The Console Emulators were designed to "sound" like the API,,,, for the record, its the trident A range lol

Last post on this...

POST TITLE....The Pro Channel and IT'S Unique sound" - I don't think that can be "misread" or misunderstood...
 
 
 
I am just replying to  this statement, as I agree with most of the rest of your posts, and will comment on them when I have a chance.
 
I think most people can understand what the OP meant, unless they suffer from a fundamental lack of social reciprocity.  If this includes you, then I apologise, but I don't think it does.
 
I know what he meant.  Many other posters here knew what he meant.  It seems that you are the only one who felt it was ambiguous.  Please don't attack John, or anyone else, for pointing this out.
 
This does not make me a Cake-ophile, or fanbois, or any other such snide name.  It just means we understood what he meant.  Let us not argue semantics - this is not the correct forum.
 
I am sure you will come back with another passive aggressive  comment to show yourself as some kind of victim, but at least any right thinking person will see through that.
 
I am off to bed now, but will comment tomorrow on the sensible, less childlike comments you made.
 
As for an external quote - "Admittedly, it is difficult to reason people out of positions they didn't use reason to attain."  - Craig Anderton
 
Regards,
 
Jonathan.

Why is this forum so stupid sometimes?  Are we really arguing semantics to this level?  He said, "Pro Channel and its unique sound," then went on to be more specific IN the post. 
 
Saying, "Pro Channel doesn't have a sound, it's the MODULES that have sound" is like saying.... "It's not the AMP that makes the sound!  It's all the wires and capacitors!"  Does anyone really walk around saying, "Man, I got such an amazing tone from my WIRES and CAPACITORS today!"  Seriously, shut up. 

jb101
Last post on this...

POST TITLE....The Pro Channel and IT'S Unique sound" - I don't think that can be "misread" or misunderstood...
 
 
 
I am just replying to  this statement, as I agree with most of the rest of your posts, and will comment on them when I have a chance.
 
I think most people can understand what the OP meant, unless they suffer from a fundamental lack of social reciprocity.  If this includes you, then I apologise, but I don't think it does.
 
I know what he meant.  Many other posters here knew what he meant.  It seems that you are the only one who felt it was ambiguous.  Please don't attack John, or anyone else, for pointing this out.
 
This does not make me a Cake-ophile, or fanbois, or any other such snide name.  It just means we understood what he meant.  Let us not argue semantics - this is not the correct forum.
 
I am sure you will come back with another passive aggressive  comment to show yourself as some kind of victim, but at least any right thinking person will see through that.
 
I am off to bed now, but will comment tomorrow on the sensible, less childlike comments you made.
 
As for an external quote - "Admittedly, it is difficult to reason people out of positions they didn't use reason to attain."  - Craig Anderton
 
Regards,
 
Jonathan.

Excellent post JB! Larry, the problem is your delivery and how you sort of forcefully insist about things that in all honesty, sort of skewered in my opinion only. Please allow me to share some factual stuff with you. This is not to correct you, not to act like a fan boy and not to argue. I'm giving you a few things to think about and have told you above why some may bash on you. Improve the delivery and no one will argue with you...it will be a discussion, not a war. I've seen more negative posts from you than positive ones. Some of your posts have merit...others seem like rants that could be cool discussions if you worked on your delivery. Just my observation though, not a character assassination.
 
First off, I'm not slinging my credentials around or anything, but I've been in this field for over 30 years. That doesn't make me any better than you or anyone else. But it does give me experience. The pro channel 100% helps to create the sound in Sonar. Use another eq and different compressors, you get a different sound. Next, you obviously are not using this program to the extent that the rest of us are or you would not have mentioned "more pc modules." We have a program that is very good, but has some bugs and other issues that need to be addressed before more plugs are offered. Seriously man. Take it from we that use this for a living for over 12 hours a day. The last thing I want is more pc modules right now.
 
Next, the Waves stuff you mention is subjective. I'll put a Sonitus eq up against a Waves Q-10 any day. That is my personal preference...it is not a fact for you or me. Price means nothing. That CA2A is better than some of the ones 2A's I have paid big bucks for. Proof price is not always the key to better sound. And lastly, forget console emulations. Let me tell you some real life experiences. I have studied extensively at 2 different recording schools. I have trained on both NEVE and SSL consoles. Not once in all my schooling were those consoles used for distortion/gain like the Sonar and Waves console emulators other than "uggh...too much pre there". These CE's to me drive sounds....and they color them in an artificial way. I don't care who has tested this scientifically or what the papers state. I'm telling you that they are all horrendous and are doing nothing more than adding a light crunch and sizzle to a mix with a filter of sorts. I have NEVER gotten that out of an SSL or NEVE console, I assure you.
 
