Daylaa
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 16:55:38
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hockeyjx
You have the CTO helping someone in another thread who has his settings so out of whack, that is what a wonder X3 worked at all.
Think you're talking about me.... 
Sonar X3 Producer
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I am 'I Woke a Giant' Hear my stuff at:
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yevster
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 17:00:19
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Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
Yevster, I just took a look at your project and your report.
It consisted of:
MIDI Clip copied from another track is silentDescription:
- Open attached project.
- Play from now time (or around bar 74)
Expected Results:The unmuted clip on track 20 should play audibly.Actual Results:The clip on track 20 does not play. However, any other clip recorded onto that track or any MIDI input set to the track will play just fine.
The take you were having a problem with had a rogue controller envelope of Velocity = 0. Once the clip was bounced it behaved as expected. In this case, calling support may have helped you and without the public humiliation. There was very little in that report to really give us anything to go on.
Calling support would have taken longer than to work around the issue. It would have been far more constructive to simply reply with the information you just listed when marking the bug "not a bug". I had no way of knowing about that envelope because I didn't create it. The clip in question was ctrl+dragged from a different track, and the original played just fine. I will attempt to reproduce, and if I do, update or resubmit the ticket. The point is, a description of why the issue was rejected, even it's due to apparent user error, would have allowed me to determine the best step without the extra hassle for both tech support and myself.
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Lanceindastudio
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 17:06:46
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How dare they ask to be contacted! How dare they ask and not EXPECT it, but simply request it!
What are they trying to do, help or something, or do they just want to waste our time on the phone?
Given their not so endless resources, that does not sound very economical to request a phone call for nothing!
How dare they!
Lance
Asus P8Z77-V LE PLUS Motherboard i7 3770k CPU 32 gigs RAM Presonus AudioBox iTwo Windows 10 64 bit, SONAR PLATINUM 64 bit Lots of plugins and softsynths and one shot samples, loops Gauge ECM-87, MCA SP-1, Alesis AM51 Presonus Eureka Mackie HR824's and matching subwoofer
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Featherlight
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 17:13:34
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Am I missing something here??
The fact that cakewalk is as responsive as it is to these forums and the problems listed here, is one of the big reasons we just got, quite possibly, one of the most stable releases in a DAW ever. X3 is a direct result of the participation/collaboration of the forum members and Cakewalk.
Why call Tech Support?? probably because its simply faster to solve problems in real time. The fact that its even possible speaks volumes. Try that with Apple or Avid ect.
http://www.featherlightstudio.com/studio Computer: Intel i7 Quad, Intel P7P55D mobo, 16gig Corsair, Nvidia 8600gs Fanless OS: Windows 7 Professional 64 bit ----------------------------------------------------- Computer: Mac Mini i7 Quad Core Server, Intel mobo, 16 gig DDR3, 2-USB3 Audio Drvs, Mavericks ----------------------------------------------------- Audio Interface: Mackie 1640i Firewire Mixer on a 1394 400 TI Chip Peripherals: 3 UAD-1 PCie, Ilok 2, MIDI'd Yamaha Motif xs,
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yevster
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 17:15:48
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Ok, let's break this down. For any bug report, there are these possibilities:
1. User error
2. Insuffucient information/unable to reproduce
3. Not a bug/As Intended
4. Bug
In the first case, simply informing the user of his error is enough to end the work flow. If the user doesn't understand the error of his ways, he can contact tech support for explanation. In the third case, the status update is all the user needs. If he doesn't know how to work around, he can contact tech support. Ditto for the fourth case. In the second case, the missing information can be requested, and the workflow can be suspended or terminated until the information is provided.
"Contact tech support" implies "everything's ok, you just don't know what you're doing". That statement could well be true, but it would help to know how that conclusion was reached, in case some information turns out to have been omitted.
And yes, paying customers, unlike beta testers, are well within their rights to expect fewer hassles rather than more, especially when they're trying to go the extra mile, well, maybe the extra five or six yards, to report bugs.
