Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered.

Author
fitzj
Max Output Level: -61 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1487
  • Joined: 2005/10/13 11:56:37
  • Status: offline
2013/08/29 05:39:59 (permalink)

Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered.

I have a stereo track that I recorded from a console which is around -18db. I need to get it up to around -6db before I send it for mastering. I tried a gain envelope and then used a compressor. It seems to make the track a bit  harsh. 
What is the best way to do this?
#1

16 Replies Related Threads

    Seth [DAWGURU]
    Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 49
    • Joined: 2013/08/20 17:46:42
    • Location: Los Angeles
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 05:40:59 (permalink)
    Why not let the mastering engineer do it?
    #2
    karhide
    Max Output Level: -81 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 457
    • Joined: 2007/03/30 04:22:13
    • Location: Southampton / Paris
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 06:01:21 (permalink)
    Seth [DAWGURU]
    Why not let the mastering engineer do it?


     
    I agree.

    Studio: Sonar Platinum/Cakewalk by Bandlab Intel Core i7 32GB RAM Samsung Evo 1TB system drive Windows 10 64bit - RME FireFace UFX - Focusrite OctoPre MK II - Audient Mico
     
    Mobile: Sonar Platinum/Cakewalk by Bandlab Intel Core i7 8GB RAM Samsung Evo 1TB system drive Windows 10 64bit - RME FireFace 400
     
    Mobile2: Cakewalk by Bandlab Intel Core i7 8GB RAM 256 GB System Drive Windows 10 64 bit
     
    http://www.karhide.co.uk/
    https://karhide.bandcamp.com
    #3
    mattplaysguitar
    Max Output Level: -55.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 1992
    • Joined: 2006/01/02 00:27:42
    • Location: Gold Coast, Australia
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 06:15:41 (permalink)
    Aside from getting the ME to do it, do you not know how to turn up the level of a track?... It's in page 1 of the instruction manual... 


    Currently recording my first album, so if you like my music, please follow me on Facebook!
    http://www.facebook.com/mattlyonsmusic

    www.mattlyonsmusic.com 

    #4
    TotteG
    Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 33
    • Joined: 2013/08/26 12:25:12
    • Location: Stockholm, Sweden
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 06:42:56 (permalink)
    You could use the Normalize function.
     
    Select the clip, go to the Process menu / Apply Effect / Normalize / select your desired dB value, (-6 dB)
    #5
    Guitarhacker
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 24398
    • Joined: 2007/12/07 12:51:18
    • Location: NC
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 07:04:54 (permalink)
    Use the normalize function BUT..... set the maximum level to less than 100%. Something like 90% to 94% should leave enough headroom. 
     
    Or...like was mentioned, if you are having it professionally mastered, they can handle that quite nicely.

    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

    MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW   
    Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface


    BMI/NSAI

    "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer 
    #6
    sergiobklyn
    Max Output Level: -83 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 372
    • Joined: 2003/11/06 09:43:40
    • Location: Brooklyn, NY
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 08:11:55 (permalink)
    Select clip
    Select Process from the menu
    Apply Effect
    Gain...
    Boost both channels ~12dB
    #7
    lawp
    Max Output Level: -67 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 1154
    • Joined: 2012/06/28 13:27:41
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 09:12:21 (permalink)
    i read the title as "Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get arrested"
     
    carry on, as you were
    #8
    Jim Roseberry
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 9871
    • Joined: 2004/03/23 11:34:51
    • Location: Ohio
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 09:32:14 (permalink)
    If you like the sound of the mix, don't use a compressor to increase gain.
    The compressor will alter the signal.
     
    The "Trim" widget is perfect for making a static non-destructive gain change.

    Best Regards,

    Jim Roseberry
    jim@studiocat.com
    www.studiocat.com
    #9
    AT
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 10654
    • Joined: 2004/01/09 10:42:46
    • Location: TeXaS
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 10:37:05 (permalink)
    Remix it hotter?  Actually, Jim's answer is the easiest if you are happy w/ the mix.  But leave room for the ME - raising levels is part of the job description.
     
    @

    https://soundcloud.com/a-pleasure-dome
    http://www.bnoir-film.com/  
     
    there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head.
    24 And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them.
    #10
    brconflict
    Max Output Level: -56.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 1891
    • Joined: 2012/10/05 21:28:30
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 11:50:06 (permalink)
    Guitar hacker has the best suggestion I see, but you may also consider reviewing your faders (sliders). If your busses are too low, highlight all your busses (except master buss), hold down [Ctrl] and raise one. The rest will follow in the same logarithmic %, attempting to keep your mix in order. If your busses are already about 0db, but the signal is quiet, you might consider doing this same procedure for all your main tracks. If you're clipping somewhere, you may look at possibly adding a 0db limiter just to that one track to ensure a single transient doesn't clip your buss or master. But don't use the limiter to raise the level of the track/buss.
     
    Aside from that, I agree with most of the others. Unless you're getting some machine noise from the low levels, the ME can bring the levels up for you. In fact, they may prefer to do that. Maybe send a single song sample of about 10-15 seconds to the ME and ask.
     
