Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question

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johnnyswingo
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2011/01/11 00:06:43 (permalink)

Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question

I get songs sent to me from my friend (minus drums) and I'm recording drum parts using EZDrummer. I used "File..Import Audio" to put the song in an audio track in SHS 6XL. I recorded the drum part, playing along with the pre-recorded audio track, w/ no problem. I just noticed that the default BPM in the project is set to 120BPM. I used a BPM Analyzer and it reported that the song (audio) was 95.03 BPM. My friend wants me to send each drum track seperately so he can have someone else mix and master everything. My question: Is my friend gonna be able to "line up" the drum tracks with the audio because I recorded the drum track with the default project BPM when the song is at a slower tempo? Am I gonna have to re-record the drum track?

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    Truckermusic
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    Re:Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question 2011/01/11 08:32:04 (permalink)
    yes basic answer is No.. a 120 bpm drum part will not line up with 95.03 bpm audio.....you will be able to start on the down beat together but that is it ...so you need to start over ......here is what I would do:
     
    I am going to assume that you rendered the drum track to audio and then placed it into the project....Correct?

    If so, then:
     erase / delete the EZ Drummer audio track out of the project completely
    Place time line on Measure one beat one and change your tempo to that 95.03 bpm
    insert EZ Drummer as a soft synth back into the project and set up for multi out and select "use midi source track"
    select your midi grooves from ez drummer and plasce into your midi source track

    now your project should play at the 95.03 tempo and your freinds project (audio) should line up with ez drummer midi parts

    now you can export the ez drummer parts as individual tracks (I would suggest wav files)

    copy the ez drummer wav files and his individual audio tracks (again I would suggest wav) on to a CD and you can hand this to your frenid for who ever he wants to mix and master.

    Or if his freind has sonar and EZ Drummer and any other synths used in the project then copy the .cwt file and the audio file and put them on the cd as well this way the other person should be able to open up the cwt fie and get to work with out having to import things and making sure things line up etc.....just make sure you inclue the ez drummer wav files just in case.

    hope this helps
    Clifford

    hope this helps
    Clifford
    post edited by Truckermusic - 2011/01/11 08:34:05

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    Beagle
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    Re:Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question 2011/01/11 08:33:26 (permalink)
    MIDI is the most wonderful tool in the world!  he can re-adjust the MIDI tempo to the project.  in fact, when he imports your MIDI file into his project and the project tempo on his project is set to 95, the MIDI will automatically be set to 95.

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    Truckermusic
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    Re:Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question 2011/01/11 08:51:09 (permalink)
    Beagle


    MIDI is the most wonderful tool in the world!  he can re-adjust the MIDI tempo to the project.  in fact, when he imports your MIDI file into his project and the project tempo on his project is set to 95, the MIDI will automatically be set to 95.

    Reece...
     
    You are very correct.....
     
    I am going on the assumption that his freind gave him audio stems and he tried or did render his EZ Drummer part to audio....in which case it will never line up.....
     
    However if his freinds parts are midi and the ez drummer parts are only midi then every thing will line up perfect!!
     
    i went on the first assumption!   (and we all know where that gets you )
     
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    johnnyswingo
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    Re:Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question 2011/01/11 09:27:33 (permalink)
    Thanks for the info fellas. Trucker, my friends parts are audio (bass, guit,vox) and I did render the EZ Drummer part to audio the files. I'm playing an electronic drum kit and using it to trigger the EZDrummer drum kit sounds. I don't think he has EZD, so I'll have to re-record the drums We have to send files to each other over The Interweb because the singer is in Qatar, and the guitar player and I are in Fl. Beagle, MIDI is an awesome tool. I didn't like what I recorded in some parts and it was so easy to just go in and move things around. I kinda thought I'd have to redo the tracks, but I wanted to check here first.

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    Beagle
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    Re:Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question 2011/01/11 09:39:33 (permalink)
    ah - sorry.  actually you won't have to re-record tho.  if all you're doing is sending him the audio files of your EZD, then just change the tempo in your project and bounce/export your EZD track again!

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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question 2011/01/11 10:00:04 (permalink)
    The only problem I see is if the guy recorded the song and did not use the metronome in the DAW to stay on time with.

    Most musicians will vary their tempo slightly over the duration of a song unless they are staying on the beat with  the metronome.  So if he did use the metro, you can easily drop the midi in. Audio doesn't care about the BPM of the project. Midi does.

