picklebunker
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Mixing Rookie needs help
I NEED HELP! I'm about to start mixing a project for my band and I'm having trouble finding a nice "pocket" when mixing. Can I please get some advice from both experts and rookies on what is wrong, all the way from levels to compression etc. Performances are what they are (sadly, we could use some practice) but hey, very few are doing this for anything other than fun... right. This was recorded live into a Korg 1600 (dinosaur unit) and some tracks exported (analogue, as it would not transfer digitally) into Sonar 6 PE for tweaking. Needless to say, I did this only when absolutely necessary. Mastering is not my thing so I tried the best I could with Ozone 4, and playing with some presets. Thanks in advance for any suggestions. The song in question is THIS WORLD APART This World Apart. http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=805324
post edited by picklebunker - 2011/05/15 14:57:37
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AT
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Re:Mixing Rookie needs help
2011/05/15 15:12:13
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The drums are most problematic. Sometimes too loud, sometimes too soft. And overall it seems missing a little high end, tho that might be Soundclick conversion.
Lay off Ozone until you are happy w/ the mix, although you might want to switch it in/out to see how "mastering" will affect the sound.
Pretty good, overall. Nice bass separation. I'd have the guitarist do another doodle/rhythm part to balance the one already there and leave the lead for the lead parts. Pan the rhythm guitars wide and put the lead straight down the middle. Also the bass - it seemed a little off to the right.
PUt the drums on a drum buss. Turn the snare down a little. Put the Sonitus comp on the bus and use the 1176 or whatever it is called on it and let it even out the song. Then find a way to put some high end back into the drums. Maybe overdub some high hats.
Those would be what I'd try first. take them with a grain of salt, but you might find some starting point there. but you are on the right track.
@
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http://www.bnoir-film.com/ there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. 24 And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them.
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:Mixing Rookie needs help
2011/05/15 15:12:17
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At the risk of seeming harsh I'd say the mix in general is going in a good direction, but the bass part is not contributing to the song at all. Often times you will see mention of the fact that a song's arrangement is the first step in mixing. I'm just throwing this idea out there but this song is basically a rework of All Along the Watchtower and the bass part is reinforcing that impression with it's part by repeating the motif over and over again. Mix wise, I'd encourage the bassist to play a different bass line down in a lower register so that the song had a wider spectrum of tone. The guitars get a little swampy with their stereo effects... maybe that's ok... just depends on what you want. Everything else sounds ok... and your final choices will probably simply reflect opinions rather than any technical fact. The vocals get buried a lot... maybe that's good? Maybe that's bad? That's up to you and the band. I know you said you are doing for fun so the obvious remake of Jimi's version of Dylan's All Along the Watchtower isn't a big deal... but if this was serious work... it would be hard to take it seriously because it's such a blatant copy. I hope this info is helpful... it's not meant to discourage. I think the mix is 90+% there and you really need to decide, opinion wise... what you and the band want with regards to subtle tweaks and adjustments. all the best, mike
post edited by mike_mccue - 2011/05/15 15:14:13
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picklebunker
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Re:Mixing Rookie needs help
2011/05/15 15:39:20
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AT - Thanks for the advice. I had the same thought about the drums (snare) and almost mentioned this in the post but decided to leave out the comment. Question: Will the Sonitus even out the drum levels as a whole for the song or will I have to ride the faders?
Mike - Thanks, and the reference to All Along the Watch Tower... We just recognized that a couple of weeks ago with the song and thought, "CRAP". Well, it's all done now though so we'll just keep it going. I agree with the bass line suggestion. I much prefer mixing a full deep bass instead of stuff up the neck. If you knew my bass player you'd understand why I just let him do what he does. :) I'm kicking myself for recording the rythm guitar with effects on it because when I try to clarify that guitar it just sounds more messy as I also clarify the effect (which is inappropriate) This is the problem with using the Korg 1600 for the main unit.... only 14 tracks to mix with, and limited processing. I agree that maybe a sitdown with the band to put more interest into the arrangement is a goodl idea. Especially given the similarities to Watchtower.
