NI Drummer instruments: multi out, or use their onboard mixing?

I recently got Komplete and while I have looked at Studio Drummer and 60's Drummer I am yet to get to grips with them. However I could see no way of assigning multi outs. Most of my other Kontakt drum kits (Steven Slate, Sonic Reality) are Kontakt Multis (ie each drum is a different Kontakt instrument), this makes setting up separate outs possible. The Drummer series are single instruments, normally in Kontakt a single instrument can just be assigned one out.
 
The 60's Drummer manual makes no mention of setting up seperate outs.

I nearly always end up using my own effects. Even if the synth has decent built-in effects there's always something I want to do that I can't do within the synth's own mixer. Plus I usually end up freezing and unloading soft synths, making it impossible to tweak them without first unfreezing. Routing to separate audio tracks solves all these problems.

I use BFD2 which has a similar feature, but I bounce it all out to Audio tracks and edit/mix/pan/effect from there. 

I hate the drums... They take way too much time, and people always complain about mine anyway. Drums suck.

For what it's worth, in my opinion the Kontakt player with these newer kits are an absolute bear to set up in a multi-instance. Even when you DO get them right, there are still some issues I'm seeing that are driving me ballistic.

You must configure the mixer in Kontak so you can send your tracks the right way. Then, you must configure the mixer in the drum module (outs on each track in the module) to be sent into the mixer in Kontakt. From there, the mixer options will appear in your virtual Sonar tracks. This took me so long, I nearly gave up. I hate Kontakt and wish they would create something better that is easier to use.

Also, when you kill the effects on these new kits, it can really save on your cpu. I don't think the effects are anything to brag about, so kill them. But the mixer thing sharke...complete nightmare with any of the Abbey drums as well as Studio Drummer. I'm so glad I've done all this and can just drop my stuff in as a track template. I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy...ok, maybe I would...lol...but it's no fun and takes some experimenting and time to set it all up.

There are a few things to consider. 

How many drums will you be sending to virtual tracks? Once you know, the version of Kontakt you use is important. Not the version number. Version meaning Kontakt, Kontakt 8, Kontakt 16 outs. I use the 16 version so I can route my instruments sort of individually due to being a drum control freak. Kick, snare, hats, and individual toms all have their own tracks. Cymbals come through the over heads so I route them and "room" in stereo. But it's a bear and I wish it could be easier. I thought BFD 2 was a bit much as well, but it's a piece of cake compared to what I had to do in Kontakt.

Even when I do this as best as I can, there are still a few quirks as well as some mismatched names that come up in my Sonar input options to Kontakt. The internal mixer in Kontakt is the problem. That's where you have to do the majority of your work. Not the mixer in the drum program you use, but the Kontakt mixer. You have to set each output up and it's a bit confusing. To be honest, you're better off using it the way you are right now as this will suck the life out of you doing it the way I do it.

-Danny

Glyn Barnes

sharke



Glyn, it is possible, look for videos on YouTube. There's an option in Kontakt where you assign stereo or mono outs, which subsequently become visible in your DAW. 

 
I found this one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAvdl__b5ZM its part 2 but part one just deals with the basics of adding Outputs to the Kontakt mixer.
 
However this video and everthing else i found while googleing is for the older Abbey Road drums, the new Abbey Road 60's Drummer mixer looks quite different. Presumably the same method applies? I am travelling at the moment and won't be able to try this out for a while so I would appreciate any feedback if some one has it working.  I have an NI voucher that will expire soon and I may use it on 80's Drummer IF the multi outs work.
  

 

Here's one that seems to be a fairly good explanation:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_-e5mpt5ic 


It's geared towards Logic but the actual setting up of the outputs in Kontakt is explained pretty well. One thing I'd forgotten about which threw me the first time I did it was the need to reboot Kontakt after you set up the outputs, so that they appear in the drop down when you go to select the output for each drum.  

bapu


FWIW I followed the video sharke linked.

Once setup I created a track template that I use when I want NI drums. Each set is a little different and so I setup a fairly comprehensive 16 out (which is 8 stereo pairs) template and then I just verify that routing works for the respective kit. 

Also, I setup NI multi-out version of all NI Kits.

Ya Danny, it took me about four hours to do it but now the template is created and I just import when needed. A wise man once told me "Templates are the way to go, bro".

Ed, here's the thing.....doing it in stereo is easy but it's not the right way in my opinion. Think about it for a second. When we mic up a real drum kit, the only thing stereo are the OH's and the room, right? Also, if we plan on using our own effects per track and not the ones supplied with the program, there's no need for the stereo mixing configuration.
 
That said, from looking at those video's that were posted, I picked up on something that *I* wasn't doing that may have made things easier and more accurate. I'm going to try it and get back to you. There are still some quirky things going on with Kontakt that are driving me crazy. I'll explain all that if this new method I'm onto works and I'll tell you where I may have gone wrong so you too can try it.
 
-Danny