7b, LD Condensors, Small condensors, Senn 421's,  DI's,  Sans Amp, A few guitar amps etc. Guitars : Gib. LP, Epi. Lp, Dillion Tele, Ibanez beater, Ibanez Ergodyne 4 String bass, Mapex Mars series 6 pc. studio kit, cymbals and other sh*t.
    http://www.everythingiam.net/
    http://www.stormroomstudios.com
    Some of my productions: http://soundcloud.com/stormroomstudios
    #19
    Beagle
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 50621
    • Joined: 2006/03/29 11:03:12
    • Location: Fort Worth, TX
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/24 07:38:57 (permalink)
    Guitarhacker


    Oh my..... just think of all the electricity that is required to feed the server that holds that PDF..... 

    I like the idea of killing trees and turning them into paper, then using toxic ink to print a book..... such a sweet tactile feel and the smell of a freshly printed manual is beyond compare.  And, if you get cold, you can always burn the manual to keep warm.....try that with a PDF. 


    what about the power it requires to house the computer she's using to type the diatribe on the cakewalk forum about mackie control surfaces?  or the power it takes to run the servers for the cakewalk forum.  or...

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
    i7, 16G DDR3, Win10x64, MOTU Ultralite Hybrid MK3
    Yamaha MOXF6, Hammond XK3c, other stuff.
    #20
    Guitarhacker
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 24398
    • Joined: 2007/12/07 12:51:18
    • Location: NC
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/24 08:10:04 (permalink)
    I once read that a real man doesn't need the manual, or the map. And he would clear cut a forest to make a campfire to cook the last of the endangered species he just shot so he can eat breakfast..... but he won't eat quiche.... 

    And of course, the coal that powers the steam generators has to be ripped out of the earth, and transported to the power company by...dare I say it?..... Diesel burning TRUCKS? 

    Oh the travesty of it all, the rape and pillage of the planet..... just for a stinking manual..... we should all go back to acoustic instruments...................nahhhh.... 


    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

    MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW   
    Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface


    BMI/NSAI

    "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer 
    #21
    digitalboy
    Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 173
    • Joined: 2007/08/20 12:38:42
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/24 08:15:47 (permalink)
    Gamergirl


    Greetings Bretheren And Sisteren,

    It has been some time since I have raised my voice in these bright realms, as I prefer to visit silently and take in information, rather than produce it. If indeed it can be said that there is a problem with information in the world today, I believe we can all agree that any problem lies in the perception that there is too much, rather than too little, of said. If you will permit me the fleeting whimsy of a literary personification and forgive the banal silliness of it, then you may perhaps find yourself at the very least somewhat amused, and at the most perhaps a bit more enlightened than you were before yhou happened upon this author's humble Thread.

    Of course, the previous statement is an oversimplification of the true nature of the problem, as I suddenly realized even as I typed that sentence, therefore, first permit me the qualifying statement that and I have found, O. Verse, that the dread Imp 'Flickashin' - particularly when accompnied by Her nagging, ever-present companion and husband, Gross General I. Xation, to be quite  in error. I say this, naturally, with all due respect to the General and that afforded his rank, and in saying which gives one to wonder how one fits a Gross of stars on one's lapel. Perhaps I err in assuming Gross to be a numerical value, however.

    Anyways, now that I'm through being absurd, let me cut to the point. I just bought a BRAND NEW Unopened Mackie Universal Control Pro for my modest SONAR-powered studio. Imagine my shock when, after opening the box, and following a thorough inspection of all its contents, I failed to locate a User's Guide ANYWHERE. I mean, NOT so much as A Quick Start Guide could be located. This, after Spending a Damn GRAND on a lousy control surface, which I had reservations about from the GITGO.

    Okay, that was bad enough, but it was perhaps dealable. That is, until I discovered the document explaining WHY mackie failed to include a manual with the Control Pro. THIS DOCUMENT VERY VERY NEARLY MAKES THE LACK OF A MANUAL A DEAL-BREAKER.

    This document (and I use that term loosely) was what I can only begin to describe as this insufferable, patronizing, extra thick, CARDBOARD politco pin-up flyer explaining to the purchaser that SOME CORPORATE BIG-WIG EXECUTIVE OR CEO OR WHATEVER at Mackie, Inc., who remains quite safely nameless (and therefore lawsuit-proof, I presume) and is referred to on the cardboard as "THE VP"- while at the same time making it clear that said individual is NOT "THE VP", but rather that he's just some nameless Important Big Deal who is referred to by the moniker "A  VP". However, the punch-line here is that this "A VP"-according to this flyer- has had some sort of- and brace yourself, b/c you are likely to be overcome by a fit of laughter here that cannot be easily dispelled, if you are like I was-- anyway apparently this "A VP" has for somereason had some kind of Generic Spiritual Awakening, this time not about alcohol or drugs but about "The Environment."

