Bflat5
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Mixing and mastering
Anyone know of a video online or DVD that covers mixing and mastering with Sonar?
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bapu
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/14 21:59:46
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Sonar in and of itself does not have anything specific/unique to the art of mixing and mastering. Yes, maybe a knob or two might look different on a Sonitus/ProCHannel EQ/Delay compared to say Waves or UAD or Fabfilter etc. but the concepts might more of what you need? If so, try watching and reading anything you can. But please be aware (as I am sure you are) one video and/or one book will not make you a pro mixer or ME overnight.
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M_Glenn_M
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/14 22:31:31
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I've been looking for the -Just do it like I want it-button in Sonar for some time now.
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michael japan
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/14 22:47:16
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Into the Lair by Dave Pensado on youtube covers many things. He doesn't use Sonar but you will learn a lot.
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jonny3d
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/15 09:41:07
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CJaysMusic
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/15 12:31:55
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You would go about mixing and mastering in Sonar, the same as you would mix and master it in any other program platform. Each song/project will need different things done to it. no 2 songs will need the same exact levels and effects. So train your ears and learn how to use your plugin effects and/or hardware effects and you can mix and master in any program. The program doesn't matter.
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konradh
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/15 13:22:42
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The hardest thing for most people is this: they can hear something is not right but they don't know what to fix. For example, you often hear the advice about boosting the EQ and sweeping the frequency until you hear the bad thing. You are supposed to note that frequency as the place to cut. In real life, when you boost like that, almost every frequency sounds horrible if boosted significantly. And, as we've discussed on another post, EQ can be deceiving. For example, I had a female vocal that sounded too hard and loud every time the note was around the E above Middle C (approx 330hz). The answer, however, was not to cut 300-400 Hz, but to cut around 2.5K. Similarly, you can understand what everything on a compressor does but still have trouble getting the sound you hear others get. What would be helpful would be examples in which someone played a mix or track, talked about it, and then showed specifically what was used to correct various problems. For maximum value, this would consist of various tracks and songs that had different characters. Tutorials on a single song are interesting but limited in value.
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CJaysMusic
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/15 14:26:32
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Yea, the best thing is to attend a mixing and/or mastering session and see how the engineer deals with things and issues. But note there are different issues with each song, so there are no step by step instructions. Cj
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jonny3d
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/15 15:49:37
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konradh The hardest thing for most people is this: they can hear something is not right but they don't know what to fix. For example, you often hear the advice about boosting the EQ and sweeping the frequency until you hear the bad thing. You are supposed to note that frequency as the place to cut. In real life, when you boost like that, almost every frequency sounds horrible if boosted significantly. And, as we've discussed on another post, EQ can be deceiving. For example, I had a female vocal that sounded too hard and loud every time the note was around the E above Middle C (approx 330hz). The answer, however, was not to cut 300-400 Hz, but to cut around 2.5K. Similarly, you can understand what everything on a compressor does but still have trouble getting the sound you hear others get. What would be helpful would be examples in which someone played a mix or track, talked about it, and then showed specifically what was used to correct various problems. For maximum value, this would consist of various tracks and songs that had different characters. Tutorials on a single song are interesting but limited in value.
I agree... I have often wanted several bass tracks ..in different styles ...before and after...with the many different approaches.. Like a DI bass with an mic'd amp - compressing - eq etc. Sooo.. in MY room I can hear the same before and after references to get a better idea of what I should be listening for..doing and not doing .. and then maybe I'll have a better perspective on when I should be satisfied ..and of course extrapolate this to kick ..snare ..gtr..whatever
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Wouter Schijns
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/15 18:01:16
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The Vintage Channel (VC 64) plugin has nice mastering presets. Blending this to your mix can be a start. Then Sonitus or LP64 multiband can help, specially to boost bass while keeping it smooth. (only enabling 1 or 2 low bands with a nice preset) Free mastering plugin (left this awesome guy a donation). http://www.terrywest.nl/utils.html (at bottom list download the 'After' plugin). Easy add clarity, body, punch or NYcompr with just 1 knob. Here's a professional mastering engineer at work: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53oGeuTZ6IY
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bent4life
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/15 19:01:24
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Bflat5 Anyone know of a video online or DVD that covers mixing and mastering with Sonar?
Groove 3 was already mentioned. Pretty much everything they produce is top quality - "Mixing with Sonar X1" is excellent.
Win 7 Pro x64; i7 3770k; 16GB RAM; Sonar Platinum; Moto Ultralite-mk4
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Wouter Schijns
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/15 19:23:55
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Medion pc,Line6 GX,Sennheiser280,Roland A500S, SonarX3
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bent4life
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/15 19:45:23
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Wouter Schijns preview of Bent's vid here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LS4SZI0TOs I think 'mixing with sonar' is not that helpful, but that's just an opinion. bought all Sonar vids, vids by Anderton + Krantzberg very helpful, I think. Graham has nice vids on mixing/mastering I think, unfortutaly in Pro Tools but help me learn understand still http://www.youtube.com/user/recordingrevolution?feature=watch
+1 on Graham's vids (The Recording Revolution). The principles apply for Sonar. Krantzberg is very good, too.
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bandso
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/15 21:32:51
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Bandlab Platinum and every other toy I can get my hands on...and yes I'm way in debt over this obsession...
