Motu 8Pre

 What should I be looking for to control the levels coming out of this interface before they go into Sonar? Is it "Motu Cuemix Console"? I actually just realized I can't control input levels in Sonar. I arm a track and adjust the trim on the interface to make sure the meter on the interface is NOT clipping and then I "think" I am doing the same in Sonar with the "Trim" or "Gain" setting in Sonar, but everyone hear says that is NOT happening. So in theroy. Plug instrument/mic into one of eight input/preamps in the Motu 8Pre interface. Adjust level within the confines of that interface with the gain knob on the interface, using the meter on the interface to determine clipping levels and make sure there is no clipping. Adjust output of the interface as it goes into the input of the Sonar application using the interfaces software mixing tool. Keep in mind to check for clipping in Sonar as it is monitoring the input levels only at this point. Let me know if I am close to understanding this...thanks.

I only use CueMix for setting live monitoring levels. You shouldn't have to worry about the levels going out to the computer, as long as you're not clipping you'll be OK.

If your not seeing all the inputs you might not be using the ASIO drivers. 
Go to audio options and make sure your in ASIO mode. 
While your there check the "Drivers" tab and make sure all the MOTU inputs are checked. 
Make sure your on board sound card is disabled and NOT on the list or greyed out. 
You inputs will show up looking something like this

Left Motu Mike in  1 ( this is input 1 ) 
Right Motu mike in 1 ( this is input 2 ) 
Stereo Motu Mike in  1 ( this is used if you combine 1 &2 as a stereo track) 
Left Motu Mike in  3 ( this is input 3 )  
Right Motu mike in 3 ( this is input 4 )  
For recording your band you should set up a template that has all 8 inputs pre assigned to a track. Name each track etc. Save this template. 

 

 Thanks Cactus Music! I am indeed using ASIO and I do see what you describe and thought it was very confusing, until explained to me today on the forum. I have recently disabled many things to optimize my PC and one of them is the internal sound card. I currently have a template set up and it has six audio tracks, as that is all the mics I have for now. I will change this to reflect your suggestion and include in the naming process the input number for example Track One = Guitar I1, Track Two = Bass I2, etc. Thanks so much. Any ideas on the output of the Motu clipping my input on Sonar? BitFlipper has said not to worry and I agree, as the last recording came out much better, even though at the time I did not know that my settings in Sonar of the trim/gain slider had no effect on what I was capturing. Go figure.

I'm glad Dave ( Bitflipper) explained the clipping as I think this must be a little different for each interface. My Tascam only has peak LED's that go from green to red so I use the Sonar track meter. 
When recording a band live I tend to go on the lower side just in case. Digital overload is nasty and cannot be repaired, were as a low level is easy to bring up later. 

As far as making a CD before you go home, what I was doing was make everyone bring a USB flash drive. At $8 each 

And yes your going to find that Sonars bare bones export will be a little lower in volume than what has become the ridiculous standard now. 
I would not use Boost11 
Use the ,, oh oh your still on Sonar 7 ,, 
I was going to recommend the Linear Compressor LP64Multi Band. 
I have had excellent results with that,  Boost 11 will work but it squashes  frequencies all at once, A multi band compressor lets the music breath a little more. 

Thanks again Cactus Music and BitFlipper. You earned the kind words so no problem.

Any suggestions on a good free limiter, or I can just google it and look at what users say about them, thanks again.

I might, but am not sure, have the LP64. I think it was included in the Producer Edition, I will check. Just checked on the website and yes it is included...GREAT! So this should be better than a free online one or not?


O.K. so here is what I found last night:

Using ASIO I have Right/Left/Stereo with 1 and 2, 3 and 4, 5 and 6, 7 and 8.

Using WDM I have Right/Left/Stereo with 1 and 1 and 1, 3 and 3 and 3, 5 and 5 and 5, 7 and 7 and 7.

So thank you to both of you as now I know what I am dealing with and understand that in ASIO Right/Left 1 and 1 is really input one and two on the interface. And, if using WDM Right/Left 1 and 2 is really input 1 and 2 on the interface. 

You would think MOTU could have included this in their literature, oh well.

