RME PCI vs PCIe Latency and Performance differences?

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Beatmachinery
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2017/11/09 02:32:57 (permalink)

RME PCI vs PCIe Latency and Performance differences?

Hello! Im planning to build a Micro ATX PC for live gigs. I play E Drums with a bunch of MIDI controllers using Drum racks and FX in Ableton Live.
 
So I´ve been researching and I want a PCI RME interface because of its stability and low latency.
It is not really and affordable solution cause at least I need 16 outputs and PCIe interfaces are not that cheap and moreover , you have to expand with MADI , AES or ADAT.
I was thinking on getting a Hammerfall HDSP 9652 And a pair of AEB8-O , and that would give me 16 outputs directly from the CPU to the mixer.
 
Problem is that nowadays , almost no motherboard (and specially no micro or mini ATX) come with PCI Slots anymore , but I´ve found this Gigabyte motherboard , which I would use with a 7700K Processor :

 
But the biggest and main question is : Is there such a difference (specially talking about latency , stability and performance) between the RME PCI and PCIe cards?...
Thanks!
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    Jim Roseberry
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    Re: RME PCI vs PCIe Latency and Performance differences? 2017/11/09 13:34:29 (permalink)
    I mentioned this before... but the AEB8-0 converters are (ironically) not particularly good.
    Almost everything else RME makes is excellent.  
     
    RME PCIe cards will go down to a 32-sample ASIO buffer size.
    RME PCI cards will go down to a 64-sample ASIO buffer size.
     
    RME PCI round-trip latency (including external A/D D/A) is going to be ~5ms (64-sample ASIO buffer size/44.1k).
    RME PCIe round-trip latency (including external A/D D/A) is going to be <3ms (32-sample ASIO buffer size/44.1k).
     
    Another thing to keep in mind (if you're playing live); the sound-engineer is going to prefer XLR outputs from your converters.  Otherwise, he/she will need 16 channels of DI box.
    The stage snake may have a couple of 1/4" inputs... but it won't have sixteen of them.

    Best Regards,

    Jim Roseberry
    jim@studiocat.com
    www.studiocat.com
    #2
    batsbrew
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    Re: RME PCI vs PCIe Latency and Performance differences? 2017/11/09 15:18:54 (permalink)
    The RME usb units are not that far off, either.
    might make things easier to configure.

    "Stay"
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    #3
    Jim Roseberry
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    Re: RME PCI vs PCIe Latency and Performance differences? 2017/11/09 15:23:11 (permalink)
    batsbrew
    The RME usb units are not that far off, either.
    might make things easier to configure.



    Absolutely agree.
     
    The MOTU AVB series would also be a good choice for low round-trip latency.

    Best Regards,

    Jim Roseberry
    jim@studiocat.com
    www.studiocat.com
    #4
    SigiZ58
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    Re: RME PCI vs PCIe Latency and Performance differences? 2017/11/09 16:24:25 (permalink)
    Jim Roseberry
     
    RME PCI cards will go down to a 64-sample ASIO buffer size.
     



    Sorry Sir,  that is not correct anymore. My PCI HDSP 9652 allows a Buffer Size of 32 Samples. This values were updated some time ago - even in the Manual you can see they offer a latency from 0.7 ms resp. 32 Samples
     
    https://www.rme-audio.de/download/hdsp9652_e.pdf
     
    Page 15
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    Jim Roseberry
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    Re: RME PCI vs PCIe Latency and Performance differences? 2017/11/09 17:00:24 (permalink)
    SigiZ58
    Jim Roseberry
     
    RME PCI cards will go down to a 64-sample ASIO buffer size.

    Sorry Sir,  that is not correct anymore. My PCI HDSP 9652 allows a Buffer Size of 32 Samples. This values were updated some time ago - even in the Manual you can see they offer a latency from 0.7 ms resp. 32 Samples
     
    https://www.rme-audio.de/download/hdsp9652_e.pdf
     
    Page 15



    Thanks for the correction.  Been years since I used a RME PCI audio interface.
    Even so... it doesn't make much sense to invest in an audio interface that subject to bridged PCI slots on modern motherboards.  
    RME PCI audio interfaces (thus far) have coped well in bridged PCI slots.
    There is no guarantee this will continue with future motherboards.
     
    BTW, To the OP, if you're trying to run heavy loads with Ableton Live at a 32-sample ASIO buffer size, you'll be disappointed with the results.  Live (due to Warping/etc), isn't the most CPU efficient DAW application.
    You can verify this by running the simulated CPU load (under preferences)... and listening to the test tone.
    I'd check this before shelling out significant $$$.
    FWIW, I built a machine for running Live (to trigger samples)... and even with a fast socket 2011-3 6850k based machine, it couldn't get anywhere near 75% CPU load (glitch-free).  This was at a 32-sample ASIO buffer size.
     
     

    Best Regards,

    Jim Roseberry
    jim@studiocat.com
    www.studiocat.com
    #6
    SigiZ58
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    Re: RME PCI vs PCIe Latency and Performance differences? 2017/11/09 18:36:15 (permalink)
    Jim Roseberry
    Even so... it doesn't make much sense to invest in an audio interface that subject to bridged PCI slots on modern motherboards.   



    I agree competely, but you can get them cheap used with patience. I think 100-150$ for such a Card is no investition but peanuts :-)  RME still sells these Cards, they are not EOL yet.  As I wrote in the other thread, for me RME Cards are a reason to buy a new mainboard with at least one PCI Slot :-) I am pretty sure, you can enjoy these cards still in 10 years. Sorry for my enthusiasm, but I make Music on PCs since around 15 years. Until now, I had no idea, how well RME Cards perform, and I got some used really cheap the last weeks. I cannot use them in my "modern" System, this has the weakest (external) Cards now. I hate it has no PCI Slot :-) And an raydat would cost me 3 times as much as they are almost impossible to get used for a reasonable Price.
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