PTN vs MID file formats

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rponcher
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2004/07/13 21:00:54 (permalink)

PTN vs MID file formats

I was wondering if anyone knew what exactly the differences were between the formats of MIDI files and P5/Kinetic Pattern files. Or if the PTN format is published anywhere.

The reason I ask is because I believe it would be useful to come up with a utility which could read a session drummer midi file and break out each part into P5 patterns. Or join a bunch of patterns together into a midi file suitable for using with session drummer.


Russ Poncher
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    techead
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    RE: PTN vs MID file formats 2004/07/14 11:27:29 (permalink)
    I don't know of any published specifications. Contact Cakewalk directly as a 3rd party developer and take your case to them. They may be able to provide you with the information you're after. Their information combined with a hex editor can go a long way toward getting good results.
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    Digital Aura
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    RE: PTN vs MID file formats 2004/07/14 18:43:29 (permalink)
    I would really appreciate a utility that could perhaps be a VST plugin or something to convert .ptn files to midi files (or vice versa!).

    It would be invaluable for collaborating with NON-Cakewalk users, thus making P5 even more versatile!


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    rabeach
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    RE: PTN vs MID file formats 2004/07/14 19:57:34 (permalink)
    well p5 translates from mid to ptn with import of midi in p5. so it would be nothing for cake to offer this on the next p5 upgrade. that said they may have reasons for not doing so. upon first glance at the hex file of midi and converted ptn file there would seem to be a lot of padding of zero in the ptn file. possibly the ptn format is a upstage of midi format for future development. if cake does not mind or is not planning on offering this capability a program could be written depending on the complexity of finding the 1 to 1 correlation between the two formats. we should urge cake to provide this for us. if/when they are unwilling we should look to the possibility of developing it outside of cake. knowing cake the 1 to 1 correlation is probably a 4th or 5th order differential equation. :-)
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    philchetcuti
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    RE: PTN vs MID file formats 2004/07/14 21:03:14 (permalink)
    The import mid function does work well, but it seems to depend on how the mid was created...I've been playing with this feature today and am very surprised with the results.

    When choosing Import from the file menu, you have a choice of importing midi. Once you've selected the file you may (or may not) be prompted "This MIDI file has more than one Channel. Would you like the patterns to be combined onto one track?"

    Choose No...and allow it to lay out the tracks for you...depending on the author it may not work at all, it may work to a dissatisfactory degree, and it may work (but include blank tracks).

    If it does work the problem will be figuring out which tracks need which instruments.


    Today I experimented with this, the following files are the result.

    http://grandtheatre.com/phil/midi/ave_maria.mid (original mid download)
    http://grandtheatre.com/phil/midi/ave_maria.mp3 (my remix after playing with it in P5)
    http://grandtheatre.com/phil/midi/ave_maria.p5p (my remix in P5 format)

    Yeah, its an old Bach tune, church music, but one of my favorite pieces of classical music.

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    techead
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    RE: PTN vs MID file formats 2004/07/14 23:20:42 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: Digital Aura

    I would really appreciate a utility that could perhaps be a VST plugin or something to convert .ptn files to midi files (or vice versa!).

    It would be invaluable for collaborating with NON-Cakewalk users, thus making P5 even more versatile!

    You can sort of do this with the MIDIOut plugin (freebie from Cakewalk) but you will need some other piece as well to make it all work.

    1. Use MIDIOut as a DXi synth. It takes the MIDI data on a track and outputs to the selected MIDI port.

    2. Now, if you have some type of virtual MIDI adapter or a driver that can capture MIDI data from a port to a file you're all set.

    Would be nice if there were a direct MIDI export feature built into P5, though.
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    rponcher
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    RE: PTN vs MID file formats 2004/07/15 20:24:16 (permalink)
    Actually I use Sonar and Kinetic (just posting here because a) more people b) See more responses from CW staff here), so the MIDIOut plugin idea doesn't help.

    Thanks for all responses so far, though.


    Russ Poncher
    http://www.soundclick.com/bands/7/russponchermusic.htm
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    rabeach
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    RE: PTN vs MID file formats 2004/07/15 22:02:13 (permalink)
    you can create a midi file from session drummer in sonar (process midi effects) and then save as mid file in sonar. import into p5 save as pattern. i assume kinetic allows for this also. cut and past to break it up. more work than a program or tool to do it for you in p5 or kinetic but it can be done. i think that midi yoke will allow the midi out from p5/kinetic to be a midi input to sonar.


    edit....
    okay i see kinetic probably doesn't recognize midiout because it shows up as an instrument instead of an effect.
    < Message edited by rabeach -- 7/16/2004 12:04:09 AM >
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    posze one
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    RE: PTN vs MID file formats 2004/07/16 00:57:29 (permalink)
    as a matter of fact i was just reading it in computer music to day and yes midi york can be midi out to soner , ect. look at www.computermusic.co.uk and see if they have any thing on there web site on this

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