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 18:26:41
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yevster
Ok, let's break this down. For any bug report, there are these possibilities:
1. User error
2. Insuffucient information/unable to reproduce
3. Not a bug/As Intended
4. Bug
In the first case, simply informing the user of his error is enough to end the work flow. If the user doesn't understand the error of his ways, he can contact tech support for explanation. In the third case, the status update is all the user needs. If he doesn't know how to work around, he can contact tech support. Ditto for the fourth case. In the second case, the missing information can be requested, and the workflow can be suspended or terminated until the information is provided.
"Contact tech support" implies "everything's ok, you just don't know what you're doing". That statement could well be true, but it would help to know how that conclusion was reached, in case some information turns out to have been omitted.
And yes, paying customers, unlike beta testers, are well within their rights to expect fewer hassles rather than more, especially when they're trying to go the extra mile, well, maybe the extra five or six yards, to report bugs.
Let's not go overboard with this. This was one case that someone decided would be better managed via email or phone and that did not clearly identify an issue that could be quickly escalated to development. I already explained earlier in thread why we have separate systems. We're working extremely hard to push as many fixes into SONAR X3c as possible. There's no need to get overboard arguing about the process. You can make assumptions all you want, but the fact is we're talking one case that you are unsatisfied with how it was managed and have decided to start a thread about to try to make a public statement versus just private messaging me, calling us, emailing us, filling out another Problem Report, etc. The forum is not the place for this. I'm sorry if you feel this was a mistake. Nobody was trying to give you the run around. The guy that worked on your case is probably one of the best assets Cakewalk has. I'm sure he would have loved to have talked to you about it. Let's discuss the issue instead. That's much more important than trying to point fingers at how you feel we're doing our jobs.
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Andrew Rossa
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 18:27:25
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Yevester, there's also the other side of the coin. Which is some users like that they can contact tech support and get help immediately. We still offer free phone support which is a good thing. We can't decipher whether it's better to email a solution or have a customer call. Every customer is different. I am sure if we didn't offer free support, a customer might say 'why can't I just call and get help'.
Either way, we are committed to helping resolve issues. In many cases, it's just easier to talk to the customer directly and help resolve the issue. You could also use email support if you don't want to talk directly. It's not like we said we don't want to help you :)
PS - What happened to your happy pic with X3?
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yevster
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 18:48:54
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Ryan Munnis [Cakewalk]
I'm sorry if you feel this was a mistake. Nobody was trying to give you the run around. The guy that worked on your case is probably one of the best assets Cakewalk has. I'm sure he would have loved to have talked to you about it.
I have no doubt about the rock-solid abilities of the people at Cakewalk or the earnestness of their commitment. The concern here is with the ease of reporting issues. The harder it is to report issues, the less likely users will report them. That simple.</rant> Andrew Rossa [Cakewalk]
PS - What happened to your happy pic with X3?
The honeymoon ended very abruptly once I started using Sonar in earnest. After switching back to Sonar from Cubase (and before that, Studio One), I found myself spending a lot of time dealing with Sonar's unique quirks, at the expense of working on music, than I had with Cubase, StudioOne, and Reaper. The features in Sonar make it very tempting to come back to, but my usage experience (which may be very different from that of others) makes it very tempting to leave again.
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yevster
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 18:52:52
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Andrew Rossa [Cakewalk]
Yevester, there's also the other side of the coin. Which is some users like that they can contact tech support and get help immediately. We still offer free phone support which is a good thing. We can't decipher whether it's better to email a solution or have a customer call. Every customer is different. I am sure if we didn't offer free support, a customer might say 'why can't I just call and get help'.
It doesn't need to be an either-or proposition. When rejecting a bug report, just indicate why it was rejected, and let the customer decide whether or not he needs tech support.
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worstcaseontario
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 19:12:16
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@ the Cakewalk Peeps.
