No sound from some VST's while trying to play imported Finale midi trks

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midimax
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2017/08/23 02:39:58 (permalink)

No sound from some VST's while trying to play imported Finale midi trks

I create a simple piano piece in Finale and export it as a midi file which I then import into SONAR (Platinum 2017.07). This creates two separate midi tracks - so far so good. I then insert a VST (Z3TA) and assign a preset (which I can hear as I walk through and make my selection). I then copy one of the midi trks into the newly created Z3ta trk, hit Play and I hear the midi data being played.
 
When I do this same process using D-Pro or Rapture I make it up to the point of hearing the presets as I audition and select but once I copy in one of the Finale midi trks I no longer hear any sound from that trk (either by triggering a note from my keyboard or hitting Play). I do see activity in the track's record meter though. PSYN II and Pentagon I VSTs don't have this problem either.
 
-Dave Christi
WIN10 w/latest updates
SONAR Platinum w/latest updates
Finale w/latest updates
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    msorrels
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    Re: No sound from some VST's while trying to play imported Finale midi trks 2017/08/23 10:59:27 (permalink)
    Perhaps the MIDI notes have a channel assigned, which can cause issues when trying to play with a soft synth that expects notes on channel 1 only.  Open the Event viewer and look at the MIDI data.  There may also be control messages that you might need to delete as well.  I see this a lot when using MIDI loops.
     
    I fix the MIDI channel assigment using a CAL script AssignMIDIChannel.cal, though I'm not sure if it came with SONAR or if I collected it.
     

    -Matt
     
    #2
    savoy
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    Re: No sound from some VST's while trying to play imported Finale midi trks 2017/08/23 11:16:42 (permalink)
    msorrels
    CAL script AssignMIDIChannel.cal, though I'm not sure if it came with SONAR or if I collected it.
     




    comfirmed is not there by default..

    (apologise for my english)
     
    sonar 5 std-m-audio windows xp quad-core pc
    JBL SPEAKER,RHODE NTK MIC.APEX 160
    #3
    msorrels
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    Re: No sound from some VST's while trying to play imported Finale midi trks 2017/08/23 12:17:51 (permalink)
    You can use the Process->Find/Change menu item to change things, but how to navigate its zillion options (on multiple dialogs that make it look like nothing happened the first time unless you notice the slight change in the title of the window) is so painful I'd rather not try and explain it to anyone, ever.
     
    Here's AssignMIDIChannel.cal.
     
     
    (do
      (include "need20.cal")
      (int new_chan 1)
      (int i 0 )
      (getInt new_chan "New Midi Channel: " 1 16 )
      (-= new_chan 1 )
      (forEachEvent
         (do
             (= Event.Chan new_chan )
             (++ i)
         )
       )
       (pause "Adjusted " i " channel events. ")
    )


    -Matt
     
    #4
    scook
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    Re: No sound from some VST's while trying to play imported Finale midi trks 2017/08/23 15:46:59 (permalink)
    More likely the cause is MIDI data added by Finale causing the sfz engine synths to shut down. Here are three ways to deal with the problem
    • Export MIDI note and CC data only from Finale. I do not have the tool but I believe there are switches to control what is exported.
    • Edit the MIDI in the SONAR Event List View. Usually the offending data is before the first MIDI note.
    • Tell the synths to ignore the data by enabling "Do Not Intercept NRPNs" in the plug-in properties menu of the sfz engine synths. Here is an image I made for a similar post using SI-Bass. The process is the same for all the sfz engine synths including DPro and Rapture:

    #5
    midimax
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    Re: No sound from some VST's while trying to play imported Finale midi trks 2017/08/24 14:17:50 (permalink)
    Thanks (Matt, savoy, scook) for the replies. I have used the Find/Change (Event Filter) in SONAR in the past and had already looked at the channels (which I did change back to Ch 1) and had used the Event List to scrutinize the midi data for any out of the ordinary control data and did not find (except for different channel numbers) anything that would contribute to the issue.
     
    I then changed the VST property to select "Do Not intercept NRPNs" to no avail. I then went back to Finale to see if I could affect how midi data gets exported and didn't see anything that would allow me to just export midi note and CC data BUT that got me thinking about the midi file type options (Format 1 -all instruments saved to separate tracks or Format 0 -all instruments saved to a single track. I always normally use Format 1 so I tried switching to Format 0 and that seems to have fixed it.
     
    Odd that when I do the import back into SONAR the Format 0 Finale midi file (a piano part consisting of a single grand staff) still loads into two separate SONAR midi tracks (I thought the midi file would load into a single SONAR trk) But, the D-Pro vst does play back ;-)  
     
    Thanks again for everyone's input...
    -Dave 
    #6
    msorrels
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    Re: No sound from some VST's while trying to play imported Finale midi trks 2017/08/24 17:15:59 (permalink)
    I believe MIDI 0 is always split into separate tracks by MIDI channel
    https://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare/articles/what-difference-between-midi-type-0-midi-type-1/
     
    Though that doesn't explain why the MIDI type 1 file didn't work, but does explain why the type 0 file gets split into separate tracks.  And those tracks may need MIDI channel "fixing"

    -Matt
     
    #7
    midimax
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    Re: No sound from some VST's while trying to play imported Finale midi trks 2017/08/24 21:18:09 (permalink)
    Thanks for the midi type link - that helps and I agree, still not sure why type 0 works and type 1 doesn't but at least I can still import from Finale which will save time re-recording the same parts in SONAR.
     
    -Dave
    #8
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