spacealf
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/05 15:38:24
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Who is laughing? Let's see according to the old Handbook of Electrical Tables and Formulas - wood cabinets (speakers say), the wood let out 15% of the sound, now concrete is really good at letting out (of a brick) 1% of the sound, and fiberglass (hard not installation type) lets out 2% of the sound. Cardboard box - ah - 99% of the sound and also lets in the same amount with all of those types of materials?? I should fiberglass the outside of my reflexion filter, but I guessing that some hard plastic is going to be denser than wood but not as good as concrete bricks?? I suppose I should stick the reflexion filter in bricks or fiberglass making sure that the outside noise does not get in or the sound of the mic does not get out.
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/05 15:57:26
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Another thing to consider is what polar pattern you've set on the mic. If you've already addressed this, my apologies. But with the NT1a (like it's bigger brother, the NT2000), rather than having switchable polar patterns, the uppermost knob allows the pattern to be varied continuously from omni, through the centre-detented cardioid position, to figure of eight. So depending on where you've set it, you're going to get differing levels of reflections entering the rear of the capsule thereby altering the subjective tone (for better or worse).
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Dave Modisette
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/05 16:31:10
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My last session I placed one of my 24 x 24 x 2" Fiberglas absorber panels on a music stand and then let the artist velcro his lyric sheet to it's carpet like cover. Knocked out a ton of reflections from the music stand as well as the room. I'd try stuffing some foam in the box. Experimenting never hurt anyone.
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spacealf
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/05 17:04:05
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After the hard material (say wood say) then comes the dampening material to absorb the reflections like foam, fiberglass installation type, or whatever.
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spacealf
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/05 17:10:31
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I suppose if you have an old speaker cabinet with the big speaker out of it, the mic can go in there and the head if enough room and walla - like a room for recording.
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mattplaysguitar
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/05 22:36:59
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spindlebox or have them stand in a corner, with the point right at their back. That would prevent direct reflections. Try it, but remember that bass buildup is bad in corners. You may create worse problems than what you are trying to solve. I have experimented with building a shield like this before. My design was useless. I also used the perforated metal construction (As I had seen it everywhere) and lined the insides with fibreglass. I now have six 1" thick 4'x2' acoustic panels which I just set up as a temporary vocal booth. It can give a little boxyness, but it's not too bad, and I highpass a fair bit of it out anyway and I'm very happy with the end result. Gives a super dead sound. Cheap to build too.
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spindlebox
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/06 01:56:19
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Good point Matt! Probably a wall behind would be better than. I'd love to see what you did out of curiosity if you have time to post. I'll be working on this tomorrow. Thanks to all who have provided insight on materials. I'm still not 100% sure what I'm going to do. A bit more research is warranted.
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mattplaysguitar
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/06 02:10:17
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I made it probably about 7 years ago so it is long gone in a big pile of rubbish! I had no idea about acoustics. I mimicked the design of the SE Reflection Filter as best I could (which wasn't very good). I got two sheets of perforated metal and bent them into a semi circle. First is one sheet of perforated metal on the outside. I then put a layer of fiberglass inside, followed by a layer of aluminium foil (they did it in the SE Filter) then another layer of fibreglass and finally the second perforated metal sheet. It was all held in place with screws and wooden blocks to maintain the correct spacing. I never worked out a way to mount it to my microphone stand so I think that's one big reason I didn't use it at all. I then moved onto blankets and mattresses against the wall, with a blanket hanging off the wall over my back and I sung inside that 'booth'. Had to be careful not to move too much or there would be noise from the blanket rubbing on my back. There was then a big storm at uni which got water throughout the radio and studio and all the acoustic gear. It was barely damaged and this was summer so dried quickly in the sun. The uni had to bin them due to bacterial growth risk. I snagged up 6 panels. I use them for any microphone recording and make a booth. The company I now work for has an acoustics testing section so there is a lot of stuff coming through every now and then. I need to talk to some people and see if I can score some free dense insulation to make some more panels with some time!