I don't think the OP is out of order. I have myself felt flipped off by software support channnels (not Cakewalk's) in the past. I inform the company of my problem through their " click here for support", fill in the form, and later, get told by them to contact some other element in their own organisation. To me, and my bizzare anarcho-something leaning, makes me feel like I am being treated like an element in their organisation. Why should I contact another department when I just contacted you?( Well , not you really, like I said before, some other company's) That's just a feeling I get. I submit to it because I want my problem solved, but I don't like it at all.
sonar 8.5/x1/x2/x3pe/ableton live 8 suite
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yevster
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 19:14:25
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I don't expect the bug triagers to solve my problem for me, if the problem is, indeed, mine. All I ask to be told why a bug report was rejected, so that I can decide whether it's worth calling tech support about.
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 19:17:29
(permalink)
☼ Best Answerby yevster 2013/10/23 19:22:36
Guys, again, you're making assumptions this is how all cases are handled based off one example.
Yevster, your bug wasn't "rejected". Our guys thought they could help you resolve it. There's a huge difference.
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yevster
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 19:20:20
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lfm
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 19:21:11
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yevster
Ok, let's break this down. For any bug report, there are these possibilities:
"Contact tech support" implies "everything's ok, you just don't know what you're doing". That statement could well be true, but it would help to know how that conclusion was reached, in case some information turns out to have been omitted.
And yes, paying customers, unlike beta testers, are well within their rights to expect fewer hassles rather than more, especially when they're trying to go the extra mile, well, maybe the extra five or six yards, to report bugs.
I reacted very much like you did when I got rejection after rejection on bugreports. From before we know support, if answering at all it will take a month or so for them to keep up with incoming flow. So I took my most important issue and filed to support - and it's just past two weeks now - so there are another couple of weeks before anything happends in that end. So what happends is that these issues don't make it getting fixed to X3c. That is why support is useless - and why rejection of bugreport with reference to support is a slap in the face. We get a few fixes maybe up to X3d in the best case - then it's another year till next chance. All the years I've done developing and learned that one symptom does not always direct you to immediately see what is going on - but summing up all reports you start to see a pattern - and can nail problem down. I got the feeling they just throw away bug reports they reject - and they learn nothing. My sole purpose of bugreports is to provide possible information for Cake developers to sum up what is happening in the user end - and keep an birdseye view and nail things down. - What is the common factor of these reports regarding midi out issues? Now it seems, unless immediately nailing from one report, that is just thrown away. Same old Cake - probably system specific problem - yes, that's what it is - to humour the rejection mails we get. Take the very successful company Samsung that now have passed Apple in sales and market share. Still after 2.5 years since I bought my phone there are new updated firmware coming up that fix issues - even though two new models Galaxy S3 and S4 has arrived. Their support even call you back to see if it was fixed after contacting them. Did I mentioned they are very successful in what they do, having very satisfied customers. I've seens people here crying over why X2 was it only X2a that was released. Isn't it a pity....
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Lynn
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 19:35:07
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. Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
.
LynnI filled out a bug report recently regarding the Tape Emulator causing a 60 hz hum after the program was idle for a few hours. I got an e-mail yesterday telling me to call tech support. I just got off the phone with them, and the CW guy told me that they knew of the problem, but there was nothing I can do about it now. He couldn't guarantee that it would be fixed in the next update or any thereafter
The 60hz hum issue should be getting fixed in the next point release.
Seth, thanks for the info. That is all I was hoping for when I called tech support. Unfortunately, your man on the ground didn't have that info, or I never would have responded in this post. Does that mean X3c will fix this, or, are you referring to another update?
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Danny Danzi
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 19:38:05
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☄ Helpfulby Mystic38 2013/10/24 10:16:01
Not to get involved, (ok too late) but I just have to say how blown away I am by what I've read here.
1. Yev, I feel your pain...but it says you live in Mass....how much could that call cost you if you dialed direct?
2. Support hold times have been no more than 2-5 minutes and resolve times have been 30 minutes tops for me EVERY time.
I'm absolutely blown away that people in the USA that aren't charged for calls would even complain about this for a second. Let's throw one further....
1-888-CAKEWALK means toll free for everyone in the US.