    Now, finish laughing before you read on, because trust me, it gets even BETTER ! This nameless Wall-Street executive type person not only has had this Great Spiritual Awakening about this nebulous political cause known as The Environment, but- get this--- he has decided to pass  his awakening on through the practices of his company.

    I'm sure you can guess the rest. The reason there's no manual in the Mackie Universal box is, of course, because as we all know, had they chosen to put one in there, then Trees would have had t o be killed, and that would have HURT this nebulous Star-Wars like Force for All Good in the Galaxy known as "The Environment.'

    Before I continue, please understand, I AM A VEGAN. I have been doing my best to reduce my personal carbon footprint on this planet for the past 10 years by working my rear off to change my bad habits as a consumer and to reduce the amount of physical waste I'm forced to throw away. Working to save the environment is a (usually) thankless, difficult, and PERSONAL job. That means the only way to make a difference is to change your PERSONAL habits (eg, use less toilet paper, recycle, reduce the amount of toilet flushing, ration paper towels and products, COOK INSTEAD OF EATING OUT-ESPECIALLY FAST FOOD. The most effective way, however, has been demonstrated time and time again to so dramatically negate a given individual's carbon footprint, however, is to stop eating ANIMAL AND DAIRY PRODUCTS.

    Now, to the business at hand, which is heaping upon Mackie every last shred of ridicule that they so richly deserve for choosing to screw their own customers like this.

    HEY MACKIE!!! You are NOT fooling anyone !!!! You quit putting printed manuals in your products for one reason and ONE REASON ONLY, and that is TO SAVE ONE MORE LOUSY MISERABLE BUCK.

    You didn't do it for The Environment. You did it to save a few cents to a dollar on production.  Please hear me here, and don't misunderstand. I am not your typical free-love peacenik hippie. I am a hippie, yes, but I am also a scientist, an author, and a philosophical pragmatist. Hippie is only a stupid (but sometimes useful) label that serves to describe a colleciton of qualities and general beliefs that I adhere to. However, Hear This:  THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH TRYING TO SAVE PRODUCTION COSTS.

    Also, TRYING TO SAVE PRODUCTION COSTS Just So Happens to also "BE GOOD FOR 'THE ENVIRONMENT'" , YES !! All this IS TRUE.

    But what I object to is being TOLD THAT you are no longer giving your customers printed manuals BECAUSE IT IS GOOD FOR THE ENVIRONMENT. Poppycock And Balderdash !!!

    Okay, so to recap, I have been deprived of my rightful owner's manual by you, and not only that, I have been patronized, condescended to and finally I have weathered a nearly unendurable beachhead of assaults upon my intellect so massive as to nearly rival the actual famed Allied beachhead at Normandy. .

    All of which, however, I might possibly find tolerable if it actually did something-anything, really, for the environment. But perhaps the biggest Lemon off all here is that this decision will, after all is said and done, have such a negligible effect on total 'carbon production' (which is an unfortunate misnomer, too, but that is a rant for another time but one which we WILL have, so important is it).

    You may well ask* HOW? Well, because the Big Studios who purchase this item are going to want a reference in print. Reading and looking up stuff on line is still inconvenient when compared to the handiness of carrying around a manual. Therefore, they will log on to the provided site where the PDF version of the manual is. What will they do, then? Will they index it, perhaps, so all the I Phone  and IPad-weilding  employees can log on at willl when they need to consult the manual?

    In a pipe dream, perhaps. In reality, though, they will PRINT OUT the manual using a laser or inkjet printer.

    IT IS A FACT, HOWEVER, THAT DUE TO THE WASTEFUL NATURE OF THESE PERSONAL PRINTERS AS COMPARED TO THE STREAMLINED, COST-EFFECTIVE PROCESSES DEVELOPED BY PROFESSIONAL PRINTERS AND SUPPLEMENTED BY COMPUTER TECHNOLOGY, AS WELL AS BEING HONED TO A FINE ART FORM BY CENTURIES OF EXPERIENCE BEGINNING WITH CHARLES GUTENBERG, THE USE OF SUCH PRINTERS WILL LEAVE A CARBON FOOTPRINT THAT IS SO MASSIVE AS COMPARED TO THE ONE THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN LEFT HAD MACKIE SIMPLY CONTRACTED AN EXPERIENCED PRINTER TO DO THE MANUAL FOR THEM, LIKE EVERYONE ELSE STILL DOES, THAT THIS DECISION BY MACKIE WILL ACTUALLY DAMAGE THE ENVIRONMENT.

