Recording bass without a bass

Hello...
 
Does anybody have suggestions how to record a decent bass sound with an electric guitar(no real bass in the household)??
I have a couple of bass plug ins(Softube Bass Amp room) and of course there the Dim Pro/Rapture option, but I'm struggling with the tone...
Sonitus and Waves Ren6Q EQ are helping a bit, and I'm sure compression with be advantageous later on in the mixing stage, but I'm still not satisfied with how it sounds in the mix---besides having to do with my poor technique
Thx,
Freq
 
Edit:   I want to avoid keyboard-based bass playing as my skills are even worse!

If you play guitar then just record the bassline you want on guitar (DI, totally clean). Sonar has "ARA" audio to MIDI conversion that uses the included Melodyne to detect the notes and convert them to MIDI. I am not sure which versions of Sonar support the ARA conversion (SPlat of course does).
 
All you have to do is create an empty MIDI track then drag the audio clip of your guitar part INTO the MIDI clip. It will automatically convert the notes to MIDI. I recommend holding Ctrl + Shift as you drag the clip into the MIDI track. The Ctrl binding COPIES the audio clip so you still have the original in its original track (not sure if necessary for drop/drag MIDI conversion) and the Shift key keep the clip lined up to the time grid as you drag it downward.
 
The detection isn't perfect though and the free version of Melodyne does not support "polyphonic" conversion. You can upgrade it though for chord detection (pretty cool, ya?).
 
That means only play one note at a time (it's a bass part so usually that's fine. Play it as clean and tight as possible (with no external effects that can garble the signal... FX Rack/Bin or Prochannel effects don't count because they are added to the dry signal/clip after the fact... not printed to the clip).
 
To clean up the signal even more before the conversion (for more accuracy) you can use EQing, compressor/limiters, transient shapers, etc to make that dry signal as clear and distinct as possible. Only do that if you NEED to. As in if the resulting MIDI has all sorts of incorrectly detected notes, doubled notes, missing notes, etc. You don't even have to worry about whether it sounds "good". It just needs to have each note clearly defined in a way the attack and pitch of each note is clear enough for Melodyne to do its thing.
 
Reason being that any bad detection means extra work to clean up the resulting MIDI file... and you WILL have to go through the MIDI file to correct these types of things. It can be very tedious so the cleaner the audio track the less work you have to do.
 
Once you get your MIDI file converted and cleaned up you can go completely apenoodles with. Quantize it, humanize it, arpeggiate it, feed through any synth (or multiple synths) you want, mangle it, whatever.
 
If you want a nice bass sound I used to use the "Picked Alembic" sound in Zeta+2 (might be in the classic banks... if not you probably don't have). Studio Instruments Bass synth is actually REALLY good and realistic if you want just a straight bass sound and it's included.
 
Me I picked up the Anderton Gibson EB5 sample pack for DimensionPro a while back and it's solid. Just sound great.
 
BUT explore all the patches in all your various synths. Lots of good bass sounds included in Sonar.
 
Also keep in mind that you can also run a simple bass sound (like that Studio Instruments Bass I mentioned) through the include amp simulators or other effects. Essentially your MIDI just turns into a straight up dry bass sound and then you treat it like a live, mic, amp'd bass player/rig/sound.
 
Make sense?
 
Cheers.

Hi. You could try to pitch shift the guitar down an octave. Do not know if it will sound ok or not.
All the best.

lowerfreq
Hello...
 
Does anybody have suggestions how to record a decent bass sound with an electric guitar(no real bass in the household)??
I have a couple of bass plug ins(Softube Bass Amp room) and of course there the Dim Pro/Rapture option, but I'm struggling with the tone...
Sonitus and Waves Ren6Q EQ are helping a bit, and I'm sure compression with be advantageous later on in the mixing stage, but I'm still not satisfied with how it sounds in the mix---besides having to do with my poor technique
Thx,
Freq
 
Edit:   I want to avoid keyboard-based bass playing as my skills are even worse!

Yes.
 
The correct answer is to load a program called "midi guitar".  Its a polyphonic pitch to midi program for guitar that works incredibly well.  Use the midi signal with whatever bass VST you have.
 