One more....just about EVERYONE that has a cell phone these days barely pays for calls. If you are, it's time to change your plan. I've not paid for a call on my cell for about 15 years. ATT with roll-over minutes, no roamer charges, no LD charges.
Just about everyone has phones in their homes that have LD in the package that won't cost you additional LD charges. If you are paying for these charges, it's time to change your plan. Verizon and Comcast have great plans if you have them in your area. Magic Jack ain't half bad either.
Hey, it's you're right if you feel the need, but I sure can't see where you would be upset a little bit. Ok wait, if you work for a slave driver boss and you just can't find the time to call Cake, that's the only thing I can think of. If that were the case, these Baker guys are quite warm and considerate. An email explaining that you can't call support due to work asking for additional help wouldn't get a reply that said "sorry, call us or go back to Cubase". I'd be willing to bet they would work something out.
I had a problem a few weeks ago and had a Baker talking to me in a private message over the weekend and he stayed with me until we knew what the deal was! You can't beat that. Does it happen all the time? I'm sure it doesn't, but these guys truly care about what is going on here with this software. I saw Noel reply to someone on the forum EARLY in the morning. C'mon man....type up an apology and give these guys a chance. You don't realize how good you got it here.
If anything, you may have killed your chances due to how you behaved here. If you were from another country, I'm with you, calling might be super hard to do...but since you are in the US and right up the road...man, seriously, was this necessary?
-Danny
My Site Fractal Audio Endorsed Artist & Beta Tester
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Dude Ivey
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 19:55:26
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Danny Danzi
Not to get involved, (ok too late) but I just have to say how blown away I am by what I've read here.
1. Yev, I feel your pain...but it says you live in Mass....how much could that call cost you if you dialed direct?
2. Support hold times have been no more than 2-5 minutes and resolve times have been 30 minutes tops for me EVERY time.
I'm absolutely blown away that people in the USA that aren't charged for calls would even complain about this for a second. Let's throw one further....
1-888-CAKEWALK means toll free for everyone in the US.
One more....just about EVERYONE that has a cell phone these days barely pays for calls. If you are, it's time to change your plan. I've not paid for a call on my cell for about 15 years. ATT with roll-over minutes, no roamer charges, no LD charges.
Just about everyone has phones in their homes that have LD in the package that won't cost you additional LD charges. If you are paying for these charges, it's time to change your plan. Verizon and Comcast have great plans if you have them in your area. Magic Jack ain't half bad either.
Hey, it's you're right if you feel the need, but I sure can't see where you would be upset a little bit. Ok wait, if you work for a slave driver boss and you just can't find the time to call Cake, that's the only thing I can think of. If that were the case, these Baker guys are quite warm and considerate. An email explaining that you can't call support due to work asking for additional help wouldn't get a reply that said "sorry, call us or go back to Cubase". I'd be willing to bet they would work something out.
I had a problem a few weeks ago and had a Baker talking to me in a private message over the weekend and he stayed with me until we knew what the deal was! You can't beat that. Does it happen all the time? I'm sure it doesn't, but these guys truly care about what is going on here with this software. I saw Noel reply to someone on the forum EARLY in the morning. C'mon man....type up an apology and give these guys a chance. You don't realize how good you got it here.
If anything, you may have killed your chances due to how you behaved here. If you were from another country, I'm with you, calling might be super hard to do...but since you are in the US and right up the road...man, seriously, was this necessary?
-Danny
I was thinking the same thing!!
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jb101
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 19:55:53
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@ Danny - I'm with you all the way, again, Danny. I've had nothing but great support from Cakewalk.
I live in the U.K., so telephoning is a little harder, but, if I lived in the states, I truly can't see what this guy's problem is.. Free tech support, by phone.. It's unheard of in this day and age..
I thought this poster would be too embarrassed to come back to this thread, as it had been shown to be user (PEBKAC) error with a rogue envelope. Instead he comes back more aggressive than before.
Such a lack of social embarrassment is normally associated with children's TV presenters..
