Skyline_UK
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Noise floor: -78dB acceptable?
When I'm recording an audio track via my Tascam analogue desk I can optimise the various controls to get about -78db flickering on the track in Sonar when nothing else is happening. i.e. that's the background system noise of my desk.
What I do is I arm the track in Sonar (not record) and watch the meter, setting it (right click) at -90db so I can see the lowest part of the noise floor. I manipulate the desk's faders and sends to get the lowest possible figure and that seems the best I can do. It seems ok in terms of the final song, etc. but I just wanted to know if you guys think that's reasonable or crap for a lowest noise floor. [sm=rolleyes.gif]
John
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The Maillard Reaction
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post edited by The Maillard Reaction - 2019/01/09 16:53:23
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Skyline_UK
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RE: Noise floor: -78dB acceptable?
2007/10/06 12:24:32
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Thanks Mike. No, no mike plugged in at present. Fantom X6 synth and drum machine plugged in and ready to record from, but I've optimised those for lowest noise by fiddling wth their output levels and their input trims on the desk's channels.
John
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Tonmann
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RE: Noise floor: -78dB acceptable?
2007/10/06 12:45:50
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Of course, one can't compare it with professional hardware-setups in a studio, but I think it's okay for home recording needs.
I have a similar noise floor here and it never ment a real problem to me.
cheers,
Chris
...maybe I never realized the joy till the joy was gone...
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The Maillard Reaction
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post edited by The Maillard Reaction - 2019/01/09 16:53:32
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Tonmann
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RE: Noise floor: -78dB acceptable?
2007/10/06 13:24:03
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What I often hear is the misconception that the noise-floors of all audio-recording simply sum up. So if one has 10 audio-tracks with an almost equal noise-floor of about -78dB, one would end up with a noise-floor up to -28dB (if I calculated correctly). This is fortunately nonsense, since it implies that all single tracks are mixed at 0dB, which is hardly ever the case. However, even a noise-floor of -78dB can become distrubing if one uses a compressor with lots of gain on that track. In silenced areas of the track the noise will be amplified by the maximum gain of the compressor, resulting in a quite audible noise. I'd recommend to use a noise-gate as first FX in that track or a really good FIR-based denoiser plugin. @Mike: That's life! One always get the wisdom when it's already done. Same here.  cheers, Chris
post edited by Tonmann - 2007/10/06 13:33:41
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altima_boy_2001
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RE: Noise floor: -78dB acceptable?
2007/10/06 17:20:18
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ORIGINAL: Skyline_UK
When I'm recording an audio track via my Tascam analogue desk I can optimize the various controls to get about -78db flickering on the track in Sonar when nothing else is happening. i.e. that's the background system noise of my desk.
If the -78dB reading is from the Sonar meter then that is a peak value. You need to look at RMS when judging noise levels... I have an Alesis Multimix 16 FW and with an SM 57 plugged in and mic gain set to a normal, usable level my peak noise is around -80dB and my RMS noise level sits about 10 dB below that. The only time I have a problem with high noise levels is when I'm recording my Marshall combo amp because it's a noisy SOB. The RMS noise floor when it's mic'ed up is around -50 dB on its track so I ended up throwing a noise gate on it a lot.
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The Maillard Reaction
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post edited by The Maillard Reaction - 2019/01/09 16:53:40
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bitflipper
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RE: Noise floor: -78dB acceptable?
2007/10/06 17:52:03
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What I often hear is the misconception that the noise-floors of all audio-recording simply sum up. And that isn't true? Or is the misconception not that they aren't additive but that the summing isn't simple? I don't understand how the noise on multiple channels could be anything other than cumulative.
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Jim Roseberry
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RE: Noise floor: -78dB acceptable?
2007/10/06 17:53:23
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Keep in mind you're talking about the peak noise-floor, not the actual average noise floor.
The average NF will be lower...
So... it's not as bad as it sounds.
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The Maillard Reaction
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post edited by The Maillard Reaction - 2019/01/09 16:53:49
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Tonmann
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RE: Noise floor: -78dB acceptable?
2007/10/06 18:00:21
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Yes, the misconception is to think it's a "simple" summing like "A + B + C + D", which would only be the case if all tracks are set to 0dB.
...maybe I never realized the joy till the joy was gone...
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Jim Roseberry
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RE: Noise floor: -78dB acceptable?
2007/10/06 18:00:36
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Or is the misconception not that they aren't additive but that the summing isn't simple? I don't understand how the noise on multiple channels could be anything other than cumulative. The noise-floor across tracks is definitely cumulative... But his point is that each of those summed tracks is probably attenuated a bit... therefore the cumulative noise-floor isn't directly equal to summing the original (un-attenuated) noise-floor of each track. Gates can clean intros/outros... but they won't change the S/N ratio. The signal to noise ratio is constant...
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Jim Roseberry
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RE: Noise floor: -78dB acceptable?
2007/10/06 18:01:51
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I agree... 
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Tonmann
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RE: Noise floor: -78dB acceptable?
2007/10/06 18:04:04
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ORIGINAL: Jim Roseberry
I agree...
With yourself?
...maybe I never realized the joy till the joy was gone...
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Jim Roseberry
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RE: Noise floor: -78dB acceptable?
2007/10/06 18:09:23
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With yourself? me, myself, and mike_mccue
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dreamkeeper
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RE: Noise floor: -78dB acceptable?
2007/10/06 18:59:31
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So if one has 10 audio-tracks with an almost equal noise-floor of about -78dB, one would end up with a noise-floor up to -28dB (if I calculated correctly). Hm, my guess would be -68dB - assuming we're talking about uncorrelated signals here. 
"... must've been another of my dreams ..."
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