The reason? It sounds bad...period. NEVE and SSL are known for good pre's....not dirty pre's you can drive. What you hear in the Waves CE's is more drive. The Sonar CE's have less sizzle but are doing the same thing on a smaller scale. It has nothing to do with price. I've never heard of anyone driving a NEVE or SSL with good results. We drive pre-amps, not consoles. They haven't nailed pre-amp drive emulation yet, so don't buy into the hype. Trust me...I've worked on enough analog gear, consoles and tape machines. I know what good pre-amp and tape drive sounds like. It is NOT what we are getting from these plugs today. The only two plugs in my opinion that come close to this would be the UAD tape sim plugs...Studer and Ampex. Nothing else I've heard sounds like "good saturation" to me.
 
Digital clipping drive is NOT what you get out of pre-amps and tape. And I'm still stumped on why someone would want to drive the pre on a console to distortion. It sounds horrible whether it's a NEVE or an SSL. Period. But people feel they are getting better sounding mixes with these CE's. Fine by me...whatever works and tricks their brains. :) This whole "go back in time" with analog sounding drive/plugs baffles my mind. I'm done with dull sounding analog stuff. But that's just me...I like the extra low end we have now as well as the hyped high end we never heard from analog.
 
See, you can't ram your opinion down peoples throats without expecting to get a rise out of them. I'm sharing opinions here, but I'm also sharing facts having lived them being I've been in this field over 30 years and use Sonar for over 12 hours per day. I also beta test for several software companies while using Sonar as my DAW of choice to test their products. This helps me to lock in even more than some normal users because I'm forced to take things to their limits and test in other areas. 
 
If you don't want to use the PC eq, click the button in the top right corner of the pc. That kills anything that is running in the PC including the quad eq. Then load the effects of your choice into the Fx bins, save it as a template and you have what you need. Sonar has given us so many option, it boggles my mind to read some of the stuff I read on this forum. I could care less whether I use PC or not. I do use it and with great results but I also use the bins too as well as fx chains. The guy that praised the PC in this thread praised it for 2 reasons in my opinion.
 
1. It's made mixing easier for him. Try being a new person messing with the Sonitus eq or Waves or whatever and not really knowing what to touch. Seriously...put your experience to the side and be a new user for a second. Then, use the pc eq and don't even touch any frequency bands. You can mix a project perfectly without touching a single band for the most part. Try it. High pass and low pass using the stock eq settings. Then, mix using the freq's that load up with the plug using cut, boost and the Q.
 
2. Though you disagree, this makes "the sound" of your project whether you tweak the eq extensively or not. You didn't need to play a numbers game, you loaded it up and you went. This is worthy of praise as it took the intimidation factor as well as the guess work out of the process for a new user. Think about that. Work with Waves Q-10, Sonitus etc. Then try the PC quad that is there waiting which can dial in a sound in seconds with excellent pre-selected lows, mids and highs right out of the box. No brainer to me if I'm new at this. The low they select at 79 Hz is great....the low mid at 317 is awesome for controlling low mid mud...the high mid at 1.2 is a bit subjective to me, but is still a good starting point adjustment. And lastly, 5k is an awesome start for removing or adding highs.
 
I personally wish they had 2 more band selections as I like low, low mid, mid, high mid and high "air high". But if it bothers me...bang, I drop a Roger Nichols customized eq in the bin that I can create (literally create) on the fly and have all the bands I need. But all this stuff makes mixing much easier in my opinion for everyone. Who gives a crap what your fave eq is? That's not the point...which is why people barked at you dude. The OP said he likes what he got and it made a difference. End of story really....or change your delivery. 
 
The comps: The CA2A is a great comp for people that like that sort of comp. You can dial it in quickly. All the PC comps are decent and easy to use if you compare to a Sonitus. The 4k buss (ignore the "buss" part of that comp....it is truly a work of art as far as a compressor goes..trust me) is the hardest to use...and rightfully so for those that understand compression and are looking for more flexibility.
 