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John
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 20:01:58
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Nicely put Danny. What we always need to keep in mind is there are real people behind tech support at CW. If we would only treat them as we wish to be treated how much nicer things would be.
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jb101
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 20:16:43
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John
Nicely put Danny. What we always need to keep in mind is there are real people behind tech support at CW. If we would only treat them as we wish to be treated how much nicer things would be.
Also nicely put, John. I have dealt with many members and ex-members of Cake's staff, and have found them incredibly helpful - far and above just "doing their job". If I were treated as some of them are, I wouldn't return here. There is one forum member, who constantly berates posters for being rude, and yet feels that it is acceptable to call for a Cake employee to be sacked (because he didn't like the X3 box), and called into question the character of another (for locking a godparticle thread - can you believe it?). Why do people treat them this way? I am truly grateful for their participation here, in a user forum.
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hockeyjx
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 20:45:11
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Daylaa
hockeyjx
You have the CTO helping someone in another thread who has his settings so out of whack, that is what a wonder X3 worked at all.
Think you're talking about me....
Actually, I wasn't. Were you perhaps raised Catholic?  (bad humor by someone raised Catholic).
post edited by hockeyjx - 2013/10/23 20:52:13
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stevec
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 20:46:36
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Well, since this thread is still going on... Having worked in tech support for 16 years I get what's being described here, from both angles. If every "contact support" reply were instead an explanation of why that's the recommended action, I'm sure most users would probably like it. However, the bandwidth to do that takes away from every other call and email currently in the queue. The explanation for Yev's issue given earlier was well done. But I'd imagine there wasn't a backlog waiting while that was being carefully written up for the forum. And, the cause in this particular case wasn't even terribly complex. Add in users replying with "I don't understand" "what do you mean" "that's not right", etc, etc, etc, and the potential for going around in circles increases. Or, users are pissed because 'the answer from CW is wrong or doesn't make sense". Just because Yev understands the product well doesn't mean that everyone contacting CW does. The only way I can see something like this happening is with an increased head count. And that takes $$$$, plain and simple. Maybe CW is headed there now with the success of X3 and with Gibson's help. Only time will tell. Until then, the support system is what it is, and working with it instead of against may be best for one's blood pressure. Of course, there's always this forum too.
SteveC https://soundcloud.com/steve-cocchi http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=39163 SONAR Platinum x64, Intel Q9300 (2.5Ghz), Asus P5N-D, Win7 x64 SP1, 8GB RAM, 1TB internal + ESATA + USB Backup HDDs, ATI Radeon HD5450 1GB RAM + dual ViewSonic VA2431wm Monitors; Focusrite 18i6 (ASIO); Komplete 9, Melodyne Studio 4, Ozone 7 Advanced, Rapture Pro, GPO5, Valhalla Plate, MJUC comp, MDynamic EQ, lots of other freebie VST plugins, synths and Kontakt libraries
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cliffr
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 20:50:32
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Lynn
Studious
Yevster,
I understand your frustration. Filling out a bug report is a major workflow-killer! "Contact tech support" feels like time wasted (you just DID contact tech support). You then have to make new contact and re-describe everything.
But...I think you're being overly-stubborn. You took the time to post this thread and reply to it several times already. With a fraction of this energy you could've already contacted tech support. Did they specifically say "call"? I assume you could just email them.
In the meantime, you could use the forum to try to resolve or verify your issue. Best of luck!
I filled out a bug report recently regarding the Tape Emulator causing a 60 hz hum after the program was idle for a few hours. I got an e-mail yesterday telling me to call tech support. I just got off the phone with them, and the CW guy told me that they knew of the problem, but there was nothing I can do about it now. He couldn't guarantee that it would be fixed in the next update or any thereafter. He said not to leave my program idle for any length of time. I told him that due to unforeseen circumstances, it wasn't always possible nor desirable to do so. This has never happened before, and after removing TE from my project, I haven't had a problem since. This could have been explained in the e-mail they sent me, but instead, they chose to send me on a wild goose chase with nothing being resolved.
Since this is such a minor problem, it's not worth losing sleep or time over, but it could have been handled better.
Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
yevster
Having been a beta tester for three years, I would submit that the accusation of "not wanting to hep them track down and fix a bug" doesn't quite apply :) However, the effort that is expected of paying customers is, ironically, much greater than that which is expected of beta testers. The bug submission form, which requires you to fill a separate box for every step and makes editing difficult, is unnecessarily painful. If, on top of that, Cakewalk wants me to spend time and money on phone calls so that they can fix their software - I hope I can be forgiven for finding that a bit excessive.
I get it, Cakewalk is tragically understaffed and needs all the help it can get. But I bought their software out of self-interest, not altruism. It's bad enough that so much is broken after two patches. It's worse that paying customers are expected to go out of their way to help fix things.
Yevster, I just took a look at your project and your report.
It consisted of:
MIDI Clip copied from another track is silentDescription:
- Open attached project.
- Play from now time (or around bar 74)
Expected Results:The unmuted clip on track 20 should play audibly.Actual Results:The clip on track 20 does not play. However, any other clip recorded onto that track or any MIDI input set to the track will play just fine.
The take you were having a problem with had a rogue controller envelope of Velocity = 0. Once the clip was bounced it behaved as expected. In this case, calling support may have helped you and without the public humiliation. There was very little in that report to really give us anything to go on.
EDIT: There may be something going on here in regards to Simple Instrument tracks+lanes+automation, and I'm investigating, but your report doesn't indicate anything about this fact.
Also, we'd like to refer you to the forum TOS:
TOSUnproductive trash talk will be met with criticism and possible disciplinary action including banishment. The same rules apply to trolling and/or posting topics specifically to provoke a negative response.
We'd argue that this topic wasn't posted to spur a positive response.
LynnI filled out a bug report recently regarding the Tape Emulator causing a 60 hz hum after the program was idle for a few hours. I got an e-mail yesterday telling me to call tech support. I just got off the phone with them, and the CW guy told me that they knew of the problem, but there was nothing I can do about it now. He couldn't guarantee that it would be fixed in the next update or any thereafter
The 60hz hum issue should be getting fixed in the next point release.
Awesome stuff Seth and Cakewalk. I hope the OP feels suitable stupid and embarrassed about their fuss and conduct in this thread. It amazes me how some people scream like spoiled brats, say they want support, and then refuse to play their part to make it happen. Sure it's not something you want to be happening at all, but it's a fact of life, and the OP here has made a blatent announcement that they refuse to allow Cakewalk to help them with their complaint, if any effort is required from them. Reading through the thread is ... well ... vial. Hmm, the kind behaviour expected of a pillock. I think others have summed it up quite well - Danny / jb101 etc. Cheers - Cliff
i7-950 24 GB, GTX 580, W7/64 Ultimate, Sonar Platinum, Alesis MasterControl, KRK Rokit RP8g2s Some Real piano, basses, and guitars, Komplete 8Ultimate, Ibanez guitars, MusicLab RG/Strat/LPC, Trilian, Omnisphere, RMX, EWQL SO Platinum, Pianos, Choirs, VOP, Gypsy, Goliath, SD2, MOR, Ra, HS, HB, too many plugs, Midi controllers, and all kinds of weird gadgets My Soundclick Page
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yevster
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 22:16:45
(permalink)
Danny Danzi
Not to get involved, (ok too late) but I just have to say how blown away I am by what I've read here.
1. Yev, I feel your pain...but it says you live in Mass....how much could that call cost you if you dialed direct?
2. Support hold times have been no more than 2-5 minutes and resolve times have been 30 minutes tops for me EVERY time.
I'm absolutely blown away that people in the USA that aren't charged for calls would even complain about this for a second. Let's throw one further....
1-888-CAKEWALK means toll free for everyone in the US.
One more....just about EVERYONE that has a cell phone these days barely pays for calls. If you are, it's time to change your plan. I've not paid for a call on my cell for about 15 years. ATT with roll-over minutes, no roamer charges, no LD charges.
