Helpful ReplyPiano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback

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smonahan001
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2017/08/23 05:41:49 (permalink)

Piano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback

Hello All,
 
When I stop playback in my sequences, I'm getting lingering notes on my piano track if I stop playback while the damper pedal is on. It's a little bit of a pain to have to hit the Panic button every time I hit Stop.
 
First question: Is this supposed to happen? When I hit Stop, should a value of 0 be sent to CC 64? I know when I hit Stop, it's supposed to send Note Off messages, but is it also supposed to send CC Off messages?
 
If the answer to this is yes, the my second question is: Is there a setting somewhere where I can make this happen?
 
It seems to have started this behavior yesterday after I got a BSOD from an audio driver error. I have rebooted (several times) since then. I wasn't getting any lingering notes before the BSOD.
 
Thanks in advance.

 
Regards,
Sean

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promidi
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Re: Piano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback 2017/08/23 09:11:55 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby smonahan001 2017/08/23 09:33:35
If you go to Preferences | Project | MIDI and select "Zero Controllers When Play Stops", I believe that will do what you require.  Note: this is a per project setting

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smonahan001
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Re: Piano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback 2017/08/23 09:33:25 (permalink)
Thank you, promidi. This is what I was looking for. Unfortunately, it's not making a difference in my current sequence. However, I have experimented with a new sequence to see that it in fact does this correctly. I guess my system crash just messed something up in my current sequence and I will have to live with it for now.

 
Regards,
Sean

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soens
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Re: Piano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback 2017/08/25 13:57:14 (permalink)
When you press the pedal while recording it will produce a cc trigger ON (127). When you release the pedal it will produce a cc trigger OFF (0). If you stop recording while holding the pedal, no OFF cc will result. You can also add these cc data manually in PRV controller pane.
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taccess
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Re: Piano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback 2017/08/26 01:52:16 (permalink)
Additional info
Cakewalk.ini > PanicStrength=1 ,  The Panic/Reset button stops playback and turns off any stuck notes. There are two ways a MIDI note can be turned off: By a note-off message (n=1) or by MIDI controller number 123 (all notes off). By default, Panic uses controller 123 only (n=0).
 
Just be aware though if you have Reveal Sound Spire in your project +  PanicStrength=1 then when you hit the "Reset Midi and Audio" Button you will crash platinum.
 
If you set PanicStrength=1:
A) Disconnect Spire via synth rack before pressing the Reset Midi and Audio Button.
or
B) Don't use Spire until bug is fixed ! bug is reported !

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smonahan001
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Re: Piano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback 2017/08/26 02:58:58 (permalink)
Thanks soens and taccess, but these things aren't the problem. All cc 64 on and off events are present in the track, and the panic button works fine. The problem is that when I'm playing the sequence back, and I hit Stop, no Off message is received by cc 64. I have to hit Stop *and* the Panic button. I have verified that this works correctly in other sequences; hitting Stop turns off cc 64. So it is either some project specific setting that is wrong, or something got messed up during a crash.
post edited by smonahan001 - 2017/08/26 04:05:19

 
Regards,
Sean

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taccess
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Re: Piano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback 2017/08/26 04:12:32 (permalink)
Troubleshooting what you have is the fastest way to solve this!
What you have is sustain on a track that continues after you press stop ! Use this to eliminate the instrument as a possible cause first !
 
smonahan001
 I have verified that this works correctly in other sequences; hitting Stop turns of cc 64.


 
How have you verified this because this sounds like a way to narrow the problem down !
 
When you say you have verified that the sustain stops when you press stop "ONLY" How exactly did you verify it ?
1)Did you open a Different project and test it that way ?
If So :
2)Did that project have the same instrument causing the sustain in the BSOD Project ?
This is important and tells us a lot
 
Is this happening to only one instrument or all with sustain in the BSOD project ? <  sorry to call it that !
When you press stop and the sustain continues is it only on one instrument ? check your primary's Peak meters to locate the instrument holding the sustain.
Then once you have the instrument disconnect it via the synth rack .
You could then try and re insert the same instrument again and see if it fixes or proves it was a instrument setting.
You could then try and insert the same instrument into the project you used to verify it working and see if the instrument then causes the same issue !
 
It sounds to me that if you have verified it working " Sustain stops immediately when you press stop" in another project then its not platinum setting related because it would also hold sustain where you verified it !
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

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taccess
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Re: Piano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback 2017/08/26 04:27:06 (permalink)
Not sure what instrument your using but here is another current thread with sustain issues that may or may not help:
 
http://forum.cakewalk.com...-Rapture-m3183245.aspx

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smonahan001
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Re: Piano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback 2017/08/26 04:31:27 (permalink)
The instrument is Pianoteq 4 Stage. Great troubleshooting tips, thanks taccess. I will keep investigating.

 
Regards,
Sean

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smonahan001
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Re: Piano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback 2017/08/26 04:34:20 (permalink)
taccess
smonahan001
 I have verified that this works correctly in other sequences; hitting Stop turns of cc 64.



 
Also, .... D'oh! I corrected my spelling error, but not fast enough. Now you've quoted it for all the world to see! 

 
Regards,
Sean

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smonahan001
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Re: Piano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback 2017/08/26 05:10:38 (permalink)
I think I may have solved this, but I am confused.

If I go to Preferences->MIDI, and I *uncheck* "Zero Controllers When Play Stops", then behavior is as I desire: Pressing Stop during playback will turn off all notes *and* turn off the damper pedal on my piano.
 
However, this is the opposite of what I thought this option should do. It was previously not working for me because I had made sure that this option was checked.
 
In any case, as long as it's working I'm happy. 
 
 
EDIT:
Ok, I jumped the gun here. That did not fix it. But at least now I am less confused. 

 
Regards,
Sean

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taccess
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Re: Piano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback 2017/08/26 05:40:53 (permalink)
smonahan001
I think I may have solved this, but I am confused.

If I go to Preferences->MIDI, and I *uncheck* "Zero Controllers When Play Stops", then behavior is as I desire: Pressing Stop during playback will turn off all notes *and* turn off the damper pedal on my piano.
 
However, this is the opposite of what I thought this option should do. It was previously not working for me because I had made sure that this option was checked.
 
In any case, as long as it's working I'm happy. 
 
 
EDIT:
Ok, I jumped the gun here. That did not fix it. But at least now I am less confused. 





If the sustain turns off sometimes but not other times then its definitely a midi message, maybe its the other way around, maybe the piano is receiving a sustain message to stay on ?
 
exactly how long does the sustain last for when you press stop only ?
 

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smonahan001
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Re: Piano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback 2017/08/26 07:41:39 (permalink)
Okay, it's not Sonar. It's Pianoteq.

I installed on a completely different machine, and created a new sequence. I recorded a few bars with the TTS piano, and it behaves correctly. Then recorded a few bars on the Pianoteq, and still getting lingering notes. I opened the MIDI option on the Pianoteq plugin so I can see MIDI events as they're coming in. I can see all the notes on and off happening, and the pedal on and off happening. And when I hit Stop, I can see all the channels getting All Notes Off messages... but no controller off messages.
 
I will pursue this further with Pianoteq. Thanks everyone.

 
Regards,
Sean

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soens
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Re: Piano damper pedal isn't released when I stop playback 2017/08/26 20:56:50 (permalink)
Normally if you stop the transport before reaching the 0 cc, it remains affected. Especially noticeable with pitchbend cc's.

BTW, my biggest midi issue is a synth that suffers from stuck note syndrome.
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