    Let me say that again: Mackie's decision will CAUSE A MUCH LARGER CARBON FOOTPRINT TO BE MADE than what would have resulted had they simply continued to include printed manuals like a REAL Music Recording company, such as ROLAND, does. Personal printers are some of the most wasteful devices still in use on the planet. IN FACT- get THIS- The ink that personal printers use, that is being sprayed DIRECTLY into the environment as it splashes off the paper in the form of vapor and said paper is in most cases eventually tossed away and hauled to land fill, not to mention the millions upon millions of empty ink cartridges being buried in landfills where they decay and are broken, their contents mingling with the moisture whenever it rains and eventually seeping into the groundwater itself.

    Anyway, this INK is almost PURE CARBON !!! That, my friends, is the punchline of Mackie's little joke.

    IF Mackie had simply stated something like this: "We, Mackie, Need to Cut Costs Or We may loose profits- ergo investors, etc, etc, leading eventually to our demise and failure to offer you anymore of our fine products. Therefore, we are asking you, the customer, to assume the cost of printing the manual yourself, or even better, if you can afford it, purchase a device like an Amazon Kindle, that you can use to COMFORTABLY READ THE MANUAL ON WHILE IT REMAINS DIGITAL, tthen you will not only be helping us and saving yourself some dough, you'd be helping the environment too."

    Had Mackie put a flyer in saying something like htat, then they would have not only gained my respect, retained my patronage, and that of many others, they would have also ACTUALLY DONE SOMETHING TO HELP THE ENVIORONMENT.

    What they Chose To Do only pays lip service to helping the environment, and it embodies everything that the political enemies of clean air and water hate about our movement.

    Mackie, I expected better of you.

    Take a hint from Roland and Cakewalk, Mackie. Roland actually HELPS THE ENVIRONMENT by their actions.

    More about how, if you guys are interested, in my next. Please, pass the word on.
    Also, tell me what you think:

    Should I keep my Universal Pro Controller? Or should I send it back in the face of this insult and buy something else from a company that is ACTUALLY HELPING the environment instead of PRETENDING to help it while actually damaging it even more?

    Please let me know what you think!!!

    Courtney Patricia "GuitarGamerGirl" Parsons


    This I would
    * You might also ask as well as WHO is this girl to say these things? She might e and idionsd hold a BS in Chemistry and Physics, and a MS in Quantum Bio-Physical Chemistry  (also known as 'Computational Physical-Organic Chemistry' from North Carolina. That is not really what qualifies me here, though. My actual title at Oak Ridge was Environmental Analytical Research Chemist, and in PA I worked as what is known as an Industrial Hygienist. Is that enough to qualify me?

    Wow...How long did it take you to write all of that ? 
     
    I am right in assuming that there was no manual included with the product ?
     

    Sorry - I don't use Autotune :)
    #22
    FastBikerBoy
    Forum Host
    • Total Posts : 11326
    • Joined: 2008/01/25 16:15:36
    • Location: Watton, Norfolk, UK
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/24 08:41:16 (permalink)
    Yep, it's a man thing........... Curse at how the stupid thing doesn't work properly. Spend hours trying in vain to fathom it out, throw it in the corner and repeat everyday for a month. BUT....... never, ever, never, under any circumstances, show weakness by admitting you might need to read the manual...
    #23
    spacealf
    Max Output Level: -54 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 2133
    • Joined: 2010/11/18 17:44:34
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/25 14:47:13 (permalink)
    I have always gotten a manual with any equipment and not having one means you have to download it off of the Internet on the computer. But any manual you have to read, so it should have included one. Of course, if you spent that much there may be better equipment out there, so of course, I don't use one, because it is just another piece of equipment in the mix in recording, and I am not playing live to need one, thus not needed.
    Depending on what you do, there may be better equipment out there, although Mackie is known for two things, I think I read. First if it breaks down, you have to replace about all of it (others have separate modules and only the broken module has to be replaced - I think that is Heath and Allen mixers) and Mackie usually works good enough to have a place in history as a control panel. But for that much money there are others that may be more suited to what you need and really need. Of course I can do is tell you that they exist:

    http://www.sweetwater.com/shop/studio/mixers/

    and Allen and Heath may be one of those, along with some others. Well, up to you.