The cost here isn't the cost of a phone call. I work full time, and music is, tragically enough, pushed into the after hours. The cost here would be in leaving work for an hour to drive home, boot up the DAW, call up tech support, resolve the issue, drive back to work - all to report a bug I could easily work around. I'm not saying anything's wrong with the support hours, I'm merely challenging the expectation that users call up tech support to report non-show-stopper bugs. Andrew made a good point about email support. I could easily just fire off an email with the bug report number, and inquire what was wrong with the bug report as submitted. But wouldn't replying to that email take as much or more effort than including a brief explanation in the ticket? jb101
I thought this poster would be too embarrassed to come back to this thread, as it had been shown to be user (PEBKAC) error with a rogue envelope. Instead he comes back more aggressive than before. The rogue envelope is not a PEBKAC, as I never added it. I can reproduce the creation of the "rogue envelope" without creating the rogue envelope myself. However, as I have not documented the steps I took to create the clip, I wouldn't expect anyone to realize that. Had the report been rejected as a PEBKAC with a two-sentence explanation, the entire conversation would have been moot, as I could respond further. As is, I'll fire off an email to tech support, and we'll see how it goes. cliffr
I hope the OP feels suitable stupid and embarrassed about their fuss and conduct in this thread.
It amazes me how some people scream like spoiled brats, say they want support, and then refuse to play their part to make it happen.
As a customer, I have no part to play. No product is bug-free, but the experience of using Sonar in the past week has been hellish. And I do not see how that could change when extra hurdles are placed just to report a bug.
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mudgel
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 22:41:24
(permalink)
If you're a beta tester for Cakewalk then I'd say those days are over.
I know from having applied in the past that to even acknowledge yourself as one means expulsion from the team. Your status as a beta tester is between you and cakewalk only and not to be divulged.
Mike V. (MUDGEL) STUDIO: Win 10 Pro x64, SPlat & CbB x64, PC: ASUS Z370-A, INTEL i7 8700k, 32GIG DDR4 2400, OC 4.7Ghz. Storage: 7 TB SATA III, 750GiG SSD & Samsung 500 Gig 960 EVO NVMe M.2. Monitors: Adam A7X, JBL 10” Sub. Audio I/O & DSP Server: DIGIGRID IOS & IOX. Screen: Raven MTi + 43" HD 4K TV Monitor. Keyboard Controller: Native Instruments Komplete Kontrol S88.
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cliffr
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 22:51:29
(permalink)
yevster
Danny Danzi
Not to get involved, (ok too late) but I just have to say how blown away I am by what I've read here.
1. Yev, I feel your pain...but it says you live in Mass....how much could that call cost you if you dialed direct?
2. Support hold times have been no more than 2-5 minutes and resolve times have been 30 minutes tops for me EVERY time.
I'm absolutely blown away that people in the USA that aren't charged for calls would even complain about this for a second. Let's throw one further....
1-888-CAKEWALK means toll free for everyone in the US.
One more....just about EVERYONE that has a cell phone these days barely pays for calls. If you are, it's time to change your plan. I've not paid for a call on my cell for about 15 years. ATT with roll-over minutes, no roamer charges, no LD charges.
The cost here isn't the cost of a phone call. I work full time, and music is, tragically enough, pushed into the after hours. The cost here would be in leaving work for an hour to drive home, boot up the DAW, call up tech support, resolve the issue, drive back to work - all to report a bug I could easily work around. I'm not saying anything's wrong with the support hours, I'm merely challenging the expectation that users call up tech support to report non-show-stopper bugs.
Andrew made a good point about email support. I could easily just fire off an email with the bug report number, and inquire what was wrong with the bug report as submitted. But wouldn't replying to that email take as much or more effort than including a brief explanation in the ticket?
jb101
I thought this poster would be too embarrassed to come back to this thread, as it had been shown to be user (PEBKAC) error with a rogue envelope. Instead he comes back more aggressive than before.