    A problem I have run into a few times in working with people who record a track with no metro.... is that they often fall somewhere between the BPM... faster than say 95 but slower then 96.  If it's not exact, by the end of a 3 minute song the audio is audibly off from the midi tracks.

    Anytime someone wants to send me a track minus drums, I always ask them to use the metro to stay on a steady beat...and give 2 measures of count in in the song.

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    Norrie
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    Re:Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question 2011/01/11 19:34:25 (permalink)
    Hi guys sorry to jump in on this one

    You said you used a used a BPM Analyzer ? Could I ask where I could get one and what to look for ?

    It would be handy for seting the the bpm correct if I wanted to do a few cover songs :)

    Thanks and sorry for pulling off subject

    Norrie


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    Beagle
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    Re:Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question 2011/01/11 21:49:07 (permalink)
    Norrie - I use this one:
    http://www.mixmeister.com/bpmanalyzer/bpmanalyzer.asp

    it's free

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    gdugan
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    Re:Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question 2011/01/11 22:05:54 (permalink)
    Johnny,

    If you are just playing along with his prerecorded tracks, and sending him audio files, the project tempo is irrelevant. If your drums are in sync in your project, it will be in sync in his, provided you send him audio files that start at the same place in the project as his audio tracks start, even if the drums don't come in for a while. All the audio tracks are recorded at a fixed clock (usually 44.1 kHz). Matching project tempo only matters if you're sending him MIDI data that must line up with audio data in his project.
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    RobertB
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    Re:Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question 2011/01/11 22:59:23 (permalink)
    That's how I read it also, Gary.
    Johnny, the audio is in sync. That's the important thing.
    The 120 BPM in the project was not used as a reference. It's just a bogus number hanging out there. Adjusting the BPM of the MIDI will most certainly throw it off.
    Just send the audio tracks, and pretend MIDI is not even involved.

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    Norrie
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    Re:Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question 2011/01/12 08:47:45 (permalink)
    Beagle


    Norrie - I use this one:
    http://www.mixmeister.com/bpmanalyzer/bpmanalyzer.asp

    it's free


    Thanks Beagle !

    Downloaded and will try it later :)

    Thanks again

    Norrie

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    Bristol_Jonesey
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    Re:Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question 2011/01/12 09:37:01 (permalink)
    RobertB


    That's how I read it also, Gary.
    Johnny, the audio is in sync. That's the important thing.
    The 120 BPM in the project was not used as a reference. It's just a bogus number hanging out there. Adjusting the BPM of the MIDI will most certainly throw it off.
    Just send the audio tracks, and pretend MIDI is not even involved.

    +1
     
    This way, you retain all the natural nuances and timing variations that you'd expect from a live player, and not set rigidly in stone as though you're er, playing along to a metronome.
     
    There is a rather elegant way of building a midi performance from raw audio such as this which simply involves tapping out & recording a rhythmic, percussive AUDIO pulse using your keyboard (music), then use that and get Audiosnap to detect the transients (piece of cake - as that's the only information in the track).
    Finally, use this to create a tempo map.
     
    This sounds a lot more complicated than it really is - but I've tried it, and it works perfectly.
    post edited by Bristol_Jonesey - 2011/01/12 09:38:48

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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question 2011/01/12 09:39:01 (permalink)
    If you're recording totally in the audio realm, the BPM on the DAW doesn't matter a bit.  You can record, mix, add tracks etc, to your hearts content and life is lovely.

    You only experience problems when MIDI is added to the project later on.... and ONLY IF you did not use the metronome to set the BPM and keep the audio tracks in tempo with it.

    It is for this reason that I always set the BPM and use my drum synth to play a "click track" even if I will remove the drum track or envelope it out, or edit it later.

    So far, all but two of the people I have worked with, or attempted to work with, have  recorded to a click track. With those 2, neither project was completed successfully for a number of reasons.

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    johnnyswingo
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    Re:Recording MIDI drums (EZDrummer) meter question 2011/01/19 23:40:17 (permalink)
    Thanks for all the input. Gary you were 100% correct. Everything was in sync. I had to set the tempo to 95BPM when I dropped in some EZDrummer midi latin percussion grooves. I rendered the percussion grooves as audio and everything was in sync with them as well.

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