     

    Brian
     
    Sonar Platinum, Steinberg Wavelab Pro 9, MOTU 24CoreIO w/ low-slew OP-AMP mods and BLA external clock, True P8, Audient ASP008, API 512c, Chandler Germ500, Summit 2ba-221, GAP Pre-73, Peluso 22251, Peluso 2247LE, Mackie HR824, Polk Audio SRS-SDA 2.3tl w/upgraded Soniccraft crossovers and Goertz cables, powered by Pass-X350. All wiring Star-Quad XLR or Monster Cable. Power by Monster Power Signature AVS2000 voltage stabilizer and Signature Pro Power 5100 PowerCenter on a 20A isolation shielded circuit.
    #11
    wst3
    Max Output Level: -55.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 1979
    • Joined: 2003/11/04 10:28:11
    • Location: Pottstown, PA 19464
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 12:28:14 (permalink)
    Why???
     
    Or rather, to what level are you referring, peaks, rms, average??? And of course what style of music?
     
    I kinda like the openness of 18 dB of room for peaks - in fact musical peaks can exceed 18 dB! And you aren't losing a lot of bits by providing some breathing room...

    -- Bill
    Audio Enterprise
    KB3KJF
    #12
    wst3
    Max Output Level: -55.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 1979
    • Joined: 2003/11/04 10:28:11
    • Location: Pottstown, PA 19464
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 12:28:14 (permalink)
    my first double post...

    -- Bill
    Audio Enterprise
    KB3KJF
    #13
    Jay Tee 4303
    Max Output Level: -86 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 246
    • Joined: 2013/01/08 08:42:11
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 12:45:22 (permalink)
    fitzj
    I have a stereo track that I recorded from a console which is around -18db. I need to get it up to around -6db before I send it for mastering. I tried a gain envelope and then used a compressor. It seems to make the track a bit  harsh. 
    What is the best way to do this?


    Harsh is a big word, define harsh. I have used a comp without compression as a gain booster, and I've used expanders, with and without expansion as gain boosters, EQs, with and without equalization, and, believe it or not, gain plugs. Hi freq reverb adjustment. Reverb foldback levels. Gain knobs on pre's, power amps, powered speakers, faders, boost buttons and even hearing aids.
     
    Ok, NOT hearing aids.
    Yet.
     
    Why am I typing all this?
     
    Cuz in the time it takes you to read it, you could have defined "harsh" and thougth up ten different gain strategies to negate some or all of the negative benefits of "harsh" and be well on your way to implementing and comparing them.
     
    I am not giving you any grief at all, because asking a wide audience for both standard practices and suggestions is an excellent move, BUT...
     
    You are going to audition some or all of the suggestions given and judge the results, so you might as well be working on your own ideas to see ...a lot of different things....like how well you can anticipate industry standard answers, how innovative you are, who here gives advice that works for your ears, and how well your equipment and software options fit into the bellcurve.
     
    For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. The more actions you can pop out of your pocket and predict the outcome of, the more you have mastered your world, and the more likely you are to spend your time breaking gound no one else has tread before.

    IBM PC/XT
    1 MB RAM
    8087 Math Co-Processor
    5 Megabyte Seagate Hard Drive
    Twelvetone Cakewalk Version 2.0
    #14
    fitzj
    Max Output Level: -61 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 1487
    • Joined: 2005/10/13 11:56:37
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 15:19:13 (permalink)
    Many thanks for all the replies. I tried them all  and will take Seth advice and leave it to the mastering guys. All will do what was  suggested on here and which I tried previously before posting  but these methods take out some of the transients and  makes it sound compressed. These methods I guess would be ok if you were  only going up  a few db's. Anything more than 10db it does not work very well.  As I mentioned I have only a stereo track of the show so I cannot play around with individuals tracks as someone mentioned. If i had the opportunity again I would have gone for a hotter input  from the console but stuck with what I have now.
    #15
    brundlefly
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 14250
    • Joined: 2007/09/14 14:57:59
    • Location: Manitou Spgs, Colorado
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 15:54:30 (permalink)
    Good call letting the ME do it. But I thought it should be pointed out that no simple gain operation will alter the dynamic range. The hotter signal may sound compressed, but that's just a psycho-acoustic effect or possibly a function of your monitoring system or room acoustics.
     
    Also, just incidentally, if you wanted to normalize to -6dB, you should use 50%.
     
     

    SONAR Platinum x64, 2x MOTU 2408/PCIe-424  (24-bit, 48kHz)
    Win10, I7-6700K @ 4.0GHz, 24GB DDR4, 2TB HDD, 32GB SSD Cache, GeForce GTX 750Ti, 2x 24" 16:10 IPS Monitors
    #16
    mattplaysguitar
    Max Output Level: -55.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 1992
    • Joined: 2006/01/02 00:27:42
    • Location: Gold Coast, Australia
    • Status: offline
    Re: Need to Raise the levels from -18db to around -6db before I get it mastered. 2013/08/29 18:22:06 (permalink)
    "These methods I guess would be ok if you were only going up a few db's. Anything more than 10db it does not work very well."

    This is 100% incorrect. In the analogue domain, it could have an audible effect, but in digital, it's just math.

    If its starting to sound harsh when its turned up loud, it's because it IS harsh... It's not due to the gain you applied. The harshness is in the original track. A perfect job for an ME to work on. Mention it to him that you find it an issue so he addresses it specifically. Assuming you can trust your monitors, of course ;)


    Currently recording my first album, so if you like my music, please follow me on Facebook!
    http://www.facebook.com/mattlyonsmusic

    www.mattlyonsmusic.com 

    #17
    Jump to:
    © 2025 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1