Proper set-up for recording a trio

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dlogan
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2009/10/12 11:48:44 (permalink)

Proper set-up for recording a trio

Sorry for yet another post about vocal recording... I'm going to be doing some things for the first time and it would be very difficult to get everyone back together to redo things if they don't go right!
 
I'm going to be recording a trio singing back-up vocals and we want to have them all sing together. They are experienced with singing together as a group. They will be singing to pre-recorded instrumental tracks with the lead vocal already recorded. Each will have their own microphone and will be monitoring with headphones.
 
My question is how to position them. I was planning on setting the microphones up about 1-2 feet apart from each other, in a slight curve so the singers can see each other while they're singing. I'm not too worried about bleed. I think we'll be able to get good takes from them. There might be some small editing if they don't all end a note at the same time, etc, but that should be pretty minor. I mainly want to be able to adjust their levels and panning separately. But I want to make sure this set-up sounds okay?
 
Thanks.
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    bitflipper
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    Re:Proper set-up for recording a trio 2009/10/12 12:27:49 (permalink)
    Option A: set up the mics 120 ° from one another, in a circle and as far apart as is practical and still allow the singers being able to hear one another clearly. Bleed isn't as big a problem as phasing, and this arrangement will minimize both.

    Option B: use a single omnidirectional mic and array the singers around it. This is how the Beach Boys did it.


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    wst3
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    Re:Proper set-up for recording a trio 2009/10/12 13:43:58 (permalink)
    I prefer option B, except that sometimes I'll sub a cardiod pattern and get the singers to stand a little closer together.

    For the most part it has been my experience that fewer microphones works better whether it's a drum kit, a bunch of vocalists, a horn section, or what ever it is you want to record. It is NOT always the right answer, but it's a great place to start because (a) it's easier to set up, and (b) it minimizes a lot of those pesky "laws of physics" type problems.

    Another approach that I've gotten great results from is to use a directional microphone (I usually use a figure-8 ribbon) placed a distance from the group of singers. This presumes a great sounding room, and sufficient space to get everything working, but when it works it sounds like the microphone disappeared.

    THe downside of any of these minimalist approaches is that you lose the ability to micro-edit the performances later. That could be a deal breaker, but since I'm lazy and prefer not to do a lot of editing in the first place (credit years of rolling tape for reel, er real) it works for me.

    YMMV!

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    dlogan
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    Re:Proper set-up for recording a trio 2009/10/12 13:47:57 (permalink)
    Thanks guys. I'm going to start out with Bit's "Plan A" because I'd like it to be stereo. But if after the first couple of takes that's not working, I'll revert to "Plan B" and just stick 'em in front of one of the mics...
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    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re:Proper set-up for recording a trio 2009/10/12 14:06:18 (permalink)
    If it was me I'd use "Plan B" with the stereo upgrade.

    I would go with X/Y rather than ORTF.

    Because  it's a trio I'd prefer to use figure 8's in X/Y.

    For mid distance work with a choral group, I have many times used cardiod condensers in X/Y... someday I'll try the figure 8's.

    You can try M/S as well.

    If you don't have figure 8's try cardiods.

    best,
    mike


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    dlogan
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    Re:Proper set-up for recording a trio 2009/10/12 15:17:34 (permalink)
    Mike - I appreciate your response. I don't understand 1/2 of what you're saying, but I do appreciate it! (ORTF? M/S??) I don't have a stereo mic, but that would be a nice thing to look into at some point...
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    bitflipper
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    Re:Proper set-up for recording a trio 2009/10/12 15:55:00 (permalink)
    Dave, he's talking about using two microphones, placed very close together but facing 90 ° apart. That'll give you stereo, but you'll lose some of the natural acoustical blending you get with a single mic unless you place the mics back a ways.

    A lot of the miking technique depends on the room. If it's a vocal booth lined with 703, then there is no point in exotic microphone techniques. But if it's a nice reverberant space and your singers are able to project well into that space, then it could be well worth the effort to capture it in stereo with ambiance.

    I'd be especially curious to try Mike's other suggestion, M/S miking. I've never thought about it for vocals; you kind of automatically think acoustic guitars with M/S. It might be very cool, but only if you have a very lively and nice-sounding room.


    post edited by bitflipper - 2009/10/12 15:58:25


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