I was using it with Scarbee bass libraries, but those libraries interpret dynamics on the guitar as different kinds of notes (mute, slap, etc) making it difficult to play, so my advice is to put a compressor on the guitar to control dynamics or find a VST that is more basic without so many articulations.
 
 
 

Another vote for Melodyne pitch-to-MIDI conversion with guitar, then dropping the MIDI notes down an octave and driving a virtual synth.
 
Another option is to simply record your guitar part, and use Melodyne or SONAR's transposition DSP as Zargg71 mentioned, but that much of a stretch will probably sound less than wonderful compared to using MIDI to drive something like SI-Bass.

Anderton
 
Another option is to simply record your guitar part, and use Melodyne or SONAR's transposition DSP as Zargg71 mentioned...

I've gotten ok results using this method with SONAR's transposition process (at least to my ears).  I recorded a clean DI signal with my guitar, selected the wave file, then clicked Process - Transpose.  I then checked the "Transpose Audio" box, dropped the amount to -12, and chose the "Radius Solo (Bass)" type.  I then ran it through a bass amp sim.  The process was pretty quick and sounded pretty good to me.  The other suggestions made here may get better results, but I have not tried them.
 
If you're interested in hearing an example of what I described, here's a link to a quick little blues guitar video I did with the bass done this way:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x4gwm79_little-blues-guitar-jam-in-g_music
 
 
 

Zargg71
Hi. You could try to pitch shift the guitar down an octave. Do not know if it will sound ok or not.
All the best.

Does the TH3 Sonar version include the pitch shifter? If so that and a bass amp sim. I like the TH3 bassman, but I don't know if that's included in the Sonar version ...
 

rsinger

Zargg71
Hi. You could try to pitch shift the guitar down an octave. Do not know if it will sound ok or not.
All the best.

Does the TH3 Sonar version include the pitch shifter? If so that and a bass amp sim. I like the TH3 bassman, but I don't know if that's included in the Sonar version ...
 

You can just use Melodyne or Sonar's built in DSP Transpose process to downtune the guitar file. It would probably turn out better than a guitar sim pitch processor.

lowerfreq
Now if I could only program my brain to think like a bass player

Just remember that you're part of the rhythm section, not the melody section 

Another option is to record the guitar as you would a bass, and drag it to a MIDI track (before pitching it down). Use (as an example) SI bass for the MIDI (transpose down an octave). Then pitch down your guitar and blend. 
All the best.
 

As others have stated, the audio to MIDI convert option may be a good way to go here? Just record what you want using the electric guitar, then convert from audio to MIDI. Once in MIDI, you can use any VST for the bass? Works quite well...

I was really keen on amplesounds bass. I was looking at the complexities of the articulations available, and reading about how to program it so it sounds like a bassist played it. Then it dawned on me to look at how much they cost for real. I play flute and sax, and they teand to get expensive really quickly. When I found the price of a Squire Jazz Bass was about twice the price of the sample sets from Amplesound, I thought it was crazy to speand time learning to mimic a bass player, when I can spend that time learning the real thing. And being studio based, I can sit and work on getting 2 or 4 bars right, and not have to worry about the whole song live.
 
Its really changed my perspective on baselines and and openied up playing over chord progressions, instead of my previously modal approach.
 
I needed new speakers a while back, I was using cheap speakers waiting for documents to secure me in the county. I kept putting off my order for replacements from overseas. Then I saw an acoustic bass guitar in a shop here. Acoustic guitars are so common in Vietnam, you see bags strapped to riders backs everywhere, but not Acoustic basses. I've seen 3 in 2 years of being here. One is mine, the other a friend brought with him and the third in a shop in Saigon. I love it. Got my paperwork through, ordered 8" monitors, with some flats for the Jazz and Nylons for the acoustic. I'm kind of kicking myself for not doing this years ago, when I was around a friend who could have helped me learn a lot. I've not told him yet. I look forward to surprising him and get a masterclass when I next visit the UK
 

Anderton

lowerfreq
Now if I could only program my brain to think like a bass player

Just remember that you're part of the rhythm section, not the melody section 

Don't tell that to the late great Chris Squire of Yes!

If you have IK's Amplitube 3 or 4, you just need to use the Pitch Shifter pedal (with a bass amp sim....i.e Ampeg) and you have da BASS!! :))