P5 VS Sonar advice

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Markus Copol
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2006/06/21 12:51:24 (permalink)

P5 VS Sonar advice

you guys are the right people to ask. If I have Sonar 5 do I need p5 ? what does it bring to the table ? thank you in advance for your help.
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    syrath
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    RE: P5 VS Sonar advice 2006/06/21 13:25:42 (permalink)
    If you have sonar you do not need Project 5. However the question you should be asking yourself is this.

    Do I want P5?

    If you want to do a feature comparison of what you can do in sonar that you cannot do in project 5 then the list would be relatively large

    If you want to do a feature comparison of what you can do in project 5 thant you cannot do in Sonar then the list would be relatively small.

    So why do a lot of the people here who have both programs prefer to work in Project 5?

    One word.

    Workflow= The best description I can give for project 5 is not to describe it as a software studio but as a compositional tool. With project 5 I can minimise the time taken to get an idea from my head and onto the computer in the shortest amount of time possible. It may take me a few days to get what would take me a few hours in Project 5. The reason is multitude, programs like Sonar, Cubase, Logic Audio carry a lot of legacy baggage. In these programs the screen has the look of a mixer, because people want it to look like mixers do in real life, this is actually counter intuitive to how you can actually work it on a computer, where the main input device is a mouse and not a slider.

    What Cakewalk have done is to start with a fresh perspective on how to do it while not sticking with "tradition". They have done so at some of the features , for example there is little in the sense of audio recording in P5. While it is possible it is not bristling with audio editing features. It is designed to work with, generally, smaller audio loops, or midi patterns, and to use these patterns as the building block for your tunes. It does take a little adjustment in the way of thinking, once you get past this you can start putting together tunes at a much faster rate. It is not for everybody, but most people would be able to get some benefit out of Project 5 even if it was not their main DAW.

    Any more questions and Im sure that the kind people that frequent the forum would be all too pleased to answer.
    post edited by syrath - 2006/06/21 13:37:37
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    AT
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    RE: P5 VS Sonar advice 2006/06/21 13:35:10 (permalink)
    David,

    there have been a couple of threads on this, but ...

    P5 is more of a loop creation user tool, while SONAR can be though of as more of a linear recording environment. Of course, you can do loops in SONAR or longer recordings in P5, but the approaches are different. I usually start in P5, since I do keyboards. I usually create a loop or sequence I like (though these might be 16 - 24 bars long, which is longer than most loops) and build up from there. Add drums (loops again - I haven't done live drums ever, or at least since I got a drum machine eons ago) and away we go. By the time I get to vocals I've usually turned all my midi tracks into audio and I've moved over to SONAR. From there I add vocals and (lately!) more and more FX type sounds to the song. Then I mix in SONAR.

    P5 is more in tune with the way I start and develop a song, since I've always thought in terms of shorter sequences of notes and then loop these parts together. Of course, for years I did it linearly.

    You might try Kinetic, which has some of P5 in it, and see if that helps with your process. It is a P5 lite program. If you do, you can plop down the big bucks for P5.

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    #3
    Markus Copol
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    RE: P5 VS Sonar advice 2006/06/21 13:38:06 (permalink)
    Thankssss
    post edited by Markus Copol - 2006/06/21 13:49:31
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    jmeier
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    RE: P5 VS Sonar advice 2006/06/21 14:32:13 (permalink)
    you should get a dog first, then call it sonar. if it runs away after a week, buy project 5, if he sticks around, buy sonar.

    no, that's not scientific.

    buy TWO dogs, and name one sonar, and the other one project 5. whichever one sticks around the longest will be the best choice for your software lifestyle.

    i only joke because you already have some good feedback.

    here's another simple (dog free) way of deciding--if you want to play physical instruments like guitars, bass, vocals, etc., you almost certainly will be better off with sonar. if you only use midi/vst type instruments p5 is probably going to be a better choice. this is a gross overgeneralization.
    #5
    techead
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    RE: P5 VS Sonar advice 2006/06/21 16:26:27 (permalink)
    SONAR is a great piece of enhancement-add-on software for Project5.
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    AT
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    RE: P5 VS Sonar advice 2006/06/21 16:46:23 (permalink)
    Or is P5 is a great piece of enhancement-add-on software for SONAR. Let me put it another way, which came first. SONAR or the P5.

    Get both and you decide!

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    kb420
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    RE: P5 VS Sonar advice 2006/06/21 17:22:12 (permalink)
    Sonar was first. Then came P5.

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    badbib
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    RE: P5 VS Sonar advice 2006/06/21 17:24:44 (permalink)
    P5 is only 99 bucks from Sonar isn't it?
    Think about it... you get the Dimension, the workflow, the grooveMatrix...
    I use both, they complement each other really well...
    IMO, it's great to own and use both...
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    Markus Copol
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    RE: P5 VS Sonar advice 2006/06/21 17:33:21 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: badbib

    P5 is only 99 bucks from Sonar isn't it?
    Think about it... you get the Dimension, the workflow, the grooveMatrix...
    I use both, they complement each other really well...
    IMO, it's great to own and use both...


    oh I wish it was man, but it is not. It is still in 400's ... expensive ..besides maybe I should hold on specially with the word that the new version could be on the way..I would be crazy to spend that much money and then bang a new version is out

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    xylyx
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    RE: P5 VS Sonar advice 2006/06/21 17:43:07 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: jmeier


    buy TWO dogs, and name one sonar, and the other one project 5. whichever one sticks around the longest will be the best choice for your software lifestyle.


    To be honest, I thought you were going to suggest tying them together with some bungee cord, naming it 'rewire', so you then had the best of both dogs...
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    syrath
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    RE: P5 VS Sonar advice 2006/06/21 17:49:58 (permalink)
    Firstly,what seb was getting at is that if you own Sonar you can crossgrade to P5, I see however from the website that that option is not there either a/ anymore or b/ at the moment.

    As to holding off for a new version , you will notice they only charged the P5v1 owners $79.00 to upgrade. Personally I do not think that this is a bad price to pay. Also note that P5V3 has not even been announced yet. We do know that they are at least working on the feature list because a survey was sent out that looked like they were wanting to know what features were high on our mind for inclusion. So I would not hold any breaths yet waiting for V3. Even if it is announced soon, there will still most likely be a few months wait before release.

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    Markus Copol
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    RE: P5 VS Sonar advice 2006/06/21 18:46:45 (permalink)
    $429.00 Project5 Version2 for New Customers
    $178.00 Project5 Version 2 + Dimension Pro Upgrade from Project 5 Version 1.x
    $79.00 Project5 Version2 Upgrade from Project5 v1.x
    Packaged Multi-Language (English, French, German)
    $429.00 Project5 Version2 for New Customers
    $79.00 Project5 Version2 for Project5 v1.x Customers

    ---


    I would love to get my hands on the P5 but ...

    $429 is lots of money.I already paid a good amount for Sonar 5.
    post edited by Markus Copol - 2006/06/21 18:57:51
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    AT
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    RE: P5 VS Sonar advice 2006/06/21 18:52:39 (permalink)
    That is too much. They should have a regsitered Cakewalk owners price, which is less. Not over $300 retail.

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    there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head.
    24 And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them.
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    mumpcake
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    RE: P5 VS Sonar advice 2006/06/22 00:26:19 (permalink)
    One of the things you might appreciate is that Kinetic exports songs to P5, so you could lay out your grooves in K2, export the song, and then record vocals in P5 without having to mess with Rewire.

    You might also want to check out P5's Spectral Transformer effect. It's a pretty good way of messing with the sound of loops in ways that are hard to describe.
    #15
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