Pianoteq or Ivory?

Physics modeling versus sample libraries. For quality (realism), it's a no-brainer and I would suggest without hesitation either "Ivory" or "QL Pianos" but, this is going to cost you big time hardware-wise... to comfortably run these libraries with multiple mics and in real-time (as you already suspect).

I have demoed Pianoteq's offerings and have used TruePianos extensively (including Atlantis). IMHO and after playing an acoustic grand, you won't be satisfied with anything less than a sample based library. 

Do yourself a favor and go to www.purgatorycreek.com and listen to the scads of different digital pianos on the market.  It is an eye (and ear) opening experience...and it will take several listening sessions to get through them all.  Enjoy.
 
 
PS:  Click on the "digital piano shootout" tab.

  Algeria- Thanks for your take on this. I think my Q8300 with 8gb of ram could probably swing Ivory.

  I have less than fond memories of trying to make a large sample player work with a glitchy engine. No doubt things have gotten much better since I last went there....
 
 If I go there again I feel more confident but still have that taste in my mouth, know what I mean? Ivory might be the thing to push me back that way again.
 I was wrong about True Pianos. I was actually referring to the included piano with Sonar. I would like to  try the piano you mentioned here.Even with the  buggy sound/playback engine I remember the samples sounding wonderful on said sample player when it worked lol.
 
 Jim- I think the Motif Xs pianos are actually some of the better ones I have heard from a sample playback hardware instrument,and even holds its own pretty decently compared to some software sample playback instruments IMHO. I did like the response of pianoteq when compared to playing a streaming sampler. It might only be the smallest of a difference in actual response time, but I picked up on the more streamlined feel right away and I think this must be due to the much lighter load on the entire computer.
 I don't think it's entirely about speed either. What Pianoteq has done is pretty darned incredible and would surpass what my hardware unit can do....but those rich samples from the likes of Ivory are almost better than a real piano :)

 Youroldpal- I went to the site and checked a good many of those files out. I intend to check out the rest. Thank you kindly for steering me there.

 Craig- Yes I think you're right, I need both of those.You make a good point my friend! I'll look at Sampletekk too. The only other alternative I can think of is to go over to the church when theres noone else there with my recorder and a few microphones and try recording the piano.

Ivory.  I don't have it, but some friends do and it's so much better than any modelling softsynth (Pianoteq).  I had a motif XS6 and while the stock ones were not "best" they were still quite good.  I bought some of the expansion piano sounds for the XS and they were the best I've ever had in a hardware synth.

Ivory is probably the best sampler/synth piano around but you have to have an iLok for it.

I don't have Ivory because I am not using my pianos not "in a mix" most of the time.  My "go to" pianos are Kontakt's Classic Pianos.  They are quite good, IMO.  not the same level as Ivory, but if you compare the cost of only the piano set (assuming you already have Kontakt) then the price value compared to the sound is better than Ivory.

I've heard great things about the Garritan Authorized Steinway.  I had seriously considered it before buying the Kontakt Classic Pianos.

I don't have as many pianos as I have drums but I do enjoy Ivory II (and Ivory II Italian as well) for standout piano parts. True pianos is allright for buried backing piano parts, IMO.

+1 on the Alicia Keys library. That satisfied my longing for an authentic sounding piano in software. It always fits in the track with little tweaking.

 Thanks guys,

 Monkey- You are not the first I have heard with a very negative view of Pianoteq. The only thing that I would add is that Pianoteq does not have to be what you get as sold. It is adjustable. I would not say it is horrible IMHO . Actually with a little coaxing I think it could sound decent.
 
  Beagle- Yes I also like that XS piano. If I had to have a hardware piano (other than the real thing) that would be it. On Kontakt,I hope it continues to work well for you.
 Alegria- Thanks for your suggestions. I have never tried East West samples. I bought Kontakt when it was Kontakt 3 and have never been so disappointed in a product. I had thought that it was my computer, but after numerous tweaks and tests I determined that my computer was healthy and capable of running it.
 The piano samples were great when they worked but I could never use them because all I got was random noise even at the lowest cpu settings....I never updated or upgraded that software. Going to the NI forum confirmed that I wasn't the only one who had this problem, after months of waiting for a fix I finally gave up on them and told myself I would never use Kontakt again.Also not being a big fan of ilok I'm not sure I want to chance being bitten again by the same dog.

 I'll dig deeper into the True Pianos and East West too.

Bapu- You must be single handedly keeping at least a half dozen music retailers in business ,you lucky dog....bless your heart.

Wayofmind and Middleman- Wow another choice! I'm going into overload here, thanks.

 Digitalboy- Thanks for sharing your experience. That kinda narrows it a little better ot at least gives me a few directions to head in(one at a time of course)....and anything Italian must be good right? almost as good as the Irish/French/English/Japanese stuff......
 
 

Sorry for hijacking this topic, but I got a few piano's from NI with Kontakt 8. Since my SSD-space is rather tight I don't feel like installing them one by one to give them a try, so... I wonder if anyone knows those piano's and if they are any good...? In the past I always used the piano that came with GPO and which imho was rather good for such a bonus piano...

The piano's I have from NI are:
- New Yrok Concert Grand
- Vienna Concert Grand
- Berlin Concert Grand

(and also Upright Piano, but that's not the kind of piano I want). If I am well informed these piano's used to be part of Akoustik Piano in the past. 

