Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have?

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pureambient
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2018/12/15 13:27:21 (permalink)

Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have?

Hi
 
Like many people, I am having issues getting my beautiful NI S49 keyboard, to work well in SONAR.
 
In Standalone mode - the S49 works FLAWLESSLY.  I can browse through thousands of sounds, load, any and PLAY that sound, from the Keyboard - all without issue.
 
However - ALL BETS are off, when you load Komplete Kontrol into SONAR as a plug in.
 
I am very rusty with all of this, but I tried - and failed dismally - to EVER record a note using Komplete Kontrol within a SONAR session.
 
Now - it's even WORSE - I cannot get the S49 KEYS to respond - I cannot get the keyboard to trigger a loaded sound.
 
It's NO PROBLEM loading the Komplete Kontrol plug in - it loads right up.
 
I can then use the select knob on the keyboard, to scroll through and preview sounds - and it WORKS - sounds COME OUT.
 
But - when I then select a sound, and LOAD it....the BIG SILENCE BEGINS...AND NEVER, EVER, EVER ends.
 
 
Ever.
 
 
So what am I doing wrong?
 
Can anyone give me a series of things to CHECK?
 
 
I have learned a lot - for example, I know NOTHING about control surfaces.  But, I have learned in another forum, that I can set up SONAR to use a profile called VS-100 - which will work with Komplete Kontrol.
 
But when I go to set that up - I go into EDIT > Preferences then MIDI then CONTROL SURFACES
 
I push the yellow pushpin at top right...
 
And I can then supposedly, set this up - except - I CAN'T.
 
 
Because there are three things you select
 
1) VS-100   check - no problem
2) Input = Komplete Kontrol Input  =  NO - it's not THERE to select.
3) Output = Komplete Kontrol Output = No - it's not THERE to select.
 
So I exit again, and I tried to figure out how to ADD a midi device - and I have failed at that.  So I am sure the fact that SONAR doesn't seem to KNOW that Komplete Kontrol is an acceptable MIDI input, is part of my problem.
 
 
But I am so confused at this point - I really need a complete step back, and start over.
 
Can anyone give me a step by step to try - or to check my settings - and, can anyone tell me HOW to get Komplete Kontrol to appear in that MIDI In and MIDI Out slots in the Control Surfaces selection area???
 
 
HELP
 
I can't even get a regular (non Komplete Kontrol) synth to respond to the keyboard.  So - I can HEAR that the keyboard works- because I can turn the knob and hear the preview - so AUDIO is coming out - but - INPUT is dead, dead, dead and I've forgotten, or never knew how to tell SONAR what I am TRYING to do....
 
 
I never had these problems when I ran SONAR from an "ordinary" MIDI keyboard - but I am determined to get it to work with the S49 - because it is a great performance and recording experience - minus the RECORDING part for me, I am afraid.
 
 
 
I can't play.  (Well, I can in Standalone - but - you can't RECORD there.) - so - useless
I can't record. (at all - ever - using this S49)
As so often with SONAR - I push on keys - and NO SOUND comes out.
 
It's the ultimate frustrating DAW.
 
If only I'd chosen a DAW that is FRIENDLY to the S49....
 
 
 
Thank you.
Help ME please!
 
 
Dave
 
 
 
 
 
 
#1

13 Replies Related Threads

    Klaus
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    Re: Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have? 2018/12/15 14:19:24 (permalink)
    Hi,
    first, a couple of things to check:

    Preferences > MIDI > Devices:
    The S49 should be there and checked as MIDI Input and Output device.
     
    Next, under Preferences > Customization > Display > Other check "Show MIDI Activity on Windows Taskbar".
     
    If you now press a key on the S49 you should see this on MIDI Activity on Taskbar.
     
    Let us know if that works so far.
     

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    #2
    pureambient
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    Re: Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have? 2018/12/15 15:43:31 (permalink)
    Hi Klaus
     
    Thanks very much for writing.
     
    I have failed your step one - it does NOT appear under MIDI Devices.
     
    I had realised that - but what i do not know how to do, is to MAKE it appear there - can you please help - and then we can continue....
     
     
     
     
    Thanks!
     
     
    Dave :-)
     
    #3
    Glyn Barnes
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    Re: Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have? 2018/12/15 15:47:49 (permalink)
    Klaus
     
    Preferences > MIDI > Devices:
    The S49 should be there and checked as MIDI Input and Output device.


    In my case I see Komplete Kontrol-1, Komplete Kontrol EXT-1 and Komplete Kontrol DAW-1 in both inputs and outputs. These should all be checked.
     