So I set up my inputs correctly now with Sonar and have them as mono by selecting the correct Right/Left 1 and 1 using ASIO, as I think I read that ASIO has lower and fewer latency problems.

Also when in track view I clicked on the icon located on the bottom of each track that selects stereo or mono it kinda looks like eight lines stacked vertically where the outside lines are higher and get smaller as you move inwards to the center. If you click it it cuts out one side icon leaving four lines going from max to minimum from left to right. It reminds me of the icon used to identify volume control on most computer applications. I need to find out what this really does, as when I started this journey three or four weeks ago, I would click on this and it would change the level meter from two thin meters to one fat meter. I have since changed that meter to reflect little hash marks instead of a solid line and changing that stereo icon has not effected that meter. Oh well, I am learning.

I tell you what though, because of forums like this and great guys like you I really have learned alot while stumbling along. I mean, really, I am recording and it is working for me, but as you can imagine you just want to download knowledge and experience in a one time dump from a flash drive to you brain and be a journeyman all at once so that you can make "good" recordings and have no issues, but that is not possible and the journey is part of the fun I guess.

Thanks again guys.

 Nice, thanks BitFlipper! Good to hear from you.

You need to insert the limiter after the LP64, so that the limiter is the very last plugin in the master bus fx chain. 

Also avoid large boosts with the LP64. If large boosts are required, try to do the boosting at the track level rather than on the bus. 

If SONAR's meters indicate incoming levels on the master that are above about -6db, you can use the Trim slider to lower it.

Well your very close and your way will work but there's no reason to bounce the tracks to a stereo mix. Just export the mix. You can then bring this back in to mess with if you don't own software for mastering. 

I sometimes do not even make sub mix busses if the track count is sparce. 
Efx's like reverb I use efxs sends ( busses) so that all tracks can share the same "space" it's a common fault to try too many different "spaces" in a mix. it creates mud. Start with nothing and slowly mix in your "space"  this can make or break your soundscape. 

The LP64 goes on your master buss in the efx bin. As Dave said, use it very lightly. 
I find by having it there it will show me if a certain frequency spectrum is hot or cold. It also catches any stray overs. If it's overworking it will sound bad, adjust the mix at the tracks level until each frequency just tickles the meters.  

All you need to do is perfect you mix so it sounds the way you want then export it. 
Your sort of mastering while mixing by adding the lp64 and in a way this should be a second step but it has been working very well for me. 

I then "master"" the stereo track in Wave Lab to tweak the rest. 

Cactus Music and BitFlipper

Thanks so much for taking the time to carry me on this.

Reading your answers only confirms my lack of knowledge and experience with this.

I will apply your suggestions and also make some time for reading and watching the videos on Cakewalks YouTube Channel.

I don't fully understand how to use the FX Bus. I took the "I don't know any better" approach and thought that if I clicked on any track and then right licked (to the left of the tracks) the FX box, and selected an FX, I was golden, but it sounds like I am muddying up the mix, but I don't know how to manage an FX bus. If I add FX to an FX bus, how do I assign it to a single track. Is it as simple as a drop down that allows me to assign it?

I can try this by just doing it, as this is what I have done since I started this journey a few months ago. I basically just click on things and learn as I go...sorry for that, I have read the literature and watched many videos, but that was awhile ago. Unfortunately, when I had the SW I had no practical way to use it, as I had nothing else, like an interface, mics etc. So all of the reading etc. never got applied and therefore was lost, so to speak. 

Thanks again...I will update after I dig in.

Hmm, $300, I'm not sure you can buy 2 monitors for that,,, maybe 1. 
So either spend more or buy the headphones. 
Monitors are SO important.  I feel blessed that I don't have to worry about that, hopefully until I'm to old to care...
Listening to monitor in the store only helps if you know what to listen for. 
My NMS10 would be the last ones you would have picked because they sound boring to most people, no bottom end. But I and a lot of other folks could not get a mix that will play on every system right without them. I believe there are now the Yamaha HS80m that is the closest replacement, I'd like to try a pair. As you see, your budget needs a little more than doubling to get the good stuff. 

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/HS80M