The rogue envelope is not a PEBKAC, as I never added it. I can reproduce the creation of the "rogue envelope" without creating the rogue envelope myself. However, as I have not documented the steps I took to create the clip, I wouldn't expect anyone to realize that. Had the report been rejected as a PEBKAC with a two-sentence explanation, the entire conversation would have been moot, as I could respond further. As is, I'll fire off an email to tech support, and we'll see how it goes.
cliffr
I hope the OP feels suitable stupid and embarrassed about their fuss and conduct in this thread.
It amazes me how some people scream like spoiled brats, say they want support, and then refuse to play their part to make it happen.
As a customer, I have no part to play. No product is bug-free, but the experience of using Sonar in the past week has been hellish. And I do not see how that could change when extra hurdles are placed just to report a bug.
Dude, you make such a HUGE mountain out of a mole hill. Your arguments are so nonsensical, it appears quite plain that you like to be as difficult as possible, when the answers and soultions are so simple ... well obviously not for you. As above - Andrew makes a good point :-) They did NOT say "You must phone tech support or you're on your own". They said "Contact Tech Support" - which if you're so bloody minded about refusing to do, you are refusing their support. Why don't you just go poke yourself in the eye with a sharp stick or something ... I get the feeling you might enjoy the pain - you seem to be getting off on it here. Oh well, some people are happy making fools of themselves. Did I mention the appearance of "Pure Hostility" ?. That's how you look. Not reasonable, rational, or friendy at all - more like the opposite on all counts I'd say. From the diatribe here, I'd be happy to say I wouldn't want you as my customer. You've been given such courtesy here, both by other AND the Cakewalk staff - none of which you would appear to deserve. What's amazing, is even after all this, you don't seem to see it !. You just want to complain more and behave like a badly spoiled child. I for one would be grateful if you took your noise somewhere else. - Cliff
i7-950 24 GB, GTX 580, W7/64 Ultimate, Sonar Platinum, Alesis MasterControl, KRK Rokit RP8g2s Some Real piano, basses, and guitars, Komplete 8Ultimate, Ibanez guitars, MusicLab RG/Strat/LPC, Trilian, Omnisphere, RMX, EWQL SO Platinum, Pianos, Choirs, VOP, Gypsy, Goliath, SD2, MOR, Ra, HS, HB, too many plugs, Midi controllers, and all kinds of weird gadgets My Soundclick Page
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yevster
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 22:55:55
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mudgel
If you're a beta tester for Cakewalk then I'd say those days are over.
Not am. Was. Some time ago.
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mmorgan
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/23 23:28:59
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I provide technical support for applications that I have written. And my favorite saying is: "How come you never call when it works correctly?"
Regards,
Mike Win8(64), Sonar X3e(64) w/ RME Fireface UFX.
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robert_e_bone
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/24 05:06:51
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If this were a Monty Python sketch, a knight with a rubber chicken would have ended it a long while back.
1. I think the Cakewalk folks have expressed themselves quite well in this thread.
2. I believe the OP to be in violation of the terms of service of this thread, and certainly has blown off what was an agreement to confidentiality - that is bad form.
3. I believe a great deal of time and effort has been expended in this thread that could have well been better spent assisting those who are willing to engage in being assisted, and that continued time and effort on this thread would be a dis-service to the remainder of the forum.
I could go on, but see no point in extending this thread.
Bob Bone
Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!" Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22 Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64 Soft Synths: NI Komplete 8 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, many others MIDI Controllers: M-Audio Axiom Pro 61, Keystation 88es Settings: 24-Bit, Sample Rate 48k, ASIO Buffer Size 128, Total Round Trip Latency 9.7 ms
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: No, I won't contact tech support.
2013/10/24 05:10:13
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<deleted>
Thought better of it.
CbB, Platinum, 64 bit throughoutCustom built i7 3930, 32Gb RAM, 2 x 1Tb Internal HDD, 1 x 1TB system SSD (Win 7), 1 x 500Gb system SSD (Win 10), 2 x 1Tb External HDD's, Dual boot Win 7 & Win 10 64 Bit, Saffire Pro 26, ISA One, Adam P11A,
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