That 4k buss comp is the best comp Sonar has to offer imo. Those that bash it do not know how to use a compressor (also imo). I'll take it over anything Waves makes compressor wise other than the API 2500. People shy away from the 4k Sonar buss comp because it is harder to use and they get confused by the whole "buss" thing. Forget the word buss exists and use it on tracks...it's incredible. I'll put that on a snare and give it nearly as much crack as a transient plug. I've showed that in a video I posted a few months back and nearly nailed a SPL Transient Designer sound while comparing the two.
 
Anyway, that's my take. When I can share my experience which is also "how I've lived it" I have no problems sharing the positives. If that makes me a fan boy, I actually really don't care what anyone calls me. I like Sonar, I use it more than anything else....it works for me. When that happens, I praise it. When Sonar does something wrong, I'm at the top of the list wanting fixes/changes. I will also try to find the faults of those bashing on it that may not see the full picture that may also be misinformed. Not to be a fan, but to help educate if the possibility exists. Studio One, Sequoia, Wave Lab, Pro Tools and everything else I have works well for me. I will brag about the good things....explain my experiences on the bad. It's never anything personal nor would I stick up for something when there are blatant issues. However, the delivery of a comment makes all the difference in how it is both accepted and dealt with on this forum. I know you could care less, but you made a mention, I'm just giving you my take as an outsider looking in.
 
-Danny

Beepster
Dammit, Danny! Now I'm gonna have to read all that. lol
 
;-)

Worth it, IMO...
 
Regards,
Dan

Okay, I didn't really read the rest of the thread (seems there has been some sort of kerfuffle, ugh) but many of Danny's points apply to me directly as a relative newcomer and his thoughts on the chosen frequencies for the Quad EQ make sense. I didn't know why but there have been MANY times when I'm messing around with something trying to get it sounding better quickly and found that really just turning the default bands up/down and/or making the band wider/narrower gets me pretty much where I want. It kind of freaks me out because after years of screwing around with 10 band EQs or whatever and having to fiddle with things forever using trial and error it was weird just having the right frequencies right out of the gate. I'd think "well geeze if it sounds that good without moving the band maybe if just nudge it over a bit I can really hone in on an even sweeter spot". Most times it will make it sound worse... like significantly worse. So I don't know what kind of fancy voodoo they did to come up with those bands or whether that's how the hardware versions were set but man... it is really spot on and really convenient.
 
I would however like to see an option for more bands though. The quad is great for getting close but yeah, I do end up tossing the Sonitus EQ on stuff a lot of the times to do some fine tuning. However I usually don't have to do much which is again a huge time saver. I'm not used to getting my EQing done so quickly and I mean this is even before I actually did some hardcore studying on general EQ principals. Now it's like I just go in there and within seconds I got something cool happening.
 
The CA2A is another massive time saver. It's not great for everything but man... it sure does work for most stuff I'm doing and again it doesn't take me forever to dial in like some of the other ones. I was able to use it rather easily before studying up on compression as well so that's a good thing for a n00b.
 
As far as the CE... I kind of like it but I don't use it as recommended. I'll try it on specific tracks or busses to see what it does. Sometimes it's good, sometimes it's bad, sometimes you just can't hear it at all. I like a bit of old school grit on stuff because... well I listen to tons of old metal, punk, country, rock, etc that was recorded with less than stellar equipment and I like to put a bit of that into my sound. It may seem weird to some but I just don't like ultra clarity. Too cold and sterile. I would likely be better off with some of the fancy tape sim plugs but I don't really have money for that kind of thing so the CE is just something cool to have around. I would die without it though. Edit: That should have read I WOULDN'T die without it. lol
 
Meh. Just some ramblings. Cheers.

I'm not a FanBoi, I'm a DanBoi.

bapu
I'm not a FanBoi, I'm a DanBoi.

Yeah, Danny is right about everything !
 
well, except for cars and.........maybe hair ;)

heres a prime example of how good the pro channel modules sound, and on the master bus, lp eq, bus compressor and cl 2a, with a bit of limiting with ozones maximiser https://soundcloud.com/chris-macfarlane-1

too right it's shameless, cuz am shameless, my old mans frank gallagher ;)

thats hardcore john, wouldn't think you'd like it lol nobody does unless you're a demented raver from the 90's

gabba is the genre, originates from holland/germany early 90's

Same here Beep but I do have the air on and its pleasant. 

it's actually just about midnight here, i can here the lone piper over in scone palace, waiting on the gates of dawn