    #24
    bapu
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 86000
    • Joined: 2006/11/25 21:23:28
    • Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/25 16:22:02 (permalink)
    FastBikerBoy


    Yep, it's a man thing........... Curse at how the stupid thing doesn't work properly. Spend hours trying in vain to fathom it out, throw it in the corner and repeat everyday for a month. BUT....... never, ever, never, under any circumstances, show weakness by admitting you might need to read the manual...

    What's a manual?


    #25
    Beagle
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 50621
    • Joined: 2006/03/29 11:03:12
    • Location: Fort Worth, TX
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/25 17:05:31 (permalink)
    bapu


    FastBikerBoy


    Yep, it's a man thing........... Curse at how the stupid thing doesn't work properly. Spend hours trying in vain to fathom it out, throw it in the corner and repeat everyday for a month. BUT....... never, ever, never, under any circumstances, show weakness by admitting you might need to read the manual...

    What's a manual?

    5 speed shifter.
     
    4 on the floor.
     
    3 on the tree...

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
    i7, 16G DDR3, Win10x64, MOTU Ultralite Hybrid MK3
    Yamaha MOXF6, Hammond XK3c, other stuff.
    #26
    Cactus Music
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 8424
    • Joined: 2004/02/09 21:34:04
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/28 12:03:09 (permalink)
    Hey, I thought I clicked on Hardware, not the coffee house,,WTF??

    Johnny V  
    Cakelab  
    Focusrite 6i61st - Tascam us1641. 
    3 Desktops and 3 Laptops W7 and W10
     http://www.cactusmusic.ca/
     
     
    #27
    ChuckC
    Max Output Level: -61 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 1488
    • Joined: 2010/02/13 01:22:55
    • Location: Port Charlotte, Fl
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/28 15:34:24 (permalink)
    Yeah well, Gamegirl lead us down this ugly path and like fools we all followed by caving in a posting, thus feeding a pointless flame.

    ADK Built DAW, W7, Sonar Platinum, Studio One Pro,Yamaha HS8's & HS8S  Presonus Studio/Live 24.4.2, A few decent mic pre's,  lots of mics, 57's,58 betas, Sm7b, LD Condensors, Small condensors, Senn 421's,  DI's,  Sans Amp, A few guitar amps etc. Guitars : Gib. LP, Epi. Lp, Dillion Tele, Ibanez beater, Ibanez Ergodyne 4 String bass, Mapex Mars series 6 pc. studio kit, cymbals and other sh*t.
    http://www.everythingiam.net/
    http://www.stormroomstudios.com
    Some of my productions: http://soundcloud.com/stormroomstudios
    #28
    Jeff Evans
    Max Output Level: -24 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 5139
    • Joined: 2009/04/13 18:20:16
    • Location: Ballarat, Australia
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/28 15:52:53 (permalink)
    hey Gamegirl your rant is way too long. You don't get printed manuals these days, you get pdf's instead. Get over it and get on with making some music. If not getting a printed manual is going to be a deal breaker for you then you are going to miss out on a lot of great products!

    If they printed out some manuals they would be the size of a house. Pdf's are very good. If you are clever, open them up on a laptop next to you main computer and you then have instant access to the manual. (which everyone should read at least once!) Also you can carry hundreds of them around on a laptop and read them anywhere. And they can be updated too, something a printed manual cannot do.
    post edited by Jeff Evans - 2011/11/28 16:10:05

    Specs i5-2500K 3.5 Ghz - 8 Gb RAM - Win 7 64 bit - ATI Radeon HD6900 Series - RME PCI HDSP9632 - Steinberg Midex 8 Midi interface - Faderport 8- Studio One V4 - iMac 2.5Ghz Core i5 - Sierra 10.12.6 - Focusrite Clarett thunderbolt interface 
     
    Poor minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas -Eleanor Roosevelt
    #29
    HighAndDry
    Max Output Level: -79 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 586
    • Joined: 2007/04/02 04:02:45
    • Status: offline
    Re:Mackie OUTRAGE !!! 2011/11/29 15:25:40 (permalink)
    Hey Gamegirl
        I loved your rant.   you could have just ****ed about them no longer including a printed manual but your rant was almost literary!  And just for the record, I prefer a printed manual to downloading one online.

    ASRock Z97 Pro 4 Motherboard
    Chipset : Intel Z97
    Intel i7 4790k
    32 gb Ballistix (crucial) 1600 DDR3 ram

    Corsair 330R case Corsair Rm750 ultra quiet power supply
    Win 10 64 bit

    Motu 1248 AVB
    Mackie Onyx Blackbird 16 x16 FW
    Sonar Platinum

    #30
    Page: 12 > Showing page 1 of 2
    Jump to:
    © 2024 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1