    In Sonar or Cakewalk by Bandlab I load an instance of Komplete Kontrol software [ Insert - Sothsynth - Komplete Kontrol. ] Invariably I have the MIDI input set to OMNI as a also use a AKAI mini keyboard for keys-witches to overcome the lack of notes on my S61.
     
    With this setup I can use and browse instruments within this instance of KK just like the stand alone and record MIDI as if it were a "normal" VSTi.
     
     

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    #4
    pureambient
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    Re: Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have? 2018/12/15 15:58:26 (permalink)
    Hi Glyn
     
    I used to do quite complex recordings using various plug ins each set to different specific MIDI channels. I've actually always stayed away from using MIDI Omni - it seems unnecessary unless you are having problems but I've tried it on OMNI and on Channel 1 (default channel usually) and I get nowhere.
     
    I can INSERT Komplete Control into a session - but SONAR doesn't seem to realise it's a MIDI device.  I think I need to tell SONAR that Komplete Kontrol is a MIDI device - and I also will need to do the special VS100 emulation trick where I trick SONAR by selecting VS-100 and then KK as my input and out - but I can't, because I fail the simplest test - my MIDI Devices shows only my sound card (which is my main MIDI device normally) and that is ALL - no others. 
     
    And I don't understand how to ADD a MIDI device in SONAR.
     
    I am having problems remembering a lot of basic stuff, so please go easy on me - and spell stuff out in detail please...
     
     
    Thanks for your comments - when I used a simple MIDI keyboard - I could set up SONAR sessions with three or four different MIDI plug ins, each one playing a different sound - it worked beautifully, but OMNI would not have worked - because you want individual control of levels and so on - so I always assign the first inserted plug in to Channel 1, the next to Channel 2, and so on - and it always worked fine.
     
    The PROBLEM seems to be that SONAR and the hardware KK S49 keyboard are NOT playing nicely together - and there is the added complication of the Komplete Kontrol software, too.
     
    It all worked fine until I got the S49....
     
     
    Thanks!
    D.
     
    #5
    pureambient
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    Re: Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have? 2018/12/15 16:14:07 (permalink)
    Glyn - you have managed to do what I have not - in several months of not having any record functionality when using the S49 keyboard.
     
    I could go back to my simple 88 key MIDI keyboard but I love the S49 browser and the capabilities it has - and for composing, I can get by with 49 keys.  I have found that it's very simple to insert the old 88 key keyboard back in for performing sequences, which I could later then "play back" and use the S49 to select different possible output sounds - so I could do it that way, but I see no reason why it shouldn't...just WORK in SONAR.  With the right settings - which I do not know.
     
    So anything you can suggest to try, to get KOMPLETE KONTROL to appear in my MIDI Devices - how do I DO that??
     

    Help!
     

    Dave
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    Glyn Barnes
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    Re: Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have? 2018/12/15 16:36:28 (permalink)
    It was quite a while ago I set mine up but it was all automatic with no hoops to jump through. As Sonar is not seeing the keyboard at all something is amiss and hopefully its something simple.
     
    Check in Control Panel - Devices and right click on the S49 driver and confirm its working OK. If not reinstall the driver.
     
    If it appears OK, and you may have tried this bit of straw clutching already, but I suggest completely uninstalling Komplete Kontrol and the  driver and reinstalling it.
     
    You could try posting this question, (or a link to this thread) in the main forum where it will be seen by many more people.

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    #7
    Glyn Barnes
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    Re: Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have? 2018/12/15 16:55:06 (permalink)
    As an aside, I have just found the browser in Komplete Kontrol in Cakewalk is not finding the instruments. It seems the DAW is finding an older version of KK the the stand alone. Now I have a bit of trouble shooting to do.

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    #8
    Glyn Barnes
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    Re: Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have? 2018/12/15 17:08:33 (permalink)
    Right, this may have some significance to you. My troubleshooting shows it appears you should have two dll files.
    Komplete Kontrol.dll
    Komplete Kontrol S series.dll
      (possibly in 32 and 64 bit flavours)
     
    Just maybe Komplete Kontrol S series.dll is not in the scan path.
     
    The cause of my problem was an old version of Komplete Kontrol.dll in a different folder to the latest.

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    #9
    dcumpian
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    Re: Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have? 2018/12/17 13:45:16 (permalink)
    Everything should work just fine by default, except for the transport controls. To get those to work, you'll want to get AzCtrl and add that as a control surface in Sonar.
     