al
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mtgonzalez
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Re:Mixing Rookie needs help
2011/05/16 12:10:55
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love the vocals sounds that you got, killer guitar solo's too
being a bass player I would agree with more movement
I like how the ending fades back in
Sounds good, keep it up you'll get it
Win 10 - 64-bit - Intel Core I5 3.3GHz 1TB HD 500 GB SSD - 8GB Ram - 7200RPM X3 Producer & Sonar Platinum www.mtgrecordingstudio.com
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Guitarhacker
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Re:Mixing Rookie needs help
2011/05/16 15:07:20
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The mix is pretty decent... a few tweeks here and there.
The bigger issue is how close it is to Watchtower.... It's ok to write a song and then discover that your creativity is more of a copy.... but at that point of realization, it's time to re-write it so it is not a copy.... even the guitar lead is way to close to the Hendrix version for comfort.
So... IMHO... you should rewrite it, I would not put it out on a CD project as is.
My 2 cents worth.
My website & music: www.herbhartley.com MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface BMI/NSAI "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer "
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picklebunker
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Re:Mixing Rookie needs help
2011/05/17 01:48:35
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MT - Thanks for the props, man. I don't normally get them for vox so that's good.
GTH - Ya, no worries about the tune going onto an album. If it's this close to a classic, and everyone notices this, it's a rewrite. I wonder if anyone told Kid Rock about Werewolf in London? :) This isn't a signature song anyway so that wouldn't be a big loss, it's just the one I started with. Thanks for the comments. All the respect.
al
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craigb
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Re:Mixing Rookie needs help
2011/05/17 02:14:10
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Sounds like a promising tune! Ironically, I just watched the video below tonight and then listened to your mix. Check it out and see if the tip helps both your bass and drums. Use whatever EQ you have available. Good luck!  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSNYBbPAvKE
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
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Guitarhacker
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Re:Mixing Rookie needs help
2011/05/17 08:17:25
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There are so many tunes that are close to other tunes....
Need you now & Eye in the sky, come to mind in the country charts now.... Lady A's tune is really close to the Parson tune....in so many ways
If you want to release it, by all means do it.... I was simply commenting of what struck me about the melody and production.
My website & music: www.herbhartley.com MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface BMI/NSAI "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer "
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picklebunker
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Re:Mixing Rookie needs help
2011/05/17 13:49:45
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CraigB - Hey, great link on EQ! I don't have the experience with mixing left, right and center eq so this is a great head's up. Do you use the Fab Filter plugin yourself? Looks very friendly.
GTH - Thanks buddy, I've heard alot of your mixes so telling me it's almost there is a positive. Like they always say in American Idol, "if you're not going to do it better than the original, then don't do it." Of course, unless you change it up so much that it becomes your own. Not unlike Chris Cornell's version of Billy Jean...... Awesome interpretation.
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craigb
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Re:Mixing Rookie needs help
2011/05/17 14:24:30
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Yourolpal just posted about the new FabFilter Pro G yesterday (an awesome gate) and after watching that video I ended up watching all their videos - very educational! I don't have any of their filters yet, but will definitely consider them once I have enough money. Having a spectrum analyzer built in is brilliant. In the meantime, I'm thinking you can use any EQ at your disposal to work that drum and bass tip. What I was hearing in your mix seemed like some contention for space between the bass and drum - hence the link to the video. I'm sure there are plenty of other tutorial videos out there, but one that I have is linked below. It was really good at getting you to realize the full 3D environment that you are mixing in and breaks things down like this: Front to back = volume Left to right = panning Top to bottom = frequency With the goal that everything should have it's own place in that 3D environment. That EQ tip just shows how to give both the kick and the bass their own space. Here's that link: http://www.amazon.com/Art-Mixing-Recording-Engineering-Production/dp/B00005YB4C/ref=sr_1_7?s=video&ie=UTF8&qid=1305656506&sr=1-7
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
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