Maybe someone can tell me if they are worth installing and if so which one is best for for instance a real piano featured song. I don't have money for anything else anymore, so if these are crap, I'll have to reinstall GPO somehow...

hellogoodbye


Sorry for hijacking this topic, but I got a few piano's from NI with Kontakt 8. Since my SSD-space is rather tight I don't feel like installing them one by one to give them a try, so... I wonder if anyone knows those piano's and if they are any good...? In the past I always used the piano that came with GPO and which imho was rather good for such a bonus piano...

The piano's I have from NI are:
- New Yrok Concert Grand
- Vienna Concert Grand
- Berlin Concert Grand

(and also Upright Piano, but that's not the kind of piano I want). If I am well informed these piano's used to be part of Akoustik Piano in the past. 

Maybe someone can tell me if they are worth installing and if so which one is best for for instance a real piano featured song. I don't have money for anything else anymore, so if these are crap, I'll have to reinstall GPO somehow...

those are the NI CLASSIC pianos.  they are what used to be AkoustiK Piano set before NI repackaged them as Classic.
 
My experience is exactly opposite of digitalboy's.  No offense intended, DB, just a difference of opinion.  I can get some great sounds out of the Classic Piainos where Alicia's Key's sound very "brittle" to me.  NOTE:  I don't have Alicia's Keys however, myself.  I do have a friend who has them and I asked him to render some MIDI using AK and several other packages he has and send them back to me as wave files.  I did this BEFORE I bought NI Classic Pianos and used those comparisons he did for me as my guide for my purchase since AK was in the possible purchases.  I did not like AK at all.
 
but that just goes to show that all of these opinions are going to be different.  it's a matter of what you like.

I remember when both NI Akoustic Pianos and Ivory were both just out Electronic Musician mag (I think) did a software piano shootout with them and a couple of others.  They had two or three famous classical and jazz pianists as their judging panel and IIRC the NI Steinway won hands down...wasn't even close.  Which really only shows, once again, that everything about any musical instrument and its sound is SUBJECTIVE in the extreme.  There is no "right" or "best" digital piano anymore than there is a "right" or "best" analog, actual wood and brass piano.  You need to listen to as many as you can...play/demo them if possible...using your favorite controller board and then pick the one you like the best.  And bollocks to what anyone else tells you is the "right" or "best" for you.  Unless it's me, a course, I'd never steer ya wrong;-)

The NI pianos in Komplete 8 are certainly what used to be sold as Akoustik Piano. I'm glad I have them, and before I tried other sample sets, I thought they were great. They're no longer my go-tos, but I haven't uninstalled them either. I actually like the upright in that package quite a bit!

I am a little unsure of what I need to get started. It has been some time since I used a software sampler. I went to the NI site and they still have me in their system as a registered Kontakt 2 user. I was surprised at the upgrade price which seems very reasonable to me to go from version 2 to version 5.
  I never thought I would reconsider Kontakt but apparently they are the number 1 sampler and what I basically need to own in order to add further libraries....for the price they are asking I am willing to maybe give it another shot and hope for the best.

  Are there already some pianos included with Kontakt? Or do I need to buy additional libraries? The price for Ivory 2 Italian is confusing to me. On one site it was listed for 319.00 and on the same site it looked like the same software(The Ivory 2 Italian Grand) was also for sale at 169.00??  http://www.musiciansfriend.com/synthogy?catId=site1YS&source=3WWRWXGG

  I'm not really sure if I need a sample player to run Ivory 2 or does it run in Sonar X1 independently? ........It would seem like some of the programs some of you have mentioned need some kind of an outboard sampler.

 For the upgrade price(and if it actually works this time) I could pick up K5 and seemingly have lots of additional capability with other instruments AND the ability to add more pianos, and depending on quality, use the ones that might be included.

Starise


 I never thought I would reconsider Kontakt but apparently they are the number 1 sampler and what I basically need to own in order to add further libraries....for the price they are asking I am willing to maybe give it another shot and hope for the best.

  Are there already some pianos included with Kontakt? Or do I need to buy additional libraries? .

The pianos in the Kontakt factory library are so so.
 
If you do get the full Kontakt  the SampleTekk pianos are worth a look. They are good value at list price but they seem to have frequent half price sales where you can pick up some old, but very nice sampled pianos for as little as $25. I and several others here recommend "The Emperor", "Old Lady" and "Rain", "Estonia" is nice too dispite only having 4 velocity layers.  I think a lot of these will actually work with Kontakt 2.
 

 

Starise


  I'm not really sure if I need a sample player to run Ivory 2 or does it run in Sonar X1 independently? 

It's an independent VST.


Listen to THIS SONG by Janet, Rik, Danny and I. It's the Ivory II Italian Grand with some tweaks by Izotope's Alloy.

 Bapu- Thanks for clarifying that. I'll give that a listen when I get home.

 Beagle- Thanks for that info.......... I'm in ping pong spectator mode now I have listened to some of these on youtube and elsewhere. My conclusion is that many of them can be made to sound pretty decent.

 After listening and playing Pianoteq again I can see why it isn't the most desired product to have.............things always seem to sound great the first time I hear them and then I start to hear the subtilities of the sounds later.........I guess because I go from playing mode to listening mode and I don't listen to tone as well while I'm playing.

  Most manufacturers of these instruments  put the strengths at the forefront and minimize the weaknesses. That coupled with less than stellar youtube recordings can mislead and misinform, which is why I like responses like these where people have actually USED this stuff and are also objective about weaknesses in a product.

  Ivory is nowhere near as expensive as I thought it would be BUT you are limited to only Ivory, although, sometimes singularity is a big plus,especially if you already have a great honking sound at the get go.

 It can be a tough call and there are so many choices here...whew!