    There is a thread about it here (follow to the end):
    http://www.azslow.com/index.php?topic=329.0
     
    Regards,
    Dan

    Mixing is all about control.
     
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    #10
    pureambient
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    Re: Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have? 2018/12/17 18:34:16 (permalink)
    Hello everyone
     
    Thank you all so very much for your help here.  I was unable to work on this for the past few days - sorry for the unintentional silence.  Now that the work week is back, I doubt if I will get back to this any time before the week is out - but in the meantime, you have now given me concrete things that I can try - so that is really, really helpful.
     
    I will EVENTUALLY come back and let you know how I got on; what worked, what didn't; what had to be done...but the main thing I wanted to do right now is thank you guys for your help - it's hugely, hugely appreciated because I am a bit out of touch and this stuff doesn't come naturally to me - I am a guitarist who happens to have played keyboards for ten years longer than I played guitar - but it was inevitable that I would start out with SONAR 8.5 and then carried all the way along till the bitter end - and beyond - and then adding Komplete in several years ago - was the real icing on the cake.
     
    Rarely do both my guitar system and my keyboards both work at the same time, but if we get this running, it would almost appear as if 2019 is the year when I will have good, repeatable systems for recording in Komplete - as well as a tricked out guitar system after spending almost a year on sound design and preset library creation (the phase I am in now).
     
    So getting Komplete back - for one thing - I want to try out the awesome new sounds in Kontakt 6 and a few other Native instruments goodies I got for an early Christmas a few weeks ago - and sure, I can HEAR them in standalone - but I really need to be able to RECORD  them.
     
     
    Having the transport working is a luxury item but the VS-100 trick looks mega easy so I will give that a try absolutely - but first, I have to get the system to SEE the keyboard!!!!!!!!!!
     
     
     
    Thanks - and I will get back to you as I am able....
     
     
     
    cheers
     
    dave :-)
     
     
    #11
    pureambient
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    Re: Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have? 2018/12/17 19:24:39 (permalink)
    ...and then curiosity got the better of me
     
    OK
     
    Here is what I found
     
     
    IN CONTROL PANEL - the S49 appears, and according to it's PROPERTIES is working fine.
     
    I have actually re-installed it TWICE now - it makes no difference.
     
     
    However - in light of what Glyn said - I looked, and I do NOT have two dll files - at least, I could only find one - the 64 bit version called "Komplete Kontrol.dll" - that is IT - that is all I have.
     
     
    So how do I get the other dll?  And bear in mind I JUST re-installed Komplete Kontrol per your suggestion (including new download of course) - and - I end up with just one dll.    Version 2.0.5.  
     
     
    I don't know what to do next - any ideas?  What can I test?
     
    The keyboard lights up, and I can browse, and I can select sound sample PREVIEWS and hear those previews - but I have no MIDI activity in the tray   - when I press the keys of my S49 - there are no lights lighting like they used to.
     
     
    Why is that - can you list please what
     
    1) my physical connections - should be
    2) what settings should be made where?
     
     
    I'm going in circles...
     
     
     
    Thanks
     
    Dave
     
    #12
    Glyn Barnes
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    Re: Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have? 2018/12/17 21:06:29 (permalink)
    The S-series drivers are available on the NI web-site https://www.native-instru...s/drivers-other-files/
     
     
    There are drivers for the MK1 and the MK2 models, straw clutching again but maybe you have the wrong one.  I have no idea where I got the extra .dll but just maybe it came with the driver instalation.  My S61 is the Mark 1 model and it was sometime ago I installed it but it all went very smoothly.
     
    Have you tried the NI forums - https://www.native-instruments.com/forum/forums/komplete-kontrol-series.354/
    Help and response can be erratic at times but there are some very knowledgeable people there.

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    #13
    pureambient
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    Re: Native Instruments S49 - A bad problem to have? 2018/12/18 17:44:56 (permalink)
    Hi there
     
    I definitely have a MK II keyboard - and MK II drivers - but only the one DLL.
     
     
    But I don't really know for sure if I SHOULD have two DLLs - because MAYBE Mark I needs two - and I only need one - although having said that - normally, I usually have both a 32 and 64 bit dll - so why IS there only one.
     
    My driver might be old though - so I will go get the newest one and try that - and if no luck, I will hit the big forum and the SONAR forum - haven't gone there yet because I felt like we were getting somewhere....
     
     
     
     
    I shall be Bach.  Well, at least back...
     
     
    Dave :-)
     
    #14
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