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timidi
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/06 07:54:24
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Love it. Maybe I missed it but, do you have any room treatment in your room? And, How big is your room? And, How far away from the mic were you? Your box sure made a big difference. Look forward to seeing/hearing the revised edition:)
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spindlebox
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/08 12:47:02
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Hey everyone, sorry for the late reply here. So I'm still in the experimental stage, and I really like SPACEALF's suggestion in post #35 about the speaker cabinet. Yesterday, we did some more vocals for a client, and I used this box with OC 703 (2" thick) on the very back behind the mic. WOW. It totally got rid of that boxiness I was getting before and the vocals sound INCREDIBLY clean. So, I may try the speaker design, lined with OC 703 (which I have tons of scraps laying around off), and then for cosmetics line it with some black breathable fabric (which I have leftover from my trap building) I just need to figure out a way to mount it to a mic stand. Of course, I need to get a speaker that is light enough to do so. "A Hunting We will Go" .... PS, TIMIDI: Yes, I have treatment in my room, it is rather big, but I have acoustic foam lining the walls and ceiling (not totally covered as I don't want a totally dead room.) You may be able to catch glimpses of it in the pics I posted.
post edited by spindlebox - 2012/04/08 12:49:18
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spacealf
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/08 13:06:19
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Well, that may just be something to try, don't know if it will sound any good (speaker cabinet surrounding mic inside of it without speaker in it of course and of course better installation on the inside of it.) ?? It does separate the mic from the total room though I suppose, perhaps too much though, hard to tell without messing around and fooling around with it.
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Philip
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/08 14:04:59
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You still might line it with an inch of fiberglass #703 (per that other thread) ...
post edited by Philip - 2012/04/08 14:07:09
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spindlebox
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/08 14:17:46
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SPACEALF AND PHILIP. Yes, the Intention is to completely line the inside of it with 703.
I actually rummaging around found an old wooden wine box of mine, perfect shape and size! The wood is about a half-inch thick, and it is made of pine. Can't weigh more than 5# which is nice! It also looks nice which is a bonus.
I'm running down to the hardware store to find a drill that will perfectly allow me to drill a hole to fit my straight mic stand. I have some ideas of how to hold it there using these things in the plumbing department.
I will take pix. Once I'm in mid-assembly. Won't be long now!
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spindlebox
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/08 15:47:37
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spindlebox
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/08 15:50:05
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So you can see where I'm going with it. I decided against the 703 because all I have is 2" stuff and it would have been WAYY crowded in there. So, I'm going to cover all inside surfaces with the foam and see what happens!! This design is also cool because I can adjust the height of the microphone inside the box and of course, the whole height of the microphone, etc. It is incredibly light. I need to pick up some more foam so I'll post more pics when it's done, along with audio samples.
post edited by spindlebox - 2012/04/08 15:53:00
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Philip
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/08 17:32:33
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I used foam in mine (a clumsey rig with Ethan Winer's $300 'Portable Vocal Booth') ... on the upper and lower surface) and things got pretty anechoic, indeed. Please let me know what tests work out best ... as you finalize this. (Warning: personally, I'd not even consider shoving 2+ mics in there ... precise placement would be awkward ... comb-filtering will possibly manifest) ... your current scheme seems ideal, IMHO)
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mattplaysguitar
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/08 19:56:06
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I'd be still concerned for mid level boxiness in here. It could be difficult to hear, but you MAY get some resonance from the box at certain frequencies. Would be interested to set a speaker up in front of it and hit it with a sine sweep and listen for anything weird going on. The size of this box means that if there IS some resonance, it'll be fairly high. Ran a quick room mode calc on it. Be wary of the 300-500Hz region. On the other hand, it may not be noticeable. Time will tell. Just something to be wary of and listen for. I would personally move to actually make the unit more breathable. If it doesn't have enough insulation to hit the lower frequencies, boxing it up like that might contain new ones from your voice. Thus creating more problems. Conversely, you may block out the low/mid room frequencies as well and they may be more significant. In an ideal world, it's probably a matter of finding the right balance. I'd take a guess that those perforated holes in the commercially available units are there for that purpose. I'll be interested to hear how it all goes.
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bandontherun19
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/08 22:33:19
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Here's what I did to help with my reflections? Seems to work pretty well... (Don't laugh.)
post edited by bandontherun19 - 2012/04/08 22:39:26
All you need is love, just ask the Beatles? ----------
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bandontherun19
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/08 22:46:32
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Or this one for a more panaramic effect? But again, I find that it helps to reduce reflections. Again, no laughing please.
All you need is love, just ask the Beatles? ----------
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spindlebox
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/09 18:49:03
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HAHHHHHHHHHH HAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH HAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH (sorry, that was too easy)
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batsbrew
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/09 18:59:58
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you want to avoid 90 degree angles that are opposite each other.
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spindlebox
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/09 19:01:38
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timidi
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/09 20:07:57
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well done. is it adjustable at all.
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spindlebox
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Re:Reflexion Filter - DON'T LAUGH!!!
2012/04/09 20:32:43
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Timidi, Yes, it is on a standard mic stand, and I can swap out mics with ease, as well as move the mic forward (up / down) to the degree of my choice.
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