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MelodicJimmy
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/16 00:36:18
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I just finished recording and mixing an album. I'm not an expert mixer by any means, but there was one rule that I LIVED by: DON'T - BOOST - ANY - FREQUENCIES with an EQ!!!!! If something sounded too muddy or bassy, fine, cut it. In fact, I did A LOT of cutting with the EQ, especially with the vocals (male singer, low tenor/ baritone range). So, not overusing EQ was very important to me, personally. Anytime you start "adding treble" or "adding mids," it sounds like crap. Get the tone you want BEFORE you record! Also, Perfect Space is awesome.
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Danny Danzi
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/16 03:53:09
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konradh What would be helpful would be examples in which someone played a mix or track, talked about it, and then showed specifically what was used to correct various problems. For maximum value, this would consist of various tracks and songs that had different characters. Tutorials on a single song are interesting but limited in value.
Shameless plug alert, but I can't think of any way else to explain this, so forgive me. There is a method to my madness, so hang with me a sec. I do exactly what you asked for in my video lessons. The difference is I use your song, your plugs. This way you see how YOUR song sounds with the compressor/effects you use while learning HOW things can be used. All tracks in your song can be used if you want, each track instrument at a time, or certain instruments. I show you before and after as well as why things were decided upon on my end. You find out where you may have went wrong, where you went right, what else can be done, subjective additives, tips and tricks, ways to improve your work-flow, techniques....it's nuts. Each lesson custom made for a person based on their needs or I can create a lesson for them based on conversation. Nothing stock, scripted or used for another person. *end shameless plug* (sincere apologies) With a decent engineer driving the bus, your "what would be helpful" would not work unless he purposely recorded sounds that needed work. To me, there's no reason for that as again, it doesn't really help you if your sounds are recorded better. I mean granted, someone could create a "polish a turd" video where every sound is horrendous. I would bet my farm your sounds are not even close to horrendous. I'm sure some of the surgery involved with polishing a turd could probably help, but in my opinion you need your own examples of your stuff, not someone elses. The reason something *I* would create wouldn't work in your situation (if we used my instrumentation).....my stuff sounds decent without doing a thing. (IMHO) That does you no good other than to make you really think about your initial sound being the best it can be before you record a thing. We need to find out what YOU are doing wrong with YOUR recording. How YOU are eqing things and are you possibly misusing eq, compression or doing something wrong? This is what turns fair engineers into good/great ones. You have to know where your problems are before you can fix them. Before you can fix your problem areas, you have to know what to listen for. Sometimes we need to be taught...literally. I can show you 3 different ways to compress my own material. None of those compression settings will work on your stuff unless you have a similar recording style and similar sounds. None of the high passing or low passing/sculpting eq work on my stuff will benefit you on your stuff. You'll see examples of things which can help a bit...but again, it does nothing to help with what YOU are experiencing. This is why certain books, videos using material that is not recorded by you, plugs and programs you do not use, hardware you do not have....will never help teach you as much as you think it might. That's just my take on things though. YMMV. -Danny
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JClosed
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/16 04:38:02
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Oh come on... Mastering is not difficult at all I got a great tip from another forum. Just take a look at this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bY4UFEZFRpg While this is for Ableton Live, I is also completely usable in Sonar too (yes even with the Cakewalk plugins, although FabFilter is "promoted" here). Now - that was not that hard.. wasn't it? Although - I must admit it was not exactly what I had imagined mastering would be. I have a slight feeling something is not totally correct, but I can't imagine what.. Anyway - now everybody can master his/hers songs...
post edited by JClosed - 2013/08/16 04:50:37
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doncolga
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/16 14:54:42
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JClosed, Thank you so much for that link. It really is that easy. Even better, I'll just make one preset and run all my songs through it, just to save some time.
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doncolga
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/16 14:57:58
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This is not mixing/mastering specifically, but I did pick up the SWA Complete SONAR X2 videos and I've learned a ton. Money well spent. DAWs do *SO* much I'm not even aware of.
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John
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/16 15:42:52
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"Sonar in and of itself does not have anything specific/unique to the art of mixing and mastering." If that were true how on this earth do people mix using Sonar? You do know that it comes with mixing and mastering plugins? Pro Channel is a configurable channel strip for mixing.
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lawajava
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/16 22:49:01
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Bb5 - I concur with the consensus here - many good ideas. Regarding your OP, I also heartily concur with the recommendations for the Groove 3 tutorials on Sonar - especially in your case, the one on Mixing in Sonar X1 which is still totally relevant even with X2. Actually using that tutorial as a basis I recently posted a message regarding bus mixing, which has some of its starting ideas originating from that tutorial. If interested my post on that is here: http://forum.cakewalk.com...echnique-m2870816.aspx
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bapu
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/18 12:55:40
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konradh For example, you often hear the advice about boosting the EQ and sweeping the frequency until you hear the bad thing. You are supposed to note that frequency as the place to cut. In real life, when you boost like that, almost every frequency sounds horrible if boosted significantly.
Konradh, I've thought this to be true (in my experience) but was always a bit apprehensive about saying it out loud. Maybe I just dont' know what to actually listen for??!!??
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Poco
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Re: Mixing and mastering
2013/08/19 16:19:28
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I found this course to be very helpful: Production Mixing Mastering with Waves - 5th Edition You can get it on Amazon - Get the one with the CD and DVDs. It has projects of different genres with all of the appropriate mastering effects applied. You can turn them off and on to hear what they do. It's relatively straight forward to go from the Waves plugins (14 day trail versions included) to your own when you have learned what to do with them. At one time, it was a Berklee course. I don't know if it still is, but is has some magic between the covers :-)
post edited by Poco - 2013/08/19 16:26:12
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