Recording voice, fundamental question.

I compared a recording I made of my vocal and some backing. I followed most of the suggestions I have read here on clipping and so forth.

The voice is at the center.

I compared the recording to a top-notch popular comecial recording of voice and backing, and observed comparisons.

One main thing I noticed is this:
Although in the commercial recording the voice is also in the center, I seem to hear it as wider. On mine, the sound seems to be narrower, also in the center. Loudness is about the same. I like the wider sound better.

I know panning is move left or right anywhere. But what is it that I need to try to have voice sound wider, yet centered? It's hard to search for info if I don't even know the term used for that feature.

I would appreciate input on this. I believe this is an effect I want to learn about and how to apply it.

Thanks.

I agree with hairyjamie, it is probably just a stereo reverb panned just wide enough to thicken the vocal.

Another neat new plug-in effect that was introduced in Sonar 8.5.1 Pro is the vocal processing effect.  They have a "Doubler" which allows you to provide an almost doubling of the vocal part.  It also has a graphical representation of how much of the doubling is occuring so you can visually see the widening as you listen.  It is an interesting new tool.

Tom

The new vocal plugin we got in 8.5 has a "doubling" feature that has a clever widening parameter.

Generally you want to stay away from just cloning a track and shifting, with either panned to the sides. It can sound interesting at first but has all sorts of problems with comb filtering if you try to sum it to mono, and it just doesn't sound professional anyway. So maybe try that to see what it does, but don't actually use it, cause it probably ain't gonna do much for you.

Hairyjamie mentioned doubling and triple tracking of the vox. This is one of the big things done these days, especially in the chorus. Almost no songs you hear (at least in pop) on the radio these days will have a chorus with only one vocal take. They will often have 3 at the very least, sometimes even 10 or more. It beefs the sound up and gives the mixer stereo flexibility.

Try this. Sing/record your main vocal. Now sing it two more times. The second and third time, try to singing it with the first vocal in your headphones, and sing it as closely to the other one as possible, especially the 's' and 'p' type sounds. Now pan the first take in the centre and at lets say 0dB. Now pan your other two takes at 50%L and 50%R. And bring their level down to -10dB or something like that. Play around with all those settings, try 100%L and R, try -15dB, try -6dB, play around with it all. Add some reverb to all of this. Maybe try a delay.

So, the delay? Use sonitus for now, nice and easy. If you want it to have a stereo effect, don't give both left and right the same delay time. Make it different. Play around with it. Keep the delay less than 30ms to avoid noticeable echoes. for a stereo thickening purpose. Try delays of 19ms on left and 21ms on right. Try everything. Sometimes cutting the high frequency content of the delay part can result in a thicker sound that has less distinct doubling.

On that, try cutting the high frequency content a bit of the second and third vocal take. This can make it sound less like three takes, and more like one fat take, because it is generally the high frequency content that tends to distinguish the two separate takes. Cut out all 's' and 'p' sounds from the two takes if they are not perfectly in time with the first take. Or even better, try not to sing those sounds when you do the second and third takes.

Experiment!

Yeah I remembered the Hass delay point where the delays become audible is ~30ms, and just kinda said some numbers under it, didn't mean those numbers specifically. I generally try to increase the delay till it is just determinable as a delay, then back it off a bit - if I'm going for that effect. But yeah, comb filtering could become a problem at ~20ms, agreed. But with a delay with a low volume it may not be very substantial. Definately something to watch out for though!

I do like plate reverbs on the correct song. Don't really suit most of the stuff I am doing at the moment, but in the right situation, they can give you an amazing sound. Oh and early reflections, it's seriously all about early reflections. Waves Renaissance